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Prospect Info: Champions Hockey League

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Legend123 said:
Pelicans were one of the top offensive teams in the Liiga last year. His teammates are fine. He needs to be more assertive and be better at controlling the game. Last night was a perfect example of his deficiencies. He lacks the dynamic ability. He is too offensively shy to use his skills. Instead he relies on his forecheck + cycling ability to generate offense. Its just too bad, its a waste of talent the way he plays.
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They were 2nd in the league in goals I believe but they also lost their top 3 scorers from last year in Kaski (leading scorer), Saarinen is with HIFK now and then Zohorna left for the KHL. I didn't really see who they brought in to replace them though so hopefully they are one of the top teams again this year but they also lost their starter from last year to the KHL I believe.

I haven't seen a ton of Ylonen but I'm am concerned over a few things i've seen, love speed and shot though so hopefully he has a big year and then comes over.
 
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montreal said:
They were 2nd in the league in goals I believe but they also lost their top 3 scorers from last year in Kaski (leading scorer), Saarinen is with HIFK now and then Zohorna left for the KHL. I didn't really see who they brought in to replace them though so hopefully they are one of the top teams again this year but they also lost their starter from last year to the KHL I believe.

I haven't seen a ton of Ylonen but I'm am concerned over a few things i've seen, love speed and shot though so hopefully he has a big year and then comes over.
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Which opens the door for Ylonen on the top line and top Pp unit. He needs To prove he can be a difference maker this season and not a complimentary winger. Otherwise i will have no more hope for him in the NHL.
 
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Legend123 said:
Pelicans were one of the top offensive teams in the Liiga last year. His teammates are fine. He needs to be more assertive and be better at controlling the game. Last night was a perfect example of his deficiencies. He lacks the dynamic ability. He is too offensively shy to use his skills. Instead he relies on his forecheck + cycling ability to generate offense. Its just too bad, its a waste of talent the way he plays.
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It's going to get him a place on the roster. We'll see if it ever translates to some serious offense at the next level, though. I too wish that he would stop trying to play in the ''correct'' manner and get artistic on these Liiga jabronis.
 
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Legend123 said:
Pelicans were one of the top offensive teams in the Liiga last year. His teammates are fine. He needs to be more assertive and be better at controlling the game. Last night was a perfect example of his deficiencies. He lacks the dynamic ability. He is too offensively shy to use his skills. Instead he relies on his forecheck + cycling ability to generate offense. Its just too bad, its a waste of talent the way he plays.
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I hear what you are saying but the European game is a boring perimeter game. Hopefully he has a good year and next year he can come over and see how he adapts to the North American rinks and style of play.

Players in Europe are coached to keep the puck wide in order to stretch out defenders. Ultimately it is often a boring side game of chicken that is played to a stalemate.
 
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Estimated_Prophet said:
I hear what you are saying but the European game is a boring perimeter game. Hopefully he has a good year and next year he can come over and see how he adapts to the North American rinks and style of play.

Players in Europe are coached to keep the puck wide in order to stretch out defenders. Ultimately it is often a boring side game of chicken that is played to a stalemate.
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that isnt exactly true. Ylonen himself said its a goal of his to improve his dynamic ability in the upcoming liiga season. He acknowledges that that is one area of his game he must improve before making the NHL. He said its not due to a lack of confidence or coaching but a lack of strength. Yet, he still looks like the same Ylonen who is allergic at trying to do too much. He knows what he has to do. Now its a matter of actually doing it.
 
Legend123 said:
that isnt exactly true. Ylonen himself said its a goal of his to improve his dynamic ability in the upcoming liiga season. He acknowledges that that is one area of his game he must improve before making the NHL. He said its not due to a lack of confidence or coaching but a lack of strength. Yet, he still looks like the same Ylonen who is allergic at trying to do too much. He knows what he has to do. Now its a matter of actually doing it.
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Need to get him some 1 on 1 life coaching lessons with Shia LaBoeuf.
 
