Confirmed Trade: [CAR/COL/CHI] Mikko Rantanen (50%), Taylor Hall, Nils Juntorp to CAR; Martin Necas, Jack Drury, '25 2nd, '26 4th to COL; '25 3rd to CHI for retention

[tarheelhockey]

I disagree completely. Not a player like Rantanen in 2025. If this was 1955 when player salaries were not disclosed and players were being railroaded... sure... but not today. Anyone can go online in 5 seconds and see what any player in the NHL is making. Rantanen is in an elite tier -- there are clear comps for a player like him.

However, the same issue would present itself... it's no longer what a player is "worth" in isolation... it's more about being able to pay him reasonable worth while keeping a contending team together in a cap world. Today, there's nowhere to hide -- player salaries, cap hits, and team payrolls are fully disclosed. Rantanen can figure out in 5 minutes what he "should be paid" as well as "what the Avs can reasonably pay" and he can sit down with the GM over a beer a work a deal... IF he wants to stay in Colorado.

Do you truly think a GM would try to tell Rantanen to his face that he's only worth 8.5 a year? Lmao... heck, you or I could represent Rantanen in our sleep. The issue is that players need to be direct with their agents and state their intent. Rantanen should have told his agent, "I know I'm likely worth 13.5 on the open market, but Nate took a bit less a couple of times... and Cale is up and will need a raise too... so tell the Avs I'm offering a hometown discount of 11.5 to stay. I want this deal put to bed by Jan. 1st... and I need to be kept in the loop daily."

Instead, Rantanen likely trusted his agent whose bluff was called. Lesson learned. If you want to stay in Colorado, either grow a set and demand your agent gets it done... or call the GM directly and work it out... or try to convince the NHL to remove the hard cap so you can have your cake and eat it too. Or, ultimately get traded, lol.

Do you seriously think that is what negotiating an NHL contract consists of? Deciding what you should be paid, then looking at the team’s cap space, and shooting down the middle?

So you think an NHL player, armed with two publicly available numbers, is qualified to sit down with a beer across the table from a team of professional contract negotiators and hammer out a multimillion dollar contract structure, bonuses, incentives, trade clauses? That he’s capable of winning in arbitration? That he understands all of his rights and restrictions enumerated in the 50 articles of the CBA? That he’s prepared to negotiate endorsements and media with corporate lawyers? That he knows how to file a grievance with the union? That he’s able to negotiate contracts in Sweden or Finland? That he can speak to the media solo and without any coaching, during a high stakes negotiation, without saying something he’ll soon regret? That he understands the financial and tax implications of all of these agreements?

That he has time to do all of that while also being a professional athlete?

That he even has the educational and professional attainment necessary to attempt any of this with a reasonable level of confidence?

Agents don’t become multimillionaires by accident. Thinking active NHL players could do this job is like thinking you can just show up in court and represent yourself on felony charges, no problemo man.

 

[Navin R Slavin]

Whats crazy is that over a 3 year stretch, the Rams, Avs, Nuggets all won the championship in their respective sport.

And they own AFC Bournemouth in the EPL, who are right now one point away from Europe next season.

 

[a mangy Meowth]

And they own AFC Bournemouth in the EPL, who are right now one point away from Europe next season.

No, Kroenke owns Arsenal. That's Foley

 

[Boxscore]

Do you seriously think that is what negotiating an NHL contract consists of? Deciding what you should be paid, then looking at the team’s cap space, and shooting down the middle?

So you think an NHL player, armed with two publicly available numbers, is qualified to sit down with a beer across the table from a team of professional contract negotiators and hammer out a multimillion dollar contract structure, bonuses, incentives, trade clauses? That he’s capable of winning in arbitration? That he understands all of his rights and restrictions enumerated in the 50 articles of the CBA? That he’s prepared to negotiate endorsements and media with corporate lawyers? That he knows how to file a grievance with the union? That he’s able to negotiate contracts in Sweden or Finland? That he can speak to the media solo and without any coaching, during a high stakes negotiation, without saying something he’ll soon regret? That he understands the financial and tax implications of all of these agreements?

That he has time to do all of that while also being a professional athlete?

That he even has the educational and professional attainment necessary to attempt any of this with a reasonable level of confidence?

Agents don’t become multimillionaires by accident. Thinking active NHL players could do this job is like thinking you can just show up in court and represent yourself on felony charges, no problemo man.

