GDT: Caps @ Pens 3pm . Honoring the great Mike Lange!

[eXile3]

The year is 2032. Penguins fans still blame Ron Hextall.

Seriously. That’s ridiculous deflection. Even worse, so you’re saying no one currently is responsible?

It wouldn’t matter anyway. If Hextall did mess the team up it’s Dubas’ responsibility to fix it.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Great job by Mike Sullivan coaching them to honor a legend like Lange.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

Damn, Errey didn't even show up for this. Sorta understand though. The organization did backstab him.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Seriously. That’s ridiculous deflection. Even worse, so you’re saying no one currently is responsible?

It wouldn’t matter anyway. If Hextall did mess the team up it’s Dubas’ responsibility to fix it.

I find it hilarious how much blokes latched on to Hextall because Yohe made it a narrative for why Sullivan failed. Hextall was GM for 2yrs. He really didn't do as much damage as blokes think. It's more sad that he's the excuse for things when the damage was already done when JR was trading away players because Sullivan wouldn't use them correctly and then the beef with Cole and the desire for Brassard is what set this team back.

Because in that moment - the GM let the coach dictate moves. They traded away a goalie that personally, was the future #1, picks, blah blah but the bigger problem was JR traded players that he should have told Sullivan to figure it the f*** out. It was never a Miller and Pettersson situation. It was a coach being a little bitch.

The fact he did it again with Kessel and you lot still complain about Hextall, lol.

There's 1 bloke that seems to stay unscathed each time. No one felt that was odd even after everything we know and have continued to see?

 

[AuroraBorealis]

In position to draft 6th now. Hopefully they lose tomorrow.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Damn, Errey didn't even show up for this. Sorta understand though. The organization did backstab him.

Errey wouldn't show up for a soulless entity that is the Penguins under Sullivan and FSG.

I respect him more for it.

 

[Extra Texture]

There is no Karlsson and Letang in the “deserves better” conversation. There are four players that were at least partially responsible for all three Stanley cups of this era. Crosby, Malkin, Kunitz, Fleury. That’s it.

I wrote what he said, which was two distinct points. These were Subban’s conclusions, not mine…

1. (Shows a highlight package of Letang getting walked) “Letang and Karlsson are having to force plays and you can’t do that in this league”. So I assume that’s him playing nice by not throwing current players under the bus.

2. Half a minute later he opined “Crosby, Malkin, Letang, and Sullivan deserve better”when lambasting the piss poor roster Dubas has created. As in, they should be surrounded by better talent.

At no point did he ever level (IMO legitimate) criticism at any of the players mentioned, and he completely absolved Sullivan of responsibility which was a huge mistake too. We can go round and round about who “deserves” credit for the Pens success. Personally I think Letang, boneheaded as he might’ve been at times his whole career, should be recognized as an important part of this era.

As far as what the org actually owes them, that’s another argument. IMO the only constant presence in our decline, whose performances have never matched that of the players, has been Mike Sullivan, but that is water under the bridge at this point

 

[Honour Over Glory]

In position to draft 6th now. Hopefully they lose tomorrow.

They usually do well in the 2nd of back to backs, even under a tosser like Sullivan.

I hope they get into a top 3 pick and then at the end of the season, fire Sullivan. Having a coach that can develop, play youth, generally just the opposite of the stubborn and ignorant predecessor will be fantastic. Then the Rangers suck just enough to get #14 and the Pens pick 3rd and 14th in the draft, setting up the future even more.

I can dream right?

 

[Honour Over Glory]

It was something, but it still wasn’t anything close to what is needed.

subban’s take was the roster is badly put together, that quality players like Letang or EK are “having to force plays” that put them in bad positions and lead to our defense looking like Swiss cheese. And of course, he lumps Sullivan in as a victim: “Crosby deserves better, Malkin and Letang deserve betterC Sullivan deserves better than he’s got”. No you f***ing dolt, he’s part of the problem.

