Confirmed with Link: Canucks Sign F Nils Åman

[Lindgren]

I totally understand that it's viewed as a second tier league.

I also understand that that is a totally incorrect opinion rooted in national pride. The AHL is better than the SHL and absolute miles better than the Liiga and the Czech league.

And I also understand that players who want to play in the NHL but are unwilling to use the AHL as a stepping stone for that goal are shooting themselves in the foot.

It's especially weird given the call-up possibility. I can understand that playing in Utica could feel like exile, but in Abbotsford, it would seem as though a call from the big club could come at any time.

 

[MS]

It's especially weird given the call-up possibility. I can understand that playing in Utica could feel like exile, but in Abbotsford, it would seem as though a call from the big club could come at any time.

I get it for guys in their mid-20s who are European stars (like Kuzmenko) where if they can't make the NHL going back and getting $$$ in Europe makes more sense.

But for a guy who is 22 and has a career high of 14 SHL points, if you're unwilling to view the AHL as a necessary stepping stone it's going to be very difficult to carve out an NHL career.

 

[Lindgren]

I get it for guys in their mid-20s who are European stars (like Kuzmenko) where if they can't make the NHL going back and getting $$$ in Europe makes more sense.

But for a guy who is 22 and has a career high of 14 SHL points, if you're unwilling to view the AHL as a necessary stepping stone it's going to be very difficult to carve out an NHL career.

I don't disagree at all, but I have long wondered how much cultural support clubs give young Europeans.

"Come on over and play for our AHL team. Nobody on the team speaks your language. You might have been a high scorer in the SHL, but the coach is a xenophobe who grew up listening to Don Cherry and thinks all fancy-shmancy Euros need 'tough love"'to learn to play in their own end and go to the hard places. Forget about power-play time. Get ready to watch videos of somebody who is 'hard to play against.'"

 

[MS]

I don't disagree at all, but I have long wondered how much cultural support clubs give young Europeans.

"Come on over and play for our AHL team. Nobody on the team speaks your language. You might have been a high scorer in the SHL, but the coach is a xenophobe who grew up listening to Don Cherry and thinks all fancy-shmancy Euros need 'tough love"'to learn to play in their own end and go the hard places. Forget about power-play time. Get ready to watch videos of somebody who is 'hard to play against.'"

Oh, absolutely.

In some organizations (likely the ones you'd expect like TB) this sort of support probably happens.

In this organization, it absolutely has not. We've run our developmental system like it was 1976 and guys have just been tossed in the ocean and told to sink or swim.

Thankfully, this is one thing that it seems like the Rutherford/Allvin group is very intent on changing.

 

[Fatass]

Oh, absolutely.

In some organizations (likely the ones you'd expect like TB) this sort of support probably happens.

In this organization, it absolutely has not. We've run our developmental system like it was 1976 and guys have just been tossed in the ocean and told to sink or swim.

Thankfully, this is one thing that it seems like the Rutherford/Allvin group is very intent on changing.

Might take some time for JR to repair our club’s reputation from the torturous Benning years.

 

[Get North]

Interesting how he made the Swedish World Championship team this year and his production in the SHL is not that impressive. But he's also young. Seems like Pierre Engvall type of upside here at most.

 

[PuckMunchkin]

I totally understand that it's viewed as a second tier league.

I also understand that that is a totally incorrect opinion rooted in national pride. The AHL is better than the SHL and absolute miles better than the Liiga and the Czech league.

And I also understand that players who want to play in the NHL but are unwilling to use the AHL as a stepping stone for that goal are shooting themselves in the foot.

Its viewed as a really difficult league to play in but for all the wrong reasons.

Physical. Horrible travel. Coaches that favor north americans.

Its not where you go to develop with a few exceptions (like the Leafs, Lightning or Pens system.)

Nothing to do with national pride. Unless you mean the AHL coaches preferring north american players.

 

[VanJack]

Just goes to show that you can acquire another teams' lapsed or semi-failed prospects without coughing up valuable draft picks.

Anan, Karlsson and Johansson were all drafted by other teams but never signed. And they cost the Canucks nothing but the money on their ELC's.

It just always seemed in years gone by, that Benning was surrendering future draft capital for these kind of players.

 

[dbaz]

Anan, Karlsson and Johansson were all drafted by other teams but never signed. And they cost the Canucks nothing but the money on their ELC's.

Burrows was traded for Dahlen (who played in the NHL last year) who was then traded for Karlsson.
Soo thats not exactly nothing

 

[PuckMunchkin]

It's especially weird given the call-up possibility. I can understand that playing in Utica could feel like exile, but in Abbotsford, it would seem as though a call from the big club could come at any time.