I'm not talking about the nuance of taxes, legalese, paperwork, certifications, and the like. I thought that was implied but I guess I was vague in those regards. I strictly mean in terms of "agreeing on a number." Rantanen knows what guys like Nylander, Tkachuk, Pastrnak, MacKinnon, Reinhart, and Draisaitl have recently agreed to. If we polled everyone on this forum in August, asking what Rantanen's next deal should look like, I'd venture to say 99% of us would suggest "between 11.5 - 13 million x 8." I'd have a hard time believing anyone would suggest under 11 or over 13.

So, coming to the number and term is a no-brainer. However, the gray area lies within the Avs cap structure, the moves they make during the year, and factoring in Makar's raise. Again, all the legalization aside, coming up with a number isn't that hard... hence why fans and media do it constantly when big-name players are up for deals... and usually, we're extremely close... because it's rather simple.

The difficulty comes in when a player's agent is determined to milk every penny and exhaust all leverage over a team, even when the players themselves just want a fair deal that can help keep the team together. That's when ego kicks in and agents begin fighting for their industry cred.

That is what I take issue with. Agents are supposed to work for the player... not dictate every aspect of their playing career and then inform them of the fallout. This Rantanen deal reeks of agent ego gone wild.

Rantanen was shaken by the trade, as was MacKinnon... and likely the rest of the club. And, I cannot for a second believe the Avs wanted to trade Mikko... but when the agent is bullish and not willing to budge off a number, the team cannot afford to be leveraged to their detriment. Agents know a hard cap exists and certain teams (Bolts and Avs come to mind) have established a culture of stars taking less for the stability of the team. Rantanen's agent was playing this like a blood sport and Colorado ended the game.

 

[Nogatco Rd]

They hired the guy who couldn’t tear down Toronto and caved to the core 4 on what they wanted despite years of playoff failure to tear down the Pens?

I get the vibe that Dubas was hired because he had a vision for building a winning team around the Core 4. That is, keeping the Core 4 together was an organizational decision made at the upper management/ownership level, and Dubas was ID’ed as the ideal candidate to build out the rest of the team in a way that would play to their strengths.

IMO trading those guys was never a real option while he was there.

 

[Ncit3]

I think it's quite funny people talk about the Avs not being able to afford and spend to the cap because it's going to be *checks notes* around 100M.

You know the Avs owner spends more than that on just TWO players one of his other teams? The Denver Nuggets. That play in the same building. He's also paying nearly $190M for Arsenal. And he's never underspent on the Avs in his ownership history.

Colorado will spend to the cap. They did this move for cap flexibility with signing important players.

 

[Oilslick941611]

Ppl crapping in the Hawks part in this is wild. Hall has zero value with that contract. Cap space and a 3rd is great for them.

cap space has value, but not to a team in Chicagos place. The real thing here is real dollars saved. You are also right about hall, they were able to get rid of him with no retention. If Hall could have beeen traded earlier he would have but there were no takers without retention or adding to the deal. He has zero value, he's also done has an impact player, and might have been done for a while.

 

[Boxscore]

Colorado will spend to the cap. They did this move for cap flexibility with signing important players.

Exactly. The Avs aren't cheap -- they're tactical. It helps that their superstar (MacKinnon) has taken less than he could have gotten multiple times, allowing them to build a fantastic core. The Avs know that Rantanen and Makar must leave some money on the table to keep this team competitive. The Leafs and Oilers have proven that dedicating that much cap to a few players is not sustainable when it comes to winning championships. Meanwhile, teams like Colorado and Tampa have won because their key players have made financial sacrifices.

 

[nerevarine]

Exactly. The Avs aren't cheap -- they're tactical. It helps that their superstar (MacKinnon) has taken less than he could have gotten multiple times, allowing them to build a fantastic core. The Avs know that Rantanen and Makar must leave some money on the table to keep this team competitive. The Leafs and Oilers have proven that dedicating that much cap to a few players is not sustainable when it comes to winning championships. Meanwhile, teams like Colorado and Tampa have won because their key players have made financial sacrifices.

Lol? How many cups did the avs win with mackinnons at market contract?

I'll answer for you: zero

 

[pelderhostiga]

Yeah, if he wanted to make a deal he had all the time, he was holding for free agency and going to the highest bidder,

I still don't understand how could Rantanen have made a contract all by himself if the Avs were never ready to offer him a fair deal. His agent might have pushed too hard, but his closest comparables (Pastrnak, Nylander) have deals of 13+% of the cap, which are still under market value, and there is no indication that the Avs were ever willing to offer that.