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Estimated_Prophet said:
Is it just me or are there some Brian Savage similarities with Ylonen?
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They are basically the opposite of each other... Savage was a floater, average skater, average skills, low motor, low compete, his scoring touch was his bread and butter... Ylonen is one of the best skaters among the top prospects for the NHL, can make plays at top speed since he has great eye hands coordination, he is relentless on the forecheck, works hard, battles hard, has a very good shot that will keep improving as he gets stronger, that kid has all the tools required to become a solid top 6 winger, just needs to keep improving, getting stronger and gain confidence, he does alot of good things on the ice and is clearly the most skilled player on his team, so Im not worried for him, he will be great, I have no doubt about it...

Tim Bozon is probably the prospect we had, having the most similarities with Savage, was a prolific goalscorer in junior, but the rest of his game was too flawed to amount to anything ... Conclusion, Brian Savage was decent enough for the prior lock-out era where the talent was diluted , but couldnt skate the way the game is played these days...
 
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Estimated_Prophet said:
Is it just me or are there some Brian Savage similarities with Ylonen?
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Ylonen hitting 600+ games & multiple 20+ goal seasons would be pretty damn good...

I get we'd all prefer a better ceiling, but considering only 9 players we've drafted in the past 20yrs have hit 600+ games, the Savage comparison actually sits on the high end of realistic expectations
 
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Goldenhands said:
They are basically the opposite of each other... Savage was a floater, average skater, average skills, low motor, low compete, his scoring touch was his bread and butter... Ylonen is one of the best skaters among the top prospects for the NHL, can make plays at top speed since he has great eye hands coordination, he is relentless on the forecheck, works hard, battles hard, has a very good shot that will keep improving as he gets stronger, that kid has all the tools required to become a solid top 6 winger, just needs to keep improving, getting stronger and gain confidence, he does alot of good things on the ice and is clearly the most skilled player on his team, so Im not worried for him, he will be great, I have no doubt about it...

Tim Bozon is probably the prospect we had, having the most similarities with Savage, was a prolific goalscorer in junior, but the rest of his game was too flawed to amount to anything ... Conclusion, Brian Savage was decent enough for the prior lock-out era where the talent was diluted , but couldnt skate the way the game is played these days...
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I feel like you haven't seen Savage play. His game was entirely built on speed and his shot.....exactly like Ylonen including questions about hockey IQ.

Calling Bozon with a career high of 36 goals in junior a prolific junior goal scorer is an enormous stretch. Bozon was a fringe prospect and never was as good as Savage who actually was a prolific goal scorer in the NCAA. I actually like Ylonen and he compares very favourably with a successful NHL player but you claim that he is better than I think and you compare him to a bust.......?

I am in no way asserting that Savage and Ylonen are identical but they do share many similar strengths and weaknesses. To refer to them as opposites is nothing short of asinine. You clearly must have been too young to have remembered Savage coming up as he was a big deal as a prospect and was heavily anticipated after finishing with the Canadian Olympic team then destroying the AHL in a short stint. His biggest problems were injuries but I think everyone here would be happy if Ylonen turned into a player who scored at a 20-30 goal pace in his first 8 seasons.
 
Miller Time said:
Ylonen hitting 600+ games & multiple 20+ goal seasons would be pretty damn good...

I get we'd all prefer a better ceiling, but considering only 9 players we've drafted in the past 20yrs have hit 600+ games, the Savage comparison actually sits on the high end of realistic expectations
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Plus Mr.October's career was hurt by injuries that may be more preventable nowadays.
 
Estimated_Prophet said:
I feel like you haven't seen Savage play. His game was entirely built on speed and his shot.....exactly like Ylonen including questions about hockey IQ.

Calling Bozon with a career high of 36 goals in junior a prolific junior goal scorer is an enormous stretch. Bozon was a fringe prospect and never was as good as Savage who actually was a prolific goal scorer in the NCAA. I actually like Ylonen and he compares very favourably with a successful NHL player but you claim that he is better than I think and you compare him to a bust.......?

