Weekes: Caps, Pens, CBJ have inquired into Hoglander

[Duffy13]

Karlsson will be easier to move in the summer after his bonus is paid, and the Pens will have 3 spots open to retain on contracts.

I'm not overly sold on Hoglander, he had an insane 20% shooting last year and is back down to his norm this year % wise. I mean I won't hate having him if he ends up on the Pens, but he's not someone I would target.

 

[biturbo19]

I like that it appears the Pens and Jackets may have some tangible interest in Hoglander. Since those are two of the teams with the most desirable "rental" defencemen potentially available, in Provorov and Pettersson. That's pretty convenient for Vancouver.

 

[Peter Griffin]

They don't really need to retain on anyone else at the deadline, though. The guys who will likely be traded at the deadline are Beauvillier ($1.25 million AAV), O'Connor ($925k AAV), Grzelcyk ($2.75 million AAV) and possibly Nedjelkovic (2 years at $2.5 million AAV). Using that last retention spot on Pettersson is exactly what they should be doing.

I think Vancouver getting double retention on Pettersson (Penguins retain 50% and the Canucks pay someone a 5th to retain an additional 50%) is the most likely way Vancouver gets the money to add Pettersson. That would have him down at basically $1 million AAV.

Adding Forbort going to Pittsburgh would be another way to help make some of the salary work for Vancouver.

 

[Luigi Lemieux]

Young, cost controlled middle 6 player? Of course teams are going to look into him

But then why does it feel like Vancouver media and fans alike are desperate to get rid of him.

 

[Three On Zero]

But then why does it feel like Vancouver media and fans alike are desperate to get rid of him.

Have you seen their prospect pool? They have players dropping to injury left, right and center. He’s one of the only pieces with value

 

[biturbo19]

Karlsson will be easier to move in the summer after his bonus is paid, and the Pens will have 3 spots open to retain on contracts.

I'm not overly sold on Hoglander, he had an insane 20% shooting last year and is back down to his norm this year % wise. I mean I won't hate having him if he ends up on the Pens, but he's not someone I would target.

The thing about Hoglander, is that he's always going to have a pretty unstable shooting% with spikes and lulls year to year, and even just for stretches within a season. He's not a real "volume shooter" who can stabilize that SH% or Goals total by just putting hundreds of pucks on net at all times. He's much more of an "opportunistic" or "quick strike" shooter/scorer than a volume shooter or "sniper". He's really good at buzzing around and jumping on broken plays...but that's a volatile thing to live off of.

I think he's actually been...particularly unlucky this season...but last year was also a clearly unsustainably lucky run where things were just falling into place for him (for stretches). The "real Hoglander" probably falls somewhere in between. He's probably ~15G - 30-35Pts sort of player...+/-~5G on either side of that year to year depending on that shooting luck and what sort of broken plays he can pressure defenders into.


So...it's really just a question of what exactly you expect him to be. His contract is pretty in line with that, especially considering he can notch those sort of Goals almost exclusively at Even Strength, and from the Bottom-6, without much help from skilled creative linemates and prime minutes. Conversely, he's also a pretty limited player when it comes to absolute "ceiling" and ability to mesh with skilled creative linemates.

 

[Duffy13]

The thing about Hoglander, is that he's always going to have a pretty unstable shooting% with spikes and lulls year to year, and even just for stretches within a season. He's not a real "volume shooter" who can stabilize that SH% or Goals total by just putting hundreds of pucks on net at all times. He's much more of an "opportunistic" or "quick strike" shooter/scorer than a volume shooter or "sniper". He's really good at buzzing around and jumping on broken plays...but that's a volatile thing to live off of.

I think he's actually been...particularly unlucky this season...but last year was also a clearly unsustainably lucky run where things were just falling into place for him (for stretches). The "real Hoglander" probably falls somewhere in between. He's probably ~15G - 30-35Pts sort of player...+/-~5G on either side of that year to year depending on that shooting luck and what sort of broken plays he can pressure defenders into.


So...it's really just a question of what exactly you expect him to be. His contract is pretty in line with that, especially considering he can notch those sort of Goals almost exclusively at Even Strength, and from the Bottom-6, without much help from skilled creative linemates and prime minutes. Conversely, he's also a pretty limited player when it comes to absolute "ceiling" and ability to mesh with skilled creative linemates.

In other threads, I've mentioned that we have Rakell, Beauvillier, Bunting, Hayes, Doc, Lizotte, Puljujarvi who have all had the same career Hoglander has... We literally have 4 or 5 variations of him... And these players are incredibly easy to pick up in FA. While there is nothing wrong with him as a player, there's no way Sullivan places him in the top 6, so Hoglander just becomes another 3 million a year bottom 6 winger, who won't be put into a situation to actually improve his numbers. Hoglander better hope that another team wants him more, I'd hate to see him wasted with this coaching staff. In all honesty I'd rather picks or prospects for anything the Pens are trading out.

