Player Discussion Chris Kreider

[DumpnChase12]

Hey guys ! I first want to start off by saying I am far from being an expert on salary cap, trades, etc.... I know we need space to sign our young players, but how is trading Kreider going to help with that ? If we trade him and get picks and 1 established good player, don't we still have to pay that new player good money ? Money that we could of used to keep Kreider ? I can understand if we trade him for picks only and use that money to sign our other players, but everyone is like "oh his value is getting higher now" which sounds like they want to get more than just picks for him. Sorry if this is a dumb question, I just want to understand why we have to trade Kreider.
Thanks

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

They don’t. He’s going to be a really tough guy to replace with all he brings to a lineup. You disagree? And they look awful when he’s not in the lineup.

they’ve looked awful for long stretches with him in the lineup this year too.

 

[ElLeetch]

Hey guys ! I first want to start off by saying I am far from being an expert on salary cap, trades, etc.... I know we need space to sign our young players, but how is trading Kreider going to help with that ? If we trade him and get picks and 1 established good player, don't we still have to pay that new player good money ? Money that we could of used to keep Kreider ? I can understand if we trade him for picks only and use that money to sign our other players, but everyone is like "oh his value is getting higher now" which sounds like they want to get more than just picks for him. Sorry if this is a dumb question, I just want to understand why we have to trade Kreider.
Thanks

I doubt the player we would get in return would be anywhere near the 7M that kreider is looking for. The 'player' in the "Pick+prospect+player" package will likely be a 3rd-ish liner player, only making 2-3M.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

they’ve looked awful for long stretches with him in the lineup this year too.

look, trade or no trade if you can’t even acknowledge that he makes the lineup better, you’re just not being honest. And you’re gonna get your wish, he’s getting traded. You’ll have your late 1st round pick and ok prospect and you can finally be happy.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

They don’t. He’s going to be a really tough guy to replace with all he brings to a lineup. You disagree? And they look awful when he’s not in the lineup.

This logic only makes sense if you think Kreider will have the same impact in 2020-2026 as he had in 2014-2020. We aren't talking about signing a 23-year old Kreider.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

look, trade or no trade if you can’t even acknowledge that he makes the lineup better, you’re just not being honest. And you’re gonna get your wish, he’s getting traded. You’ll have your late 1st round pick and ok prospect and you can finally be happy.

They’re better when he’s in and playing well, 100%

but he isn’t the driving force behind their success. He’s a part of it, but not as big of a part as you’re making it sound.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

This logic only makes sense if you think Kreider will have the same impact in 2020-2026 as he had in 2014-2020. We aren't talking about signing a 23-year old Kreider.

I do. I said it repeatedly. You can disagree, that’s cool.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

They’re better when he’s in and playing well, 100%

but he isn’t the driving force behind their success. He’s a part of it, but not as big of a part as you’re making it sound.

laughable.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

I do. I said it repeatedly. You can disagree, that’s cool.

I will go one step further then.

We aren't getting Jan 2020-Feb 2020 Chris Kreider on the next deal. Even if we get Chris Kreider the way he plays now, on a season-to-season basis, that's Chris Kreider who goes missing for 25 games a season and you think that guy will replace the Kreider we've been seeing for the last 2 months? If Kreider played a full season the way he has the last 2 months, we're not even having this conversation and he's locked up for 8m a year for 7 years.

But recency bias has people thinking Kreider is this beast he has been for 2 months in an 8-year career

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

laughable.

Yes, acting as if hes irreplaceable and so good that you're willing to basically hand him what ever he is asking for IS laughable.

FWIW, I'm 100000% on board with keeping him at the right term. That doesn't look likely and I'm not handing him a contract that will f*** us in 4-5-6 years just because he's doing some pretty great things right now. That is not likely to continue that far into the future.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Yes, acting as if hes irreplaceable and so good that you're willing to basically hand him what ever he is asking for IS laughable.

FWIW, I'm 100000% on board with keeping him at the right term. That doesn't look likely and I'm not handing him a contract that will f*ck us in 4-5-6 years just because he's doing some pretty great things right now. That is not likely to continue that far into the future.

Just so everyone understands my POV:

What I want is Kreider signed 4y/6.5m AAV. If that isn't possible, I want Kreider traded at the deadline. What I really do not want is him walking in July, or us signing him for 7 years.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Just so everyone understands my POV:

What I want is Kreider signed 4y/6.5m AAV. If that isn't possible, I want Kreider traded at the deadline. What I really do not want is him walking in July, or us signing him for 7 years.

Im okay with 5x7. I'd even up the AAV to keep the term at 5.

Im not game with anything beyond that. The term bothers me more than the money - which for the purposes of this team is really only an issue in the very immediate future.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Im okay with 5x7. I'd even up the AAV to keep the term at 5.

Im not game with anything beyond that. The term bothers me more than the money - which for the purposes of this team is really only an issue in the very immediate future.

5 years is the absolute max I'd go with, but I have a feeling Kreider is asking for 7 years. Which is his right, but I really hope it's with another team in that case

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

5 years is the absolute max I'd go with, but I have a feeling Kreider is asking for 7 years. Which is his right, but I really hope it's with another team in that case

Me too.

 

[NYRangers0723]

look, trade or no trade if you can’t even acknowledge that he makes the lineup better, you’re just not being honest. And you’re gonna get your wish, he’s getting traded. You’ll have your late 1st round pick and ok prospect and you can finally be happy.

