One Winged Angel
You Can't Escape
Hey, you’re digging up a month old post, my friend. You caught me at a time where I was reminded of a lot of horrible misfortune as a Ranger fan.
Player Discussion Chris Kreider: Part III
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Hey, you’re digging up a month old post, my friend. You caught me at a time where I was reminded of a lot of horrible misfortune as a Ranger fan.
One Winged Angel
You Can't Escape
The Gartner and Amonte trades hurt the worst. Tikkanen was a vital part and I’m not trying to sell Matteau’s 2 OT winners in the ECF short, but before those trades, the Rangers had smacked the Devils around all season to the tune of 5-0 outscoring them 20-8. I really think that they could have won the cup without those two deals.
You forgot trading Marchant for McTavish and shipping out Mark Tinordi. Let's add shipping out Kris King & Tie Domi
One Winged Angel
You Can't Escape
Everyone mentions that trade but in hindsight, losing on Todd Marchant wasn’t a huge deal to me.
He went on to be an excellent third line center for a long time. The Rangers struggled to find good third line players for a long time.
One Winged Angel
You Can't Escape
Yeah but that’s an easier pill to swallow than Amonte who from 96-01 scored 30+ goals each year including 3 seasons in which he cracked the 40 goal mark and all of his 40 goal seasons were after Roenick was traded for Zhamnov.
Gartner had 2 more 30 goal seasons in 96 and 97.
.
Not debating that. It is highly probable that Smith traded multiple Cups for '94. That said, greatest moment of my fandom was Craig Mac taking that final face off.
One Winged Angel
You Can't Escape
You and I both. That was amazing. Be able to shove it in every Islander fan’s face that chanted 1940 over and over again to me was a weight off my shoulders. I just want one in my prime party years before I can’t celebrate it like would want to.
Lion Hound
Pornhub Enthusiast
Kinda tired of defending Kreider all the time. Very surprised at many of the opinions here on HF. To me, it's very simple.
This team is rebuilding. Currently, they pretty much suck. With that there is always ome line always competes hard. It's whatever line #20 is on. Petrified of how ugly and boring this squad would appear w/out him.
This team is rebuilding. Currently, they pretty much suck. With that there is always ome line always competes hard. It's whatever line #20 is on. Petrified of how ugly and boring this squad would appear w/out him.
Ghost of jas
Unsatisfied
E-Train
Registered User
It was actually 6-0, out scoring them 24-9. I was at the sixth win at the Meadowlands.
One Winged Angel
You Can't Escape
I stated it was 5-0 before the trades. I purposely left out the 6th game because it was after the trades. They played 5 against the Devils before the deadline, the 6th was after.
E-Train
Registered User
Ok. Must’ve missed it. In any event, they out scored them 20-7 in the first 5.
Machinehead
HFNYR MVP
Kreider is the mix of character and talent that everyone can get behind.
For a guy painted as a meathead when he was first coming up (I think most of this was just stereotyping his athleticism) he's turned out to be highly intelligent, a leader, a great teammate, and all-around good guy.
Ghost of jas
Unsatisfied
And he should be here going forward. I’m willing to gamble on a long-term deal to keep him here for when the rebuild is finished. He anchors a core of wingers that includes Chytil and Kravtsov.
As am I. Willing to give him and Zbad contracts that keep them here on the other side of the redeal.
It is amazing to me sometimes. People complain that the franchise does not develop good forwards and then they can't wait to get rid of Kreider. People complain that there isn't an elite level type of center, and then can't wait to get rid of Zbad or move him to wing. These two players are legit top liners who would be better if they were surrounded by better talent, which is what Gorton & Co are trying to do. They can be here for the long haul and shield younger players from roles that they are not ready for nor should be in when first coming into the league.
Edge
Kris King's Ghost
Both Kreider and Zibanejad have potential roles here on the other side --- even if they get surpassed by other talent at some point (which isn't a bad thing).
Even if we do everything right, and everything falls into place, it's near impossible to have every single key position filled just through the draft. And the reality is that the free agents we would sign several years from now, are not going to be 23 and 24 years old. Most likely, they are going to be close to the same age as Kreider and Zibanejad anyway.
Even if we do everything right, and everything falls into place, it's near impossible to have every single key position filled just through the draft. And the reality is that the free agents we would sign several years from now, are not going to be 23 and 24 years old. Most likely, they are going to be close to the same age as Kreider and Zibanejad anyway.
NYRFANMANI
Department of Rempe Safety Management
The KZ combo is one missing piece away from going full on juggernaut. Like a big PWF winger like Kreider, with much better finish though ... hnng
Listen, I get the trade talk, Kreider is a valuable asset on the market and could haul in quite a bit. We're in a rebuild after all.