I am in no way asserting that Savage and Ylonen are identical but they do share many similar strengths and weaknesses. To refer to them as opposites is nothing short of asinine. You clearly must have been too young to have remembered Savage coming up as he was a big deal as a prospect and was heavily anticipated after finishing with the Canadian Olympic team then destroying the AHL in a short stint. His biggest problems were injuries but I think everyone here would be happy if Ylonen turned into a player who scored at a 20-30 goal pace in his first 8 seasons.
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I recall Brian Savage very well, Mr. October that couldnt produce much outside the begin of the season playing with Koivu... His work ethic was bad, his skills were average, skating was decent at best, Ylonen is a much better skater, that kid is flying on the ice, its not even close... Ylonen also has great work ethic, he is relentless on the forecheck causing turnovers and will backcheck hard when needed... They are completely alike, Savage couldnt do anything without Koivu, he was barely a NHL player prior lock-out, he quickly died in Arizona after signing a ridiculous contract, believe me I recall perfectly that era where the Habs were filled of pathetic players, an era I wish I could forget so much the Habs were brutal...
 
Goldenhands said:
I recall Brian Savage very well, Mr. October that couldnt produce much outside the begin of the season playing with Koivu... His work ethic was bad, his skills were average, skating was decent at best, Ylonen is a much better skater, that kid is flying on the ice, its not even close... Ylonen also has great work ethic, he is relentless on the forecheck causing turnovers and will backcheck hard when needed... They are completely alike, Savage couldnt do anything without Koivu, he was barely a NHL player prior lock-out, he quickly died in Arizona after signing a ridiculous contract, believe me I recall perfectly that era where the Habs were filled of pathetic players, an era I wish I could forget so much the Habs were brutal...
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Savage was a great skater.

It appears that you have difficulty in assessing skating as you did the same with Lassi Thomson prior to the draft. You have to understand that this is not subjective and it is the axiom from which a scout's foundation is built upon. This is what separates real scouts from armchair scouts. There is almost never a disagreement about a player's skating amongst professional scouts. When you come to sites such as this there are plenty of disagreements on skating and sometimes such as this example there is a vast difference in opinion. The fact is that there is a correct answer and one side of the the debate is grossly mistaken.

Everbody knows Savage was Mr. October but that includes children who were watching him at the time. Just because you have a recollection of the player does not mean that you had the ability to accurately assess that player's abilities at the time. Did you follow Savage's college exploits in The Hockey News and watch every Team Canada game solely to see Savage play?

This is not an agree to disagree situation.......this is correct vs incorrect.
 
Estimated_Prophet said:
Savage was a great skater.

It appears that you have difficulty in assessing skating as you did the same with Lassi Thomson prior to the draft. You have to understand that this is not subjective and it is the axiom from which a scout's foundation is built upon. This is what separates real scouts from armchair scouts. There is almost never a disagreement about a player's skating amongst professional scouts. When you come to sites such as this there are plenty of disagreements on skating and sometimes such as this example there is a vast difference in opinion. The fact is that there is a correct answer and one side of the the debate is grossly mistaken.

Everbody knows Savage was Mr. October but that includes children who were watching him at the time. Just because you have a recollection of the player does not mean that you had the ability to accurately assess that player's abilities at the time. Did you follow Savage's college exploits in The Hockey News and watch every Team Canada game solely to see Savage play?

This is not an agree to disagree situation.......this is correct vs incorrect.
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Lassi Thomson, I watched once or twice and wasnt particulary impressed with his top end speed, he has great edges but that draft was filled with great skating defensemen, so I just didnt see what was so special about his skating compared to guys like Broberg, Seider, Soderstrom, Bjornfot, Harley, Heinola who are all great skaters... Didnt like the way he was defending so I didnt spend much more time on him since I was convinced Habs wouldnt draft him...

You are the one saying Brian Savage was a prolific skater and Im the one having trouble to assess skating? lol

Ylonen is hands down a much more explosive and dynamic skater and its not even close, come on... :shakehead
 
Goldenhands said:
Lassi Thomson, I watched once or twice and wasnt particulary impressed with his top end speed, he has great edges but that draft was filled with great skating defensemen, so I just didnt see what was so special about his skating compared to guys like Broberg, Seider, Soderstrom, Bjornfot, Harley, Heinola who are all great skaters... Didnt like the way he was defending so I didnt spend much more time on him since I was convinced Habs wouldnt draft him...