Exactly. Could you imagine being offered $94 million in addition to the $58 million you've already made... to play hockey in a great city, for a winning team, and with some of your best buddies in the world... and your agents having the guts to tell you "it's not enough" and ultimately get you traded off the team to your surprise?

Let's be honest, this deal should have been put to bed over the summer... but that's what agents do... grind, grind, dig in, and put their own egos ahead of their players wants.

Could you imagine playing in the worst team in the league, enduring the worst times of the franchise and helping them to a Stanley Cup while playing big minutes and being a superstar and a beloved locker room guy, and then your team doesn't even offer you a deal that similar caliber players have in other teams? There's always two sides to a coin.

 

[Alienblood]

Lol? How many cups did the avs win with mackinnons at market contract?

I'll answer for you: zero

1

 

[Gaud]

Saw the tail end of a discussion in which Bob Hartley was talking about Rantanen asking for more money than McKinnon was getting. Now, i dont know how true that is, but it had me wondering.

The hockey world seems shocked that this trade happened; usually you hear whispers that one player will get traded. I mean.. you would think he would have been shopped around more. Then you read up on how Rantanen was mad about the trade and that he would have taken a cut.

What are the chances that Rantanen's corner asked for a high number, expecting a counter offer below McKinnon's contract, and that the Avs panicked and traded him?

 

[dirtydanglez]

Saw the tail end of a discussion in which Bob Hartley was talking about Rantanen asking for more money than McKinnon was getting. Now, i dont know how true that is, but it had me wondering.

The hockey world seems shocked that this trade happened; usually you hear whispers that one player will get traded. I mean.. you would think he would have been shopped around more. Then you read up on how Rantanen was mad about the trade and that he would have taken a cut.

What are the chances that Rantanen's corner asked for a high number, expecting a counter offer below McKinnon's contract, and that the Avs panicked and traded him?

0.

avs gave their number and rantanen give his number. sounds like the numbers were far apart and the avs knew they wouldn't find common ground. supposedly the canes have been negotiating for weeks so the chance this was a panic trade is 0.

 

[WarriorofTime]

I'm not talking about the nuance of taxes, legalese, paperwork, certifications, and the like. I thought that was implied but I guess I was vague in those regards. I strictly mean in terms of "agreeing on a number." Rantanen knows what guys like Nylander, Tkachuk, Pastrnak, MacKinnon, Reinhart, and Draisaitl have recently agreed to. If we polled everyone on this forum in August, asking what Rantanen's next deal should look like, I'd venture to say 99% of us would suggest "between 11.5 - 13 million x 8." I'd have a hard time believing anyone would suggest under 11 or over 13.

So, coming to the number and term is a no-brainer. However, the gray area lies within the Avs cap structure, the moves they make during the year, and factoring in Makar's raise. Again, all the legalization aside, coming up with a number isn't that hard... hence why fans and media do it constantly when big-name players are up for deals... and usually, we're extremely close... because it's rather simple.

The difficulty comes in when a player's agent is determined to milk every penny and exhaust all leverage over a team, even when the players themselves just want a fair deal that can help keep the team together. That's when ego kicks in and agents begin fighting for their industry cred.

That is what I take issue with. Agents are supposed to work for the player... not dictate every aspect of their playing career and then inform them of the fallout. This Rantanen deal reeks of agent ego gone wild.

Rantanen was shaken by the trade, as was MacKinnon... and likely the rest of the club. And, I cannot for a second believe the Avs wanted to trade Mikko... but when the agent is bullish and not willing to budge off a number, the team cannot afford to be leveraged to their detriment. Agents know a hard cap exists and certain teams (Bolts and Avs come to mind) have established a culture of stars taking less for the stability of the team. Rantanen's agent was playing this like a blood sport and Colorado ended the game.

You keep making the agent out to be an evil person and that somehow Colorado and Rantanen were both victims of a bad agent. But this appears to be pure speculative fantasy.

First off, players select their agent, they can shop around and find the agent whose style most matches with what they’d like out of an agent.

Second, agents do work for their client, if they don’t, they won’t have very many clients. If an offer was made, the agent has to present it to the client. They can’t tell the client what to do. Just give advice.

