CHL/NCAA

[OHL4Life]

i dont know how they are doing it, but i think most of the ontario citizens going to d1 programs are recieving money. im sure its legal, just not sure how. ill find out this summer probably

 

[Corso]

But what does that mean to the other programs? Will some fall off? Do they need to keep the other programs to be eligible to play football? How does it work?

Some programs at some institutions will unfortunately be terminated. There is a lot of concern over non revenue generating Olympic sports.
Hockey, overall, will be fine but do not expect to many 6 figure payouts to athletes. The upper band for the very top programs will be in the 400-700k range for the team.

 

[Altek]

Yesterday the “House Settlement” has passed which means schools can only pay 22 million dollars to their athletes and NIL deals will have to go to a 3rd party arbitrator where they have to deem its fair valais. So the days of paying a player for his NIL but not using his NIL is gone.

To give you an idea from 22 million 75% will go to Football 15% to men’s basketball 5% to women’s basketball and the remaining 5% to the rest of the sports baseball, hockey, lacrosse etc. The math is 1.1 million for the rest. How can a school like Michigan who is good at multi sports have money for baseball and hockey players in there other sports will get around $25k per player. So the deals Porter Martone and Jack Ivankovic were promised are now gone. With this rule change I think it helps CHL because you won’t see these types of players jump to ncaa with CHL eligibility. Even though yes they would be paid more in NCAA than CHL at 25k a year I don’t see it enough to make the jump.

 

[RayzorIsDull]

Yesterday the “House Settlement” has passed which means schools can only pay 22 million dollars to their athletes and NIL deals will have to go to a 3rd party arbitrator where they have to deem its fair valais. So the days of paying a player for his NIL but not using his NIL is gone.

To give you an idea from 22 million 75% will go to Football 15% to men’s basketball 5% to women’s basketball and the remaining 5% to the rest of the sports baseball, hockey, lacrosse etc. The math is 1.1 million for the rest. How can a school like Michigan who is good at multi sports have money for baseball and hockey players in there other sports will get around $25k per player. So the deals Porter Martone and Jack Ivankovic were promised are now gone. With this rule change I think it helps CHL because you won’t see these types of players jump to ncaa with CHL eligibility. Even though yes they would be paid more in NCAA than CHL at 25k a year I don’t see it enough to make the jump.

Those deals aren't gone. Players coming in now will be grand fathered in. They haven't even named a president yet to preside over this. The clearinghouse is a nice idea but there are back channels. For instance don't sign an NIL contract then nobody audits them. Athletes have signed endorsement deals with companies and to this point it isn't clear that the clearinghouse can have much impact with this.

Put it this way there are 3 avenues/umbrellas athletes have at their disposal.

School revenue 20.5 mil/yr

Endorsement deals that are part of university collectives but NCAA isn't policing. Eg. Players receive a car for one year. That's a benefit but can't be tracked because there's no monetary gain.

NIL contracts for athletes. Athletes will have the option of signing multi yr deals, universities can also buy athletes out of contracts.

If every athlete had a base of 25k to begin with its a great starting point.

 

[Altek]

No that’s not they case they were talking about it on espn yesterday that football players with previous deals are no longer recovering those deals.

Please share where you are getting your info Mr I think I know it all. I work with NCAA student athletes so my sources are pretty solid.

 

[RayzorIsDull]

No that’s not they case they were talking about it on espn yesterday that football players with previous deals are no longer recovering those deals.

Please share where you are getting your info Mr I think I know it all. I work with NCAA student athletes so my sources are pretty solid.

https://sumersports.com/the-zone/decoding-the-house-v-ncaa-settlement/

This will give freshman athletes new revenue streams. The clearinghouse and Deloitte will look over certain NIL deals but who is going to determine fair market value. NCAA coaches have said some of their players strictly do endorsements to avoid NIL rules.