The European NHLers of years past who have returned home tell horror stories about AHL organisations to the current NHL hopefuls here.

Its probably (hopefully!) somewhat out dated info but it sure to have an effect.

CHL / NCAA have no such issue, plenty European prospects use those leagues as a platform to launch their careers.

 

[MarkMM]

Hopefully the Canucks investment in turning Abbotsford into a top notch operation will make being sent to the AHL not as bad a thing as it is in other franchises, being as close to Vancouver instead of a tiny town might help.

 

[Vector]

Hopefully the Canucks investment in turning Abbotsford into a top notch operation will make being sent to the AHL not as bad a thing as it is in other franchises, being as close to Vancouver instead of a tiny town might help.

Abbotsford is also not THAT bad of a place to live. The last 5 or so years has seen a real improvement. Granted, the majority of that is the new nice restaurants and breweries that have been put in downtown. The defining feature is being able to just go into Vancouver at any time without TOO much of a hassle*.

*you know, apart from all the congestion and accidents on the highway that turn a pretty simple 1 hour drive into a 4 hour excursion

 

[Peen]

Count me in for Abbotsford not being that bad.

The area in an around McMillan/Sumas mountain is quite nice to live in. Proximal to the highway as well.

 

[Vector]

Count me in for Abbotsford not being that bad.

The area in an around McMillan/Sumas mountain is quite nice to live in. Proximal to the highway as well.

It's great to raise a family here. Kind of always has been. Well, not when I was a teen since it was the pot capital of the world and so many people I was around became part of the drug trade. As far as I know, that's mostly stopped. I don't think it's a particularly appealing place for an early-20s hockey player but it's no longer the depressing hole it was for years.

 

[MS]

Its viewed as a really difficult league to play in but for all the wrong reasons.

Physical. Horrible travel. Coaches that favor north americans.

Its not where you go to develop with a few exceptions (like the Leafs, Lightning or Pens system.)

Nothing to do with national pride. Unless you mean the AHL coaches preferring north american players.

1) It's a league with a substantially higher level of play than the non-KHL Euro leagues and serves to bridge the gap and be a stepping stone.

2) Damn right it's more physical. And Euro players have to adapt to the increased level of NA physicality and a smaller rink.

3) AHL teams usually play the same system as their NHL parent club and so it serves to help that adjustment as well.

If you want to play in the NHL, you'd better be prepared to play in the NHL as part of that process. And if you aren't, you're going to fail unless you're a marquee talent.

If Will Lockwood or Aiden McDonough told the Canucks that they were either playing in the NHL or bolting to Switzerland when they finished their NCAA careers ... they would have no chance at an NHL career. If Juho Lammikko didn't spend that time in the AHL, he wouldn't be in the NHL right now.

Like, if you want to play in the NHL, you'd better be willing to take the steps required. If you think you can just wander in from a miles worse Euro league with no adjustment to NA rinks/systems/play ... it probably isn't going to work out for you.

And absolutely running down the AHL is a national pride thing.

 

[RutherPlan]

Abbotsford is beautiful, it's a nice balance of a city with small town feelings, it even has its own airport.

Some vantage points in Abbotsford has some of the most beautiful views of Mount Baker. If I had to guess the next real estate boon development in BC, it will be Abbotsford.

Richmond, Surrey, and Langley are dumps filled with suburban boxes. Vancouver is still one of the most gorgeous cities in the world.

 

[Vector]

Abbotsford is beautiful, it's a nice balance of a city with small town feelings, it even has its own airport.

Some vantage points in Abbotsford has some of the most beautiful views of Mount Baker. If I had to guess the next real estate boon development in BC, it will be Abbotsford.

Next?

NEXT?!

Motherf*cker it's happening now and has been very several years!

Yes, it's beautiful because of the views but around half the year, give or take, those views are completely obscured by grey cloud cover. I'm not even exaggerating.

 

[Vector]

1) It's a league with a substantially higher level of play than the non-KHL Euro leagues and serves to bridge the gap and be a stepping stone.

2) Damn right it's more physical. And Euro players have to adapt to the increased level of NA physicality and a smaller rink.

3) AHL teams usually play the same system as their NHL parent club and so it serves to help that adjustment as well.

If you want to play in the NHL, you'd better be prepared to play in the NHL as part of that process. And if you aren't, you're going to fail unless you're a marquee talent.

If Will Lockwood or Aiden McDonough told the Canucks that they were either playing in the NHL or bolting to Switzerland when they finished their NCAA careers ... they would have no chance at an NHL career. If Juho Lammikko didn't spend that time in the AHL, he wouldn't be in the NHL right now.