From what we know, Colorado made a fairly lowball offer that likely would have been fair in a flat cap, Rantanen said no and that’s it. There did not appear to be extensive or back and forth negotiations.

I would say it’s very likely Colorado just made a conscious decision to not have too much cap invested in too few players because it leads to no Depth. Rantanen was deemed the most expendable so they weren’t actually all that interested in a “fair” offer to begin with because anything “fair” is still expensive just like MacKinnon’s “fair” contract still eats away at a lot of their cap the last couple years while it was flat. This is compounded by the fact that league wide there are still a lot of flat cap contracts out there that teams will reap the benefit of for at least a few more years. I’m sure Colorado is very jealous Florida has Barkov and Tkachuk locked in at $10 million and $9.5 million until 2030 for instance.

The ones being “ruthless” here are Colorado. That’s their prerogative. It’s a business. It’s just so interesting how Rantanen and now his “agent” (which I guess is easier because “agents” sometimes have an unsavory reputation) are the villains for not signing lowball offers and then not even realizing that an extreme lowball offer was the only way Colorado would ever bring him back.

 

[Habs Halifax]

I think it's quite funny people talk about the Avs not being able to afford and spend to the cap because it's going to be *checks notes* around 100M.

You know the Avs owner spends more than that on just TWO players one of his other teams? The Denver Nuggets. That play in the same building. He's also paying nearly $190M for Arsenal. And he's never underspent on the Avs in his ownership history.

Colorado will spend to the cap. They did this move for cap flexibility with signing important players.

I don't dispute that the Avs will not spend the max cap ($100M+) but their revenue last year was bottom 1/3 in the NHL last year at $182M. Basically, the owners profits get affected in this case.

 

[EdAVSfan]

I'm not talking about the nuance of taxes, legalese, paperwork, certifications, and the like. I thought that was implied but I guess I was vague in those regards. I strictly mean in terms of "agreeing on a number." Rantanen knows what guys like Nylander, Tkachuk, Pastrnak, MacKinnon, Reinhart, and Draisaitl have recently agreed to. If we polled everyone on this forum in August, asking what Rantanen's next deal should look like, I'd venture to say 99% of us would suggest "between 11.5 - 13 million x 8." I'd have a hard time believing anyone would suggest under 11 or over 13.

So, coming to the number and term is a no-brainer. However, the gray area lies within the Avs cap structure, the moves they make during the year, and factoring in Makar's raise. Again, all the legalization aside, coming up with a number isn't that hard... hence why fans and media do it constantly when big-name players are up for deals... and usually, we're extremely close... because it's rather simple.

The difficulty comes in when a player's agent is determined to milk every penny and exhaust all leverage over a team, even when the players themselves just want a fair deal that can help keep the team together. That's when ego kicks in and agents begin fighting for their industry cred.

That is what I take issue with. Agents are supposed to work for the player... not dictate every aspect of their playing career and then inform them of the fallout. This Rantanen deal reeks of agent ego gone wild.

Rantanen was shaken by the trade, as was MacKinnon... and likely the rest of the club. And, I cannot for a second believe the Avs wanted to trade Mikko... but when the agent is bullish and not willing to budge off a number, the team cannot afford to be leveraged to their detriment. Agents know a hard cap exists and certain teams (Bolts and Avs come to mind) have established a culture of stars taking less for the stability of the team. Rantanen's agent was playing this like a blood sport and Colorado ended the game.

I would like to add to this as well.

Obviously we have no idea how the convos went but I’m curious to know what expectations Rantanen’s agent set. Obviously the Draisaitl contract has been brought up multiple times, but who knows what the agent really set as an expectation. Maybe he made it seem like something approaching Draisaitl’s number was feasible. Maybe not necessarily 14, but perhaps something starting with 13.
You’d have to think the agent is going to have a hard time then going back to his client and saying, « well, I know I said possibly 13+, but we’re looking more at 12 or less ».
Obviously not exactly like the Klingberg case, but something to that effect.

Another point that isn’t brought up. We’ve only discussed AAV here. Nothing about contract structure or clauses. Draisaitl’s contract is basically all bonuses. 15.5M signing bonuses for 3 years running.
That’s 32M paid out within 12 months of the contract starting.

 

[Habs Halifax]

You keep making the agent out to be an evil person and that somehow Colorado and Rantanen were both victims of a bad agent. But this appears to be pure speculative fantasy.