He did call out Dubas though. Specifically his salary, saying it’s inexcusable Sid is playing at this level and the team is this bad.

Again, I don’t see how someone can lambast Dubas for the many things he’s screwed up, and the specialist in failure Sullivan walks away scot free after he oversaw the teams decline for 5 years and was somehow blameless . But I guess it doesn’t matter, we’re screwed either way.

Sid wasn't playing to this level until they essentially destroyed Malkin who was playing above that level, to get him producing again, and then destroyed the flow of the entire line up to pander to 1. Sullivan didn't even try anything different for Sid during that time, he literally did what he always does and then resorted to f***ing over Geno.

Dubas' roster isn't an issue, it's how it's used. We will never know because this team will never fire him and Dubas is going to let Sullivan sink another gm.

It's funny how even after using Kreider over Connor, Sullivan escapes all criticism each time. When his game plan in the first Canada game destroyed his players and went 0-2 after. But yeah, poor Sullivan, hasn't had his roster since 2017 and 3 gms failed him blah blah blah.

 

[sovietsanta87]

I wrote what he said, which was two distinct points. These were Subban’s conclusions, not mine…

1. (Shows a highlight package of Letang getting walked) “Letang and Karlsson are having to force plays and you can’t do that in this league”. So I assume that’s him playing nice by not throwing current players under the bus.

2. Half a minute later he opined “Crosby, Malkin, Letang, and Sullivan deserve better”when lambasting the piss poor roster Dubas has created. As in, they should be surrounded by better talent.

At no point did he ever level (IMO legitimate) criticism at any of the players mentioned, and he completely absolved Sullivan of responsibility which was a huge mistake too. We can go round and round about who “deserves” credit for the Pens success. Personally I think Letang, boneheaded as he might’ve been at times his whole career, should be recognized as an important part of this era.

As far as what the org actually owes them, that’s another argument. IMO the only constant presence in our decline, whose performances have never matched that of the players, has been Mike Sullivan, but that is water under the bridge at this point

Oh I know. I was just adding to what you were saying

 

[Honour Over Glory]

5 goals on 14 shots? Damn it Jarry Ned.

 

[sovietsanta87]

I don’t think they’ll fire Sullivan. He wants to be part of the “turnaround” and they think he’s the man for the job.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

I don’t think they’ll fire Sullivan. He wants to be part of the “turnaround” and they think he’s the man for the job.

This franchise deserves this shit.

 

[trader997]

It's certainly not Hextall's fault for how Sullivan used Granlund here. This guy would have made an impact if he had played on our 1st or 2nd line.

 

[SomeDude]

I don’t think they’ll fire Sullivan. He wants to be part of the “turnaround” and they think he’s the man for the job.

This is how the turnaround is going to go under Sully.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Just keep losing. Bring up Jarry, trade Ned, trade Rakell, trade Grz. Then this summer, trade Rust and EK as well.

Don't really give a shit about Sullivan anymore, man. I don't want him to be a part of the development of the next crop of building block guys the team drafts, but the team's hellbent on keeping him around as long as Sid imo, so I can't even be bothered to give a shit anymore. /shrug

 

[Ulf5]

No reason to subject our best goalie prospect to this.

Murashov should be ok, he's only going to see replays.
(Yes, I'm the one who voted for him as top prospect in the system in Nub's poll. Then #2 prospect. Then #3.....sigh.)

 

[Ragamuffin Gunner]

Ended up being a pretty great day for the franchise.

Pens lose and PHI, ANA, SEA, NSH, BUF and MTL all win.

 

[DesertedPenguin]

Subban's entire rant was based on the premise that the Penguins should be good.

Dubas' management moves over the last 12+ months have been based on the premise that the Pens aren't good, so it's time to sell some pieces off and stockpile assets.

It's just another classic case of a national talking head not paying attention beyond highlights and box scores.

 

[Andy99]

Ended up being a pretty great day for the franchise.