 

[OMG67]

https://sumersports.com/the-zone/decoding-the-house-v-ncaa-settlement/

This will give freshman athletes new revenue streams. The clearinghouse and Deloitte will look over certain NIL deals but who is going to determine fair market value. NCAA coaches have said some of their players strictly do endorsements to avoid NIL rules.

The challenge is what endorsement deal would Ivankovic enter into? Who’s giving him a deal? At best it would be an investment on a potential payoff in five years when he ‘could be’ and NHL star. There is zero name brand recognition at all.

IMO, for these players, it would need to be some sort of under the table deal. Why would Reebok give Porter Martone $250k in the NCAA while not give him the same in the CHL? Clearly it needs to be some sort of greyish deal negotiated through the College and/or donors for it to make any sense at all. A means for the University to spend OVER their assigned allotment.

 

[coolhandluc44]

The challenge is what endorsement deal would Ivankovic enter into? Who’s giving him a deal? At best it would be an investment on a potential payoff in five years when he ‘could be’ and NHL star. There is zero name brand recognition at all.

IMO, for these players, it would need to be some sort of under the table deal. Why would Reebok give Porter Martone $250k in the NCAA while not give him the same in the CHL? Clearly it needs to be some sort of greyish deal negotiated through the College and/or donors for it to make any sense at all. A means for the University to spend OVER their assigned allotment.

I’ve asked this before and maybe it was responsded and I just didn’t see it: but could Rebook or anyother company sign Martone and give him money if he was in the CHL?

 

[coolhandluc44]

is there a website that tracks NCAA school commitments and for what years they are committed? Thanks

 

[RayzorIsDull]

The challenge is what endorsement deal would Ivankovic enter into? Who’s giving him a deal? At best it would be an investment on a potential payoff in five years when he ‘could be’ and NHL star. There is zero name brand recognition at all.

IMO, for these players, it would need to be some sort of under the table deal. Why would Reebok give Porter Martone $250k in the NCAA while not give him the same in the CHL? Clearly it needs to be some sort of greyish deal negotiated through the College and/or donors for it to make any sense at all. A means for the University to spend OVER their assigned allotment.

I can't answer that. Aliyah Edwards from Canada playing for UConn basketball is in a Adidas commercial with WNBA players. It's fine to ask why but I don't know if you will ever find the answer that people will like or appease.

Cooper Flagg went to Duke which is a Nike school but got a contract from New Balance for 18 million years not released. CHL is going to have uniforms done by Under Armor but they also lag behind Nike/Adidas and now New Balance.

Are they spending beyond their allotment? They still have endorsement opportunities and NIL these are completely different.

 

[zaluty]

Aliyah is now in her 2nd year as a pro. NIL does not apply to her anymore

 

[OMG67]

I can't answer that. Aliyah Edwards from Canada playing for UConn basketball is in a Adidas commercial with WNBA players. It's fine to ask why but I don't know if you will ever find the answer that people will like or appease.

Cooper Flagg went to Duke which is a Nike school but got a contract from New Balance for 18 million years not released. CHL is going to have uniforms done by Under Armor but they also lag behind Nike/Adidas and now New Balance.

Are they spending beyond their allotment? They still have endorsement opportunities and NIL these are completely different.

And my point is if Porter Martone can sign a $250k “endorsement” deal with Nike while playing NCAA, why isn’t he signing it while playing in Brampton? Why does his appeal go from 0 to 100 switching leagues?

The only answer I have is that rules are being broken and he is actually getting paid to play.

It is either that or the NCAA hockey programs are marketing geniuses and the CHL is inept.

 

[swoopster]

If money, as many seem to believe, is the factor, why hasn't a disgruntled player come forward and make the claim that this is what X has offered me? Surely some player has been offered what he feels is well below what he had expected.

Maybe there have been instances, but I have not seen nor heard of them.

 

[Corso]

I’ve asked this before and maybe it was responsded and I just didn’t see it: but could Rebook or anyother company sign Martone and give him money if he was in the CHL?

