Chris Chelios - What's his legacy in Montreal?

[PaulD]

Even though we won a cup in '93... the Chelios trade was the beginning of the end for me.

Anytime the name of an elite player on the back is perceived to be challenging the status of the crest on the front, they have to go. Add in the cost cutting of the late 90s and the quite frankly poisonous politics and here we are.

Yes. Standards so lowered......Bergevin qualified.

 

[PaulD]

My hockey watching experience starts in the mid to late 80's so I'm not really qualified to rank any of the 70's guys objectively. FWIW my dad( who started watching the Habs in the very early 60's ) always had Lapointe somewhat below the other 2 and Savard on top as the cement that held everything else together.

Majority would agree with your dad on that.

To pick an order for debate it is fun. Worth noting however, the difference in value between the three was not that significant . Because they were all on one team debates of who was number 1 and 2 and 3 of the "big three " began.

On any given night any one of them was the best Dman in the team.......as often as the other.

 

[PaulD]

I would put Lapointe ahead of him and to be completely honest I was never a big fan of Chelios when he played here. His career after leaving surprised the hell out of me. Having said that, I still think Lapointe was a better defenseman.

Agree on Lapoint.

But Chellys career after leaving did not surprise me one bit.

I thought he was the best player on the Canadiens when they dealt him.

 

[Scriptor]

CHelios legacy in MON:

Hockey player - Great
Human being - Shitty

Leaving MON was the best thing that could happen to him on a personal level. If you knew the MON nightlife scene when CHelios was in MON...

 

[THE HOFF]

Yes, as a Habs. I think Subban peaked just as high as Chelios did (Higher ? Unsure if you can call Chelios the best Dman on the planet at any point in his career, meanwhile Subban clearly was from 14 to 16, though the Karlsson injury played a big part in that.)


Id also slot in Coffey, Keith and Karlsson ahead of Chelios.

The biggest omition though, is Chris Pronger.

nah its common sense, how can someone say subban peaked higher than chelios. ridiculous. its just insanity. I point to the longevity of his career to dismiss what people ''said he did'' earlier in his career. in a meantime, he still had a ring so .... hard to argue subban had done more for the franchise.Eye catching, but never as good as chelios.

 

[MasterDecoy]

That hit legit top 5 dirtiest I’ve ever seen. One of my favorite players growing up. A complete animal.

 

[Frenchy]

Please guys , dont make any libelous comments.

Thank you

 

[cphabs]

How not to make a trade...

 

[Istvan]

I loved the guy. Always came to play. Fearless.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Here are their Norris records (Top 10 only):

Chelios: 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 3, 4, 6, 6, 6, 6, 8
Karlsson: 1, 1, 2, 2, 7
Keith: 1, 1, 4, 6, 6, 7, 9
Subban: 1, 3, 3
Pronger: 1, 3, 3, 3, 4, 5, 5, 7, 8
Coffey: 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 3, 4, 5, 5, 5, 5, 7, 7, 9

Coffey is the only one in the same ballpark, but Coffey is Coffey. A huge defensive question mark.

I don't know... it just seemed that there were some "old school guys" who wanted to take Coffey down a peg or two. He was on the verge of breaking Orr's record and got benched by Sather. He lost two Norrises to Rod Langway who - with all due respect - had zero business winning over Coffey. Just seemed like the critics rallied around one guy who was defensively sound so they could vote for him instead. 'Cause there was no way any other blueliner came close to Coffey's numbers.

I don't think Coffey was nearly that bad defensively and he was absolutely incredible offensively.

Very different blueliner than Chelios obviously. But I certainly think Coffey deserves - at a minimum -consideration in the top ten. He really should have five Norrises to his credit, not three.

 

[BenchBrawl]

I don't know... it just seemed that there were some "old school guys" who wanted to take Coffey down a peg or two. He was on the verge of breaking Orr's record and got benched by Sather. He lost two Norrises to Rod Langway who - with all due respect - had zero business winning over Coffey. Just seemed like the critics rallied around one guy who was defensively sound so they could vote for him instead. 'Cause there was no way any other blueliner came close to Coffey's numbers.

I don't think Coffey was nearly that bad defensively and he was absolutely incredible offensively.