Pens lose and PHI, ANA, SEA, NSH, BUF and MTL all win.

Schaefer here we come…

 

[Extra Texture]

Oh I know. I was just adding to what you were saying

All good, I just wanted to add the full context bc I misread your post at first, and wanted to make sure I was clear that he wasn’t lumping EK in with the “core” guys that he felt were owed something.

Sid wasn't playing to this level until they essentially destroyed Malkin who was playing above that level, to get him producing again, and then destroyed the flow of the entire line up to pander to 1. Sullivan didn't even try anything different for Sid during that time, he literally did what he always does and then resorted to f***ing over Geno.

Dubas' roster isn't an issue, it's how it's used. We will never know because this team will never fire him and Dubas is going to let Sullivan sink another gm.

It's funny how even after using Kreider over Connor, Sullivan escapes all criticism each time. When his game plan in the first Canada game destroyed his players and went 0-2 after. But yeah, poor Sullivan, hasn't had his roster since 2017 and 3 gms failed him blah blah blah.

Personally, I think Dubas’ roster IS an issue, but it’s not the biggest one. And there have been good moments mixed in with the bad. But that it’s far from a binary issue. Because Sullivan has been killing this team with his one note mediocrity for a lot longer than Dubas could ever dream

Sullivan’s weird emeritus status in this league really bothers me. It’s like once he won the B2Bs he was impervious to all criticism forever in the hockey world. The only silver lining I saw with a US victory on Thursday was that some dumbass team like the rangers would pull out all the stops to hire him and get his shitty, undeserved contract the hell out of Pittsburgh.

 

[Gurglesons]

Subban's entire rant was based on the premise that the Penguins should be good.

Dubas' management moves over the last 12+ months have been based on the premise that the Pens aren't good, so it's time to sell some pieces off and stockpile assets.

It's just another classic case of a national talking head not paying attention beyond highlights and box scores.

PK Subban has a better understanding of what the Penguins should be doing than Kyle Dubas. That's for sure.

But, yeah we "stockpiled assets". We rebuilding baby! We gave away a 1st last year and a 2nd this year and we've basically recouped them. Plus everyone knows teams are built in the 3rd round!

Schaefer here we come…

Feel like he goes 1st.

 

[Andy99]

Feel like he goes 1st.

And that’s exactly what I meant lol…

 

[Gurglesons]

I wrote what he said, which was two distinct points. These were Subban’s conclusions, not mine…

1. (Shows a highlight package of Letang getting walked) “Letang and Karlsson are having to force plays and you can’t do that in this league”. So I assume that’s him playing nice by not throwing current players under the bus.

2. Half a minute later he opined “Crosby, Malkin, Letang, and Sullivan deserve better”when lambasting the piss poor roster Dubas has created. As in, they should be surrounded by better talent.

At no point did he ever level (IMO legitimate) criticism at any of the players mentioned, and he completely absolved Sullivan of responsibility which was a huge mistake too. We can go round and round about who “deserves” credit for the Pens success. Personally I think Letang, boneheaded as he might’ve been at times his whole career, should be recognized as an important part of this era.

As far as what the org actually owes them, that’s another argument. IMO the only constant presence in our decline, whose performances have never matched that of the players, has been Mike Sullivan, but that is water under the bridge at this point

I mean the roster given to Mike Sullivan under Kyle Dubas this year and last year is way worse than any roster either Rutherford or Hextall gave him.

And that’s exactly what I meant lol…

Can't see us picking 1st. Would be cool. Schaefer would be a huge add as would Hagens or Misa.

 

[Luigi Lemieux]

Ended up being a pretty great day for the franchise.

Pens lose and PHI, ANA, SEA, NSH, BUF and MTL all win.

And the rangers get blown out too, we're gonna get their 2026 pick. This is good. A bit of pain for the next year or two but with a high pick this year, and two high picks next year, by the end of 25-26 pens could have a good chunk of their next core set.