 

[Rowlet]

But then why does it feel like Vancouver media and fans alike are desperate to get rid of him.

The team has little else to trade, the media can be ignored since they're just trying to generate views.

 

[Duffy13]

Is Hoglander likeable? Because some of these bottom 6 players the Pens have are tough to like, or even differentiate from each other.

 

[Pablo El Perro]

Can't see why the Pens are inquiring

 

[Duffy13]

Can't see why the Pens are inquiring

Gotta make it look like things are happening

 

[belair]

Can't see why the Pens are inquiring

Because their GM is Kyle Dubas.

 

[Bourne Endeavor]

Is Hoglander likeable? Because some of these bottom 6 players the Pens have are tough to like, or even differentiate from each other.

In terms of personality, he's a pretty quiet kid but works incredibly hard despite some obvious shortcomings. He's very streaky, and better served in an offensive role. I think Crosby or Malkin could get a lot out of him just on effort alone.

Just don't expect much on the defensive side. He's not bad at it per se but it's very clearly a weakness.

 

[Quinning]

Certainty he gets moved at this point. Can't risk his value plummeting.

 

[biturbo19]

In other threads, I've mentioned that we have Rakell, Beauvillier, Bunting, Hayes, Doc, Lizotte, Puljujarvi who have all had the same career Hoglander has... We literally have 4 or 5 variations of him... And these players are incredibly easy to pick up in FA. While there is nothing wrong with him as a player, there's no way Sullivan places him in the top 6, so Hoglander just becomes another 3 million a year bottom 6 winger, who won't be put into a situation to actually improve his numbers. Hoglander better hope that another team wants him more, I'd hate to see him wasted with this coaching staff. In all honesty I'd rather picks or prospects for anything the Pens are trading out.

Ehhh...i think Hoglander is a little bit of a different flavour from those guys. People like to call him a "middle-6 forward" but he's really more like...an offensive Bottom-6 Winger with some agitator traits. Most of those guys, especially Beauvillier, can't generate squat on their own. That's where Hoglander is different. He's not really a "tweener" per se.

He's a guy who actually belongs in the bottom-6 and kind of thrives there. He's done some of his best work with guys like...Sam Lafferty, and keeping his game simple. I'd actually argue...Hoggy is kind of the opposite of Beauvillier in that sense. He'll score his goals even if he is on the "4th line". Whereas Beauvillier is just an empty jersey skating around out there, unless he's in absolutely prime minutes in the Top-6 with linemates who can carry him (and even then he kinda sucks and regularly disappears anyway). So there's some potential value in that, even amongst a see of other "filler". He'll stand out in that mix. Just...doesn't play a game that meshes all that well with more skilled and creative linemates.

 

[Fro]

Not sure how Hog helps CBJ...solid pass for me

 

[Bishop7979]

Is Hoglander likeable? Because some of these bottom 6 players the Pens have are tough to like, or even differentiate from each other.

He's basically dupuis without the personality.

And I mean that in the best and worst ways.

Best - if he succeeds in the league it will be through hard work and effort.

Worst - limited high end skills set, inconsistent with offensive output, best serviced as a really good 3rd liner or 3rd while on a second line.

(Which means he probably would actually look good next to sid).

 

[Duffy13]

He's basically dupuis without the personality.

But can he grow the eyebrows?

 

[Bishop7979]

But can he grow the eyebrows?

The only things that were elite about duper was his effort and his eye brows

 

[Duffy13]

The only things that were elite about duper was his effort and his eye brows

Some times the effort came from the eyebrows

 

[Viqsi]

Not sure how Hog helps CBJ...solid pass for me

Going by advanced stats and comments here, he sounds like he'd be another high-quality middle-6 guy providing decent secondary scoring. Dunno if that's a serious need for the Jackets at the moment but I can see the appeal. He just gets oversold in proposals here so it's easy to dismiss him.

 

[joestevens29]

He’s worth a 2028 6th at best

Going by advanced stats and comments here, he sounds like he'd be another high-quality middle-6 guy providing decent secondary scoring. Dunno if that's a serious need for the Jackets at the moment but I can see the appeal. He just gets oversold in proposals here so it's easy to dismiss him.

Team could use an ice scrapper at this point

 

[dirtydanglez]

i could easily see the canucks shaking up their forwards, kind of a mediocre start so far.

 

[Viqsi]

Team could use an ice scrapper at this point

...I am unable to figure out what in the heck you're trying to say but I suspect there's not much substance to it to begin with.