From my understanding yes...

The challenge is what endorsement deal would Ivankovic enter into? Who’s giving him a deal? At best it would be an investment on a potential payoff in five years when he ‘could be’ and NHL star. There is zero name brand recognition at all.

IMO, for these players, it would need to be some sort of under the table deal. Why would Reebok give Porter Martone $250k in the NCAA while not give him the same in the CHL? Clearly it needs to be some sort of greyish deal negotiated through the College and/or donors for it to make any sense at all. A means for the University to spend OVER their assigned allotment.

As I understand it, and explained to me by a player agent, all endorsement deals must go through the newly created NIL Go run by Deloitte who will determine what the fair market value is. So if Ivankovic was promised a 100k NIL deal to post on social media, make a few appearances here and there; it is very probable that the deal would be nixed by Deloitte.

If, however, Ivankovic signed the deal prior to June 7th and the money was already received, then it stands.

As for the proverbial bag deals, well those will still happen although I do not believe that it will be a problem in hockey as the money just isn't there for those type of illegal payments.

 

[OMG67]

From my understanding yes...


As I understand it, and explained to me by a player agent, all endorsement deals must go through the newly created NIL Go run by Deloitte who will determine what the fair market value is. So if Ivankovic was promised a 100k NIL deal to post on social media, make a few appearances here and there; it is very probable that the deal would be nixed by Deloitte.

If, however, Ivankovic signed the deal prior to June 7th and the money was already received, then it stands.

As for the proverbial bag deals, well those will still happen although I do not believe that it will be a problem in hockey as the money just isn't there for those type of illegal payments.

The issue previously with the “posting on social media” was the act of doing so was considered employment. Canadians with student visas were not able to be employed. They would need to return to Canada to post to social media.

This was the big NIL barrier last year. I’m not sure if any of this has changed but there are still hurdles.

 

[Corso]

The issue previously with the “posting on social media” was the act of doing so was considered employment. Canadians with student visas were not able to be employed. They would need to return to Canada to post to social media.

This was the big NIL barrier last year. I’m not sure if any of this has changed but there are still hurdles.

Correct but it is not that difficult to post from your own home country. The biggest hurdle for most schools was finding an entity to actually pay out the money.

The new NIL Go and the college sports commission is supposed to stamp out such activity, however, so posting on social medial for 100k is going to be a thing of the past. Not that I really believe that many (if any) hockey programs doled out that kind of money.

The new issue now is whether or not foreign athletes will be able to participate in revenue sharing. About five or six schools will have about 500k to spend on their players. Michigan is one of them but will Ivankovic be able to receive any payments??

 

[Corso]

I consider Kristi Dosh to be an expert on all NIL related matters and this is what she tweeted a few hours ago...



So, util there is relief from either the courts, Congress or clarification from DHS saying it is permissible, foreign athletes will (most likely) not be participating in revenue sharing. As all other NIL deals have to go through the NILGO clearinghouse, we should no longer expect Happy Valley United writing a 250k check to Porter Mortone on behalf of Penn State.

 

[OHL4Life]

its so interesting, ncaa schools are offering money, no doubt. i just dont know how.

 

[Corso]

its so interesting, ncaa schools are offering money, no doubt. i just dont know how.

Spence goes back to Ontario, tweets out his commitment to Michigan and Champions Circle cuts a 20k check to an incorporated entity in Canada to pay Spence...that's how. The House Settlement changes all that, however, since posting on social media will be seen as simply pay to play and payments will be voided. Spence, being a Canadian citizen will also be ineligible to receive payments through revenue sharing.

Now can there be back door "illegal" payments? Of course but that has always been there and nothing has changed in that regard.

 

[OMG67]

I consider Kristi Dosh to be an expert on all NIL related matters and this is what she tweeted a few hours ago...