BUT he is pretty much (with Hank and Staal ... and Zucc) the heart and soul. An original piece to our core. Homegrown. A true Ranger.
He's not simply an asset in the market value sense, he's got cultural value to this team. Identity. No way in hell he should be traded.
We need these veteran presences in the future, much more so if they were with the club for so long.
Listen, I get the trade talk, Kreider is a valuable asset on the market and could haul in quite a bit. We're in a rebuild after all.
BUT he is pretty much (with Hank and Staal ... and Zucc) the heart and soul. An original piece to our core. Homegrown. A true Ranger.
He's not simply an asset in the market value sense, he's got cultural value to this team. Identity. No way in hell he should be traded.
We need these veteran presences in the future, much more so if they were with the club for so long.
haveandare
Registered User
I totally agree and it irks me to no end when people say we should trade these pieces and can sign older UFA's to help the kids come up.
There's value in having someone who has actually come through the organization be with the younger players. Both because it shows that the organization is loyal to players who do what everyone wants of them and keep improving over and over and because it gives the young guys a guy who knows the city in and out, knows the organization in an out, and can relate to coming up in the same exact situation.
As far as I'm concerned, pretty much any of the olderish players can go except Kreider and Mika. They're both model players with great career arcs so far. Hank too obviously but who knows how many more years he has.
Machinehead
HFNYR MVP
I'm so upset today.
You know, maybe it'll be great if he gets traded because it's so exhausting constantly defending this player.
Last night was a bad play, and he's accountable for that. But people think he's a dirty player. People thought that before last night. Where does that come from? Never been suspended. Somebody said on Twitter last night "Chris Kreider and injuring people, name a more iconic duo." And I was like "ok, let me start you off with Carey Price and let's see the rest of the list." I'm still waiting on that reply.
I know there was no ill-intent on that play. I know he didn't mean for that to happen. I know that because I know it. People are gonna say "oh, well you can't psycho-analyze the player." The f*** I can't. I've observed him at his occupation for nine years, I know who he is.
DeAngelo would do that. Lemieux would do that. Kreider wouldn't do that.
What's astounding to me is that 30 fanbases think this guy is a murderer and the one fanbase that watches him tells me he's too soft, he's too nice, he doesn't hit enough, he's not engaged enough, he's not enough of a physical threat. It's a direct contradiction. It's amazing what happens to this man.
Regarding that one fanbase, I'll never understand the expectations they put on this guy. He's not an offensive superstar. He's never going to put up silly numbers. He never has at any level. I was thrilled he started out the year pacing for 40 and if he hit 40, it would have been one of my great experiences as a Rangers fan. If it ends up being about 28, I would have signed up for that before the season. He is what he is and I don't understand why most Rangers fans can't just be ok with that. He's a very good player.
People will bring up the contract and say "well, he's good but he's not worth that UFA price tag." Look, I spend a lot of time on this forum. You picked on him when he was making 4 million and you picked on him when he was on his ELC. The contract thing would be a fair argument, but don't f***ing lie to my face. You know who you are.
28 goals and 53 points or thereabout on a player that's a good 200 foot player, one of the better play-drivers in league, and by all accounts an outstanding teammate should be unanimously revered by the fanbase, not one of its more polarizing.
As for the people who think he's some vicious, dirty player, that's just the nerds and Al Bundy's of the world who never got over the high school jock thing (and I say that as a nerd). As for Rangers fans, the problem isn't Kreider, the problem is the Rangers. Guys like Wilson, Oshie, Guentzel, etc are loved by their fanbases because they do their thing (which is be very good players) and they have Ovechkin, Backstrom, Crosby, and Malkin to score every f***ing night. Here, Kreider is the main event, and it's the Rangers' inability to attain elite talent that forced him into that. THAT'S NOT HIS FAULT. And Zibanejad is next. On pace for 77 points. When he doesn't hit 77 every year -and I don't think he will because he's a good center, not a franchise center- he's going to get crucified.
Hopefully with this rebuild, we bring in the marquee talent we've lacked and guys like Kreider can play the roles they belong in, and get the respect they deserve.
I know I shouldn't worry about what people say, but I'm human. These guys become part of your lives, and don't ever tell me it's just a game. And I'm no saint here either. I know Girardi was part of people's lives here and I upset some people, and that's on me. But the thing is, even Girardi's biggest fans never expected him to post 55 points and be in the Norris discussion. I don't understand why the expectations for Kreider are above what he was ever capable of going back to college and before college.
You know, maybe it'll be great if he gets traded because it's so exhausting constantly defending this player.