Like, if you want to play in the NHL, you'd better be willing to take the steps required. If you think you can just wander in from a miles worse Euro league with no adjustment to NA rinks/systems/play ... it probably isn't going to work out for you.

And absolutely running down the AHL is a national pride thing.

Yeah...this is my thing with all three of the Swedish signees this offseason. If you've signed the contract then you should be coming over to compete for a job, work with the team's development*, and be top call-ups. Guys like Hansen and Edler went through the same process and benefited greatly from the adjustment time. Canucks had a world-class AHL organization at the time, however.

*now that the Sedins are here and the GM is Swedish you really hope they can convince these guys that the best thing for their NHL prospects is to play in Abbotsford

 

[Bubbles]

I just want to Åman on a jersey, it's always cool to see Swedish letters. Like Nils Höglander.

 

[PuckMunchkin]

1) It's a league with a substantially higher level of play than the non-KHL Euro leagues and serves to bridge the gap and be a stepping stone.

2) Damn right it's more physical. And Euro players have to adapt to the increased level of NA physicality and a smaller rink.

3) AHL teams usually play the same system as their NHL parent club and so it serves to help that adjustment as well.

If you want to play in the NHL, you'd better be prepared to play in the NHL as part of that process. And if you aren't, you're going to fail unless you're a marquee talent.

If Will Lockwood or Aiden McDonough told the Canucks that they were either playing in the NHL or bolting to Switzerland when they finished their NCAA careers ... they would have no chance at an NHL career. If Juho Lammikko didn't spend that time in the AHL, he wouldn't be in the NHL right now.

Like, if you want to play in the NHL, you'd better be willing to take the steps required. If you think you can just wander in from a miles worse Euro league with no adjustment to NA rinks/systems/play ... it probably isn't going to work out for you.

And absolutely running down the AHL is a national pride thing.

Yes. Absolutely. For the players you listed. If you are a marginal player and don't need to or hope to develop skill, AHL can be a good place to be. If you end up in a place that actually has interest in developing you.

You have nothing to prove this has anything to do with national pride.

 

[MS]

Yes. Absolutely. The players you listed.

If you are a marginal player and dont need to or hope to develop skill, AHL is a good place to be.

All of Aman/Karlsson/Johansson are B/C level marginal prospects who need this level as a stepping stone.

If you're Elias Pettersson and you're a top-5 pick that has just blown the SHL out of the water at age 19 ... sure, the notion that you need to go to the AHL is probably dumb. But for the rank and file, it's where they need to be and if they aren't willing to go they're nuking their chances for an NHL career.

 

[PuckMunchkin]

All of Aman/Karlsson/Johansson are B/C level marginal prospects who need this level as a stepping stone.

If you're Elias Pettersson and you're a top-5 pick that has just blown the SHL out of the water at age 19 ... sure, the notion that you need to go to the AHL is probably dumb. But for the rank and file, it's where they need to be and if they aren't willing to go they're nuking their chances for an NHL career.

Id give you goalies. Goalies should go there to develop. And grinders.

If I want a top sixer who is a late bloomer to develop, I would probably want him in SHL right now that KHL isnt an option.

Its just the nature of the AHL. It is full of failed grinders. If you have enough skill to play in on a 1st line in europe, why would you play in AHL with the conditions that exist there? Also no talented under 20 year olds right? So the people who stick around are a very specific type of player.

Then you have coaches like Trent Cull who are trying to advance their own career over that of actually trying to maximise the value of the prospects of the affiliate NHL team.


Before KHL went to shit I would rank the leagues NHL , KHL , SHL, AHL, the rest of the euro bigs.

And no. I am not Swedish or Russian.

 

[Mr. Canucklehead]

While I do think there's a perception/thought among European prospects and free agents that they'd rather avoid the AHL, the Canucks now having their team in Abbotsford probably works a bit more in their favour. As AHL locations go, there are certainly worse places to be. And the proximity to the big club, and the ability to live within spitting distance of it and be available for quick recalls and assignments, are good selling points on it.

Not saying I expect guys like Karlsson, Aman and Johansson to go there if things don't work out for them making the big club right away. But it could still happen.

 

[MS]

Id give you goalies. Goalies should go there to develop. And grinders.

Everyone who isn't a top prospect who is a dead lock to jump straight into scoring-line/top-4 minutes needs to be willing to go there to develop and adjust.

 

[timw33]

Just goes to show that you can acquire another teams' lapsed or semi-failed prospects without coughing up valuable draft picks.

2nd 2nd 3rd 4th 4th 5th 6th for Vey Baertschi Pedan Pouliot Etem Bowey Larsen