This. It’s extremely hard for any player to play that style and be dominant every single game...they would wear themselves out. Like I’ve always said some wanted him to be a superstar and anything less is a disappointment in their eyes which is ridiculous but some have admitted that lol

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

I will go one step further then.

We aren't getting Jan 2020-Feb 2020 Chris Kreider on the next deal. Even if we get Chris Kreider the way he plays now, on a season-to-season basis, that's Chris Kreider who goes missing for 25 games a season and you think that guy will replace the Kreider we've been seeing for the last 2 months? If Kreider played a full season the way he has the last 2 months, we're not even having this conversation and he's locked up for 8m a year for 7 years.

But recency bias has people thinking Kreider is this beast he has been for 2 months in an 8-year career

Yo man, you keep beating the same drum. There's no recency bias. Some people have the ability to look past stats and see how a player can positively impact a game even if they don't show up on the score sheet. Yes, he's streaky but so is every player not named Crosby or McDavid. This disappearing act nonsense is such a lazy talking point. He is what he is a 27ish goal guy a year, he does it every year, and that's good enough for me when you consider everything else he brings to the table. Not good enough for you? Again, cool. But stop bringing up the same lazy twitter talking points.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Yes, acting as if hes irreplaceable and so good that you're willing to basically hand him what ever he is asking for IS laughable.

FWIW, I'm 100000% on board with keeping him at the right term. That doesn't look likely and I'm not handing him a contract that will f*ck us in 4-5-6 years just because he's doing some pretty great things right now. That is not likely to continue that far into the future.

Right now, he's irreplaceable to this team. They suck without him in the lineup. And that's not going to change next season when he's gone. I don't care what prospect or late first round pick you bring in. He's every bit as important to the team than Panarin and Zib are right now.

 

[NYRangers0723]

Right now, he's irreplaceable to this team. The suck without him in the lineup. And that's not going to change next season when he's gone. I don't care what prospect or late first round pick you bring in. He's every bit as important to the team than Panarin and Zib are right now

.

Agreed. Look I understand there are those who want him gone no ands ifs or but’s about which is their right. However at least be objective. He is extremely hard to replace that’s just a fact

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Agreed. Look I understand there are those who want him gone no ands ifs or but’s about which is their right. However at least be objective. He is extremely hard to replace that’s just a fact

Good luck with that, lol. It's all about picks and prospects here. Always someone better than what they currently have. Like, move Chytil to wing because we definitely need a better 2C.

 

[NYRangers0723]

Good luck with that, lol. It's all about picks and prospects here. Always someone better than what they currently have. Like, move Chytil to wing because we definitely need a better 2C.

Look I wanted to rebuild in 2016 before anyone but we can’t keep doing this ever year like the Buffalo Sabres lol

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Look I wanted to rebuild in 2016 before anyone but we can’t keep doing this ever year like the Buffalo Sabres lol

There's no scientific formula for this stuff. This time last year things were much different. Then they lucked into Kakko, signed Panarin and got Trouba. Anyone who thinks this team isn't going to try to win as soon as possible is out to lunch.

 

[will1066]

This logic only makes sense if you think Kreider will have the same impact in 2020-2026 as he had in 2014-2020. We aren't talking about signing a 23-year old Kreider.

The bigger question is, how will the TDL affect your gf's Rangers nesting doll?

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

Look I wanted to rebuild in 2016 before anyone but we can’t keep doing this ever year like the Buffalo Sabres lol

See you lose all credibility when you say shit like "we're going to become the Sabres"

The Rangers will never be the Buffalo Sabres

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Right now, he's irreplaceable to this team. They suck without him in the lineup. And that's not going to change next season when he's gone. I don't care what prospect or late first round pick you bring in. He's every bit as important to the team than Panarin and Zib are right now.

You are strawmanning the hell out of this and also making the assumption that everything with this team remains status quo.

If everyone on this team remained here and their current level of play was static, then yeah you have a point. But it won't play out that way, with or without Kreider.

Whether you like it or not, if this team is going to get to contender status, it will be on the backs of Kakko/Chytil/Fox/etc. If those guys don't become good enough to carry this team, we're f***ed.

In terms of current overall team importance, I'd probably put him at #5 behind Zib, Panarin, Fox and DeAngelo. You never, ever, EVER let "right now" influence what would likely be a 6-7 year commitment. We've been there done that and the results were not good.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

You are strawmanning the hell out of this and also making the assumption that everything with this team remains status quo.

If everyone on this team remained here and their current level of play was static, then yeah you have a point. But it won't play out that way, with or without Kreider.

Whether you like it or not, if this team is going to get to contender status, it will be on the backs of Kakko/Chytil/Fox/etc. If those guys don't become good enough to carry this team, we're f*cked.

In terms of current overall team importance, I'd probably put him at #5 behind Zib, Panarin, Fox and DeAngelo. You never, ever, EVER let "right now" influence what would likely be a 6-7 year commitment. We've been there done that and the results were not good.

What strawman? They're worse without him. This isn't even a debate. Unless you wanna spin some fantasy of them using all theez assets to get some kid his current team has no intention of trading.

And I love how you leave guys like Panarin, Zib and Trouba off your list of backs that are gonna carry the team. I wonder why? Actually, I don't. It's obvious.