First off, players select their agent, they can shop around and find the agent whose style most matches with what they’d like out of an agent.

Second, agents do work for their client, if they don’t, they won’t have very many clients. If an offer was made, the agent has to present it to the client. They can’t tell the client what to do. Just give advice.

From what we know, Colorado made a fairly lowball offer that likely would have been fair in a flat cap, Rantanen said no and that’s it. There did not appear to be extensive or back and forth negotiations.

I would say it’s very likely Colorado just made a conscious decision to not have too much cap invested in too few players because it leads to no Depth. Rantanen was deemed the most expendable so they weren’t actually all that interested in a “fair” offer to begin with because anything “fair” is still expensive just like MacKinnon’s “fair” contract still eats away at a lot of their cap the last couple years while it was flat. This is compounded by the fact that league wide there are still a lot of flat cap contracts out there that teams will reap the benefit of for at least a few more years. I’m sure Colorado is very jealous Florida has Barkov and Tkachuk locked in at $10 million and $9.5 million until 2030 for instance.

The ones being “ruthless” here are Colorado. That’s their prerogative. It’s a business. It’s just so interesting how Rantanen and now his “agent” (which I guess is easier because “agents” sometimes have an unsavory reputation) are the villains for not signing lowball offers and then not even realizing that an extreme lowball offer was the only way Colorado would ever bring him back.

No, the agents are the ruthless ones who go after the max deals (and yes, it's their job). I'm a fan of players like Mackinnon who take a little less and their family is still set for life. Leaves a little on the table for your GM and he can spend it on your teammates. The owners do not get more money, the teammates do. It's a 50/50 revenue split.

The Avs have every right to ask for a fair deal so they can stay competitive. Rantanen going after $14M vs $12M when he already has $58M earned. Basically, it's the difference between $170M vs $154M after this next 8 year term. After taxes, what are we talking about here? $90M vs $75M? I want that extra $15M so I can buy a boat lol.

 

[EdAVSfan]

You keep making the agent out to be an evil person and that somehow Colorado and Rantanen were both victims of a bad agent. But this appears to be pure speculative fantasy.

First off, players select their agent, they can shop around and find the agent whose style most matches with what they’d like out of an agent.

Second, agents do work for their client, if they don’t, they won’t have very many clients. If an offer was made, the agent has to present it to the client. They can’t tell the client what to do. Just give advice.

From what we know, Colorado made a fairly lowball offer that likely would have been fair in a flat cap, Rantanen said no and that’s it. There did not appear to be extensive or back and forth negotiations.

I would say it’s very likely Colorado just made a conscious decision to not have too much cap invested in too few players because it leads to no Depth. Rantanen was deemed the most expendable so they weren’t actually all that interested in a “fair” offer to begin with because anything “fair” is still expensive just like MacKinnon’s “fair” contract still eats away at a lot of their cap the last couple years while it was flat. This is compounded by the fact that league wide there are still a lot of flat cap contracts out there that teams will reap the benefit of for at least a few more years. I’m sure Colorado is very jealous Florida has Barkov and Tkachuk locked in at $10 million and $9.5 million until 2030 for instance.

The ones being “ruthless” here are Colorado. That’s their prerogative. It’s a business. It’s just so interesting how Rantanen and now his “agent” (which I guess is easier because “agents” sometimes have an unsavory reputation) are the villains for not signing lowball offers and then not even realizing that an extreme lowball offer was the only way Colorado would ever bring him back.

I don’t understand. How is an 11.75x8 offer and extreme low ball? It would make him in the top 5 highest paid players in the league.

There’s nothing ruthless about what the Avs did. They made an offer, got rejected and then pivoted because they didn’t want to be leveraged into a worse contract situation.

Rantanen is a UFA to be. His camp knows full well that the longer they draw it out, the better it gets for their client and the more pressure there is on the Avs. They simply assumed the Avs would keep upping their offer over time.

 

[EdAVSfan]

I still don't understand how could Rantanen have made a contract all by himself if the Avs were never ready to offer him a fair deal. His agent might have pushed too hard, but his closest comparables (Pastrnak, Nylander) have deals of 13+% of the cap, which are still under market value, and there is no indication that the Avs were ever willing to offer that.



Could you imagine playing in the worst team in the league, enduring the worst times of the franchise and helping them to a Stanley Cup while playing big minutes and being a superstar and a beloved locker room guy, and then your team doesn't even offer you a deal that similar caliber players have in other teams? There's always two sides to a coin.