You are the one saying Brian Savage was a prolific skater and Im the one having trouble to assess skating? lol

Ylonen is hands down a much more explosive and dynamic skater and its not even close, come on... :shakehead
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If you want to improve your ability to assess prospects then you should try and learn from me. Savage was a great skater and that is fact that can only be disputed by those who lack the ability to recognize skating ability. I already exposed you with Thomson and you are doing it again. You also referred to Thomson as being an average skater at best before eventually conceding that he has great edges.
 
Estimated_Prophet said:
If you want to improve your ability to assess prospects then you should try and learn from me.

:laugh: Okay...

Savage was a great skater and that is fact that can only be disputed by those who lack the ability to recognize skating ability. I already exposed you with Thomson and you are doing it again. You also referred to Thomson as being an average skater at best before eventually conceding that he has great edges.
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I just named you about 6-7 great skating defensemen only in the last draft, obviously Thomson is part of that group, I just didnt spend much time watching the kid and was reacting to people saying he was a special skater when you had better rounded defensemen in that draft that were great skaters as well... Would you say Thomson is a better skater than the guys named above?

Ylonen is easily one of the best skating prospects in the world and you are comparing him to Brian fn Savage who never had Ylonen's explosiveness, even in his best dreams... That is a solid skating assessments I would say while yours is flawed... If you think Savage was a great skater, you wont believe what Ylonen will do with the Habs in the near future, his game is all about speed and he uses it in all facets of the game, he has a high motor and has a much better work ethic than Savage used to, his skills also are at a way higher level, Savage was an opportunist floater with a great shot and scoring touch, thats why I compared him to a kid like Bozon, a natural goalscorer with ton of flaws including some floating and lack of hockey IQ, the reason why a young Savage could never play at the level the NHL currently is, fortunately for him, he made the NHL in an era where the talent was highly diluted and teams were playing boring hockey, the famous trap era...
 
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Goldenhands said:
I just named you about 6-7 great skating defensemen only in the last draft, obviously Thomson is part of that group, I just didnt spend much time watching the kid and was reacting to people saying he was a special skater when you had better rounded defensemen in that draft that were great skaters as well... Would you say Thomson is a better skater than the guys named above?

Ylonen is easily one of the best skating prospects in the world and you are comparing him to Brian fn Savage who never had Ylonen's explosiveness, even in his best dreams... That is a solid skating assessments I would say while yours is flawed... If you think Savage was a great skater, you wont believe what Ylonen will do with the Habs in the near future, his game is all about speed and he uses it in all facets of the game, he has a high motor and has a much better work ethic than Savage used to, his skills also are at a way higher level, Savage was an opportunist floater with a great shot and scoring touch, thats why I compared him to a kid like Bozon, a natural goalscorer with ton of flaws including some floating and lack of hockey IQ, the reason why a young Savage could never play at the level the NHL currently is, fortunately for him, he made the NHL in an era where the talent was highly diluted and teams were playing boring hockey, the famous trap era...
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You are priceless.

I compare Ylonen favourably to a perennial 20+ NHL goal scorer (Savage)and you compare him to a bust (Bozon) and somehow you are trying to make a case that I am underrating Ylonen.......????

Savage was a better skater than Bozon and a far more talented goal scorer yet you think Ylonen is more like Bozon and that is a good thing lol.

You are on your own now kid.
 
Estimated_Prophet said:
You are priceless.

I compare Ylonen favourably to a perennial 20+ NHL goal scorer (Savage)and you compare him to a bust (Bozon) and somehow you are trying to make a case that I am underrating Ylonen.......????

Savage was a better skater than Bozon and a far more talented goal scorer yet you think Ylonen is more like Bozon and that is a good thing lol.

You are on your own now kid.
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You misunderstood me or I didnt worded it correctly, Im not comparing Ylonen to Bozon, Im comparing Savage to Bozon. Savage has more similarities with Tim Bozon than with Ylonen, in fact as I said, Ylonen and Savage are completely different players... A player like Savage couldnt crack a NHL line-up these days, the guy was too flawed...
 
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Olofsson's team won in the SO, but surprisingly he was held pointless again. 0 pts, Even, 1 shot, 9:49 TOI, 2 of 5 on draws.

his teammate, Albin Eriksson looked good though, stars 2nd rounder.
 
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