Very different blueliner than Chelios obviously. But I certainly think Coffey deserves - at a minimum -consideration in the top ten. He really should have five Norrises to his credit, not three.

Lots of defensemen deserve consideration for the Top 10: Sprague Cleghorn, Brad Park, Chris Chelios, King Clancy, Paul Coffey, Pierre Pilote, a few others.

I have no problem with Coffey being considered.

Orr, Harvey, Bourque, Shore, Potvin, Lidstrom, Kelly, Robinson and Fetisov all deserve to be ranked over the guys I listed above IMO. That's 9 defensemen. Only one spot left for a very tough group of competitors.

 

[Cobra Commander]

Best Greekster to ever play the game, OPA!

 

[Spearmint Rhino]

Chelios sits behind Robinson as my favourite Habs d-man of my generation. Still a shame we dealt him away for Savard who was on the decline and becoming injury prone. Another one to add to the list of why putting language and character over Ws has created an un-level playing field

 

[PaulD]

I don't know... it just seemed that there were some "old school guys" who wanted to take Coffey down a peg or two. He was on the verge of breaking Orr's record and got benched by Sather. He lost two Norrises to Rod Langway who - with all due respect - had zero business winning over Coffey. Just seemed like the critics rallied around one guy who was defensively sound so they could vote for him instead. 'Cause there was no way any other blueliner came close to Coffey's numbers.

I don't think Coffey was nearly that bad defensively and he was absolutely incredible offensively.

Very different blueliner than Chelios obviously. But I certainly think Coffey deserves - at a minimum -consideration in the top ten. He really should have five Norrises to his credit, not three.

Only so many trophies to go around.

Coffee was great , played on a team where he was a 4th forward whenever he wanted to be.

 

[PaulD]

Lots of defensemen deserve consideration for the Top 10: Sprague Cleghorn, Brad Park, Chris Chelios, King Clancy, Paul Coffey, Pierre Pilote, a few others.

I have no problem with Coffey being considered.

Orr, Harvey, Bourque, Shore, Potvin, Lidstrom, Kelly, Robinson and Fetisov all deserve to be ranked over the guys I listed above IMO. That's 9 defensemen. Only one spot left for a very tough group of competitors.

of those contenders you listed

Park
Chelly
Coffey

never saw the others play

 

[Forsead]

Lots of defensemen deserve consideration for the Top 10: Sprague Cleghorn, Brad Park, Chris Chelios, King Clancy, Paul Coffey, Pierre Pilote, a few others.

I have no problem with Coffey being considered.

Orr, Harvey, Bourque, Shore, Potvin, Lidstrom, Kelly, Robinson and Fetisov all deserve to be ranked over the guys I listed above IMO. That's 9 defensemen. Only one spot left for a very tough group of competitors.

I would also add to the mix Salming, MacInnis, Leetch, Niedermayer and Stevens.

 

[BenchBrawl]

I would also add to the mix Salming, MacInnis, Leetch, Niedermayer and Stevens.

Not me. Great defensemen, but not at the Top 10 level.

A few thoughts:

Niedermayer peaked for like 2-3 years max. Not enough. In NJ he wasn't the dman he was in Anaheim.

Leetch also great peak but little maturation and longevity. His 1994 run was great, but you cannot credit that level of play to his entire career.

MacInnis was overrated defensively. Not bad, but far from a Top 10 defenseman. Arguably greatest slapshot of all-time, OK. But still, early on in Calgary McCrimmon was the real defensive defenseman on that team. Afterward he played with Pronger. Not saying he was a product of them, but he was overrated defensively until the end of his career when he became solid.

Stevens poor skater relative to how good he was as a player. Great leader, great defensive defenseman, but couldn't combine offense with defense. Splitted his career in two focussing on one or the other. Got lucky to play in front of Brodeur and for Jacques Lemaire to some extent, but he capitalized on the opportunity and bought into the system, sacrificing his offense. Credit to him, but not a Top 10 defenseman. Never won a Norris too, even though he came close.

Salming not even close. Among his onctemporaries, he was almost invariably ranked below Robinson and Potvin in Norris voting, and I suspect Serge Savard was a better defenseman despite Salming having a better Norris record. Savard was a big game player.

Those guys are more like in the 20-30 range. All-time is a long time (in hockey, about 130 years).