I never really understood this line of thinking.

Let me ask you something. If Rantanen becomes a UFA on July 1st, is every team simply going to offer him 13-14% of the cap? Or are there going to be differing contract offers? Clearly the latter.

To suggest that each player contract should just follow the scale set by previous contract signings seems so short-sighted to me. Pastrnak is far and away, Bostons most important player. Rantanen (and no slight to him) is number 3 of 3 on his team. Why would the Avs organization be required to pay him to the same scale as another team did with their player when their importance is not the same?

Each team makes offers that are based on the value to their team, not the value other teams have assigned to their own players.

 

[WarriorofTime]

No, the agents are the ruthless ones who go after the max deals (and yes, it's their job). I'm a fan of players like Mackinnon who take a little less and their family is still set for life. Leaves a little on the table for your GM and he can spend it on your teammates. The owners do not get more money, the teammates do. It's a 50/50 revenue split.

The Avs have every right to ask for a fair deal so they can stay competitive. Rantanen going after $14M vs $12M when he already has $58M earned. Basically, it's the difference between $170M vs $154M after this next 8 year term. After taxes, what are we talking about here? $90M vs $75M? I want that extra $15M so I can buy a boat lol.

MacKinnon didn’t take less. The only “discount” he took was the eighth year one since only Colorado can offer the 8th year. He signed a market deal and has consistently had one of the highest cap hits in the league. So I don’t know why he’s being lauded as some sort of cap saving hero. Colorado hasn’t won anything on MacKinnon’s current contract.

Again, your discussion of the agent doesn’t seem to have any basis to it. And again, what dollar amount is “too much”? This kind of thinking would have kept player salaries well below the 50/50 revenue split. You seem to have arbitrarily decided a number was hit where players should now just say “ok that’s enough”.

Colorado made a ruthless business decision. They decided they didn’t want that much cap in that few players no matter who the player is or what they’ve done previously. No loyalty involved. And that’s just how it goes. And also why I don’t feel bad for the poor organizations and it making it harder on their cap sheet if they don’t just accept the first lowball offer that comes their way.

 

[a mangy Meowth]

Could you imagine playing in the worst team in the league, enduring the worst times of the franchise and helping them to a Stanley Cup while playing big minutes and being a superstar and a beloved locker room guy, and then your team doesn't even offer you a deal that similar caliber players have in other teams? There's always two sides to a coin.

So basically we have to shoot ourselves in the foot out of respect for the player otherwise in the eyes of finns, it's an act of outright hostility. Some of you guys are ing insane

 

[WarriorofTime]

I don’t understand. How is an 11.75x8 offer and extreme low ball? It would make him in the top 5 highest paid players in the league.

For same reason $7 million used to be superstar money and now is second line money. Percentage of cap is what’s most relevant. But it’s fine. The gm thinks he’ll get the depth to offset. That’s his choice.

 

[a mangy Meowth]

For same reason $7 million used to be superstar money and now is second line money. Percentage of cap is what’s most relevant. But it’s fine. The gm thinks he’ll get the depth to offset. That’s his choice.

We'll be fine. Worry about your own extremely disappointing club.

 

[WarriorofTime]

We'll be fine. Worry about your own extremely disappointing club.

Now you’re just getting emotional and lashing out. It’s a high profile trade on the main board. It can be discussed. You can always discuss “internally” on the Avs board if that gets you too riled up.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

It’s not a contest however the way you present it sure makes it look like you want it to be. And the bolded reaffirms that it appears that way. I guess a certain stretch is the season? In the end it doesn’t matter but your take makes it look like you wanted to use goaltending as an excuse while calling out others for doing the same.

I don’t think you’re understanding the context or content of the post I was originally replying to. It was about how the Avs have a better record than the Canes since Dec 1. My reply was that during that time Spencer Martin was playing games for the Canes which is a big reason why the Canes record was middling in the last part of 2024 and into the new year. Now that Pyotr and Andersen are back to doing the tandem I expect a better record moving forward. Georgiev wad traded shortly after this Dec 1 date so the Avs improvement in record had already happened due to competent goaltending.

The poster then said ‘don’t talk to us about bad goaltending, we had Georgiev on our team’.

My reply was that Spencer Martin has actually put up worse stats than him this year. I wasn’t saying anything about the overall impact of each goalie over the course of the year.