So, util there is relief from either the courts, Congress or clarification from DHS saying it is permissible, foreign athletes will (most likely) not be participating in revenue sharing. As all other NIL deals have to go through the NILGO clearinghouse, we should no longer expect Happy Valley United writing a 250k check to Porter Mortone on behalf of Penn State.

And this is basically what I’ve been highlighting and has been highlighted in archive articles about Canadian athletes being unable to collect NIL $$$ unless there services were performed on home soil, specifically because of the student visas.

 

[OMG67]

Spence goes back to Ontario, tweets out his commitment to Michigan and Champions Circle cuts a 20k check to an incorporated entity in Canada to pay Spence...that's how. The House Settlement changes all that, however, since posting on social media will be seen as simply pay to play and payments will be voided. Spence, being a Canadian citizen will also be ineligible to receive payments through revenue sharing.

Now can there be back door "illegal" payments? Of course but that has always been there and nothing has changed in that regard.

I think “market value” will depend on their social media following. Do they have the sub numbers that classify them as honest social media influencers? If Porter Martone were to have 1,000,000 followers on Instagram, that makes it a far greater market value than if he has 10,000.

But this is sort of what i’ve been trying to suggest with respect to why many of these players are useless as endorsement candidates. They haven’t cultivated any sort of significant social media presence. They have little to offer for name recognition. All they have going for them is they play the game really well. That translates into future salary for performance.

When you look at someone like Bryson Dechambeau and see how his social media presence fuels his endorsements compared to other pro golfers, you see how stark the difference is.

We all know this is a pay to play situation for most of these players. They can play NCAA for $250k or the AHL for $80k. Which would you choose? Makes sense for sure. But like you have highlighted, it will be very difficult to impossible to pay them above the table. It is beyond obvious but it is what you can prove I guess. And if there are little to no investigations digging into it, what can you do about it?

 

[Corso]

And this is basically what I’ve been highlighting and has been highlighted in archive articles about Canadian athletes being unable to collect NIL $$$ unless there services were performed on home soil, specifically because of the student visas.

Yes, although from my understanding passive income from licensing deals would still be allowed. There was some debate over whether revenue sharing would be considered passive income but Kristi Dosh doesn't believe that to be the case and in the current political environment, there is no damn FUC**NG WAY I would advise any of my foreign born clients to accept even a single dime.

I suspected a lot of lawsuits would arise over the NILGO clearinghouse rejecting NIL deals (that are pay to play) but according to Michael McCann (prominent sports lawyer), that may not be the case...

 

[Corso]

We all know this is a pay to play situation for most of these players. They can play NCAA for $250k or the AHL for $80k. Which would you choose? Makes sense for sure. But like you have highlighted, it will be very difficult to impossible to pay them above the table. It is beyond obvious but it is what you can prove I guess. And if there are little to no investigations digging into it, what can you do about it?

In all honesty, there just isn't enough money in the college hockey world to be forking out 250k under the table payments.

 

[OMG67]

In all honesty, there just isn't enough money in the college hockey world to be forking out 250k under the table payments.

It theoretically doesn’t need to be $240k. It can be $80k which matches basic ELC AHL comp. Currently, they cannot be sent to the AHL but as soon as that changes, the players would not pass on signing their ELC.

I can see a player passing on signing their ELC as a 19 year old knowing they will get their ELC the following year if they can get paid in the NCAA bs getting nothing in the CHL.

 

[Corso]

It theoretically doesn’t need to be $240k. It can be $80k which matches basic ELC AHL comp. Currently, they cannot be sent to the AHL but as soon as that changes, the players would not pass on signing their ELC.

I can see a player passing on signing their ELC as a 19 year old knowing they will get their ELC the following year if they can get paid in the NCAA bs getting nothing in the CHL.

But you are forgetting the signing bonuses paid out by the ECL. You would have to be earning around 180k in revenue sharing and NIL to equal it out. I also expect both the rookie max to increase as well as two way contracts. It would not shock me to see the rookie max in the NHL to increase by a couple of hundred thousand and the minimum two way contract to 100k or more.