Last night was a bad play, and he's accountable for that. But people think he's a dirty player. People thought that before last night. Where does that come from? Never been suspended. Somebody said on Twitter last night "Chris Kreider and injuring people, name a more iconic duo." And I was like "ok, let me start you off with Carey Price and let's see the rest of the list." I'm still waiting on that reply.
I know there was no ill-intent on that play. I know he didn't mean for that to happen. I know that because I know it. People are gonna say "oh, well you can't psycho-analyze the player." The f*** I can't. I've observed him at his occupation for nine years, I know who he is.
DeAngelo would do that. Lemieux would do that. Kreider wouldn't do that.
What's astounding to me is that 30 fanbases think this guy is a murderer and the one fanbase that watches him tells me he's too soft, he's too nice, he doesn't hit enough, he's not engaged enough, he's not enough of a physical threat. It's a direct contradiction. It's amazing what happens to this man.
Regarding that one fanbase, I'll never understand the expectations they put on this guy. He's not an offensive superstar. He's never going to put up silly numbers. He never has at any level. I was thrilled he started out the year pacing for 40 and if he hit 40, it would have been one of my great experiences as a Rangers fan. If it ends up being about 28, I would have signed up for that before the season. He is what he is and I don't understand why most Rangers fans can't just be ok with that. He's a very good player.
People will bring up the contract and say "well, he's good but he's not worth that UFA price tag." Look, I spend a lot of time on this forum. You picked on him when he was making 4 million and you picked on him when he was on his ELC. The contract thing would be a fair argument, but don't f***ing lie to my face. You know who you are.
28 goals and 53 points or thereabout on a player that's a good 200 foot player, one of the better play-drivers in league, and by all accounts an outstanding teammate should be unanimously revered by the fanbase, not one of its more polarizing.
As for the people who think he's some vicious, dirty player, that's just the nerds and Al Bundy's of the world who never got over the high school jock thing (and I say that as a nerd). As for Rangers fans, the problem isn't Kreider, the problem is the Rangers. Guys like Wilson, Oshie, Guentzel, etc are loved by their fanbases because they do their thing (which is be very good players) and they have Ovechkin, Backstrom, Crosby, and Malkin to score every f***ing night. Here, Kreider is the main event, and it's the Rangers' inability to attain elite talent that forced him into that. THAT'S NOT HIS FAULT. And Zibanejad is next. On pace for 77 points. When he doesn't hit 77 every year -and I don't think he will because he's a good center, not a franchise center- he's going to get crucified.
Hopefully with this rebuild, we bring in the marquee talent we've lacked and guys like Kreider can play the roles they belong in, and get the respect they deserve.
I know I shouldn't worry about what people say, but I'm human. These guys become part of your lives, and don't ever tell me it's just a game. And I'm no saint here either. I know Girardi was part of people's lives here and I upset some people, and that's on me. But the thing is, even Girardi's biggest fans never expected him to post 55 points and be in the Norris discussion. I don't understand why the expectations for Kreider are above what he was ever capable of going back to college and before college.
I defended him also dude. Said will have words with anyone who thinks he is dirty. No has replied to me but likely got lost in the thread. He made a reckless stupid play. It happens. I want this guy extended even if he has been in a slump. The team is tanking now there is not much to be excited about.
I got suspended and nearly banned for defending Callahan several years ago. I still defend him but not nearly as much, because I’ve learned not to care as much from what some people have to say on this forum, and take it like a grain of salt especially from other fan bases.
Just saying I know how you feel. Sure it’s about the team first but having a favorite player or two is what makes the game more exciting.
Machinehead
HFNYR MVP
I had my differences with Callahan, but he got forced into the same thing. Middle six player that became the face of a team. Not easy.
Ghost of jas
Unsatisfied
I’m right there with you. It’s exhausting. And, like you, I’ve reached the point where, fine trade him because I don’t have the energy anymore. And, then, these same fans will move on their next target, and the whole cycle repeats itself. We’ll be having this conversation with everyone from Chytil to Kravtsov to whomever we pick in the next two drafts. It’s insufferable.
Machinehead
HFNYR MVP
Oh Chytil is dead in the water. Poor Chytil.
I mean, Kravtsov might just be so good that there's no argument, and I'm hoping I'm right on that.
I see Chytil being a very, very good player who gives you about 30 and 55 with a good all-around game, similar to Kreider, but because of his size and ability, there's always going to be a group of fans who think he's Eric Lindros for some reason.
Ghost of jas
Unsatisfied
Your only problem in that regard, from my vantage point, was elevating the player (in this case, Callahan) over the team. We all have our favorites, but, players come and go. It’s going to suck to see Kreider get traded, just like it was McDonagh and Stepan, but, you move on. It’s good to see you back in a better light.
In other words, never go full Webster.
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