Canucks Re-Sign Filip Hronek to 8y/7.25m Contract

[MS]

I'm going to take the hint from Vector here and ignore your ad hominem.

I will say: That I posted a JFresh chart does not mean I am wholly committed to all numbers within the chart. We also looked into the microdata, moneypuck and naturalstattrick as controls.

The tell should be that another poster and I both said he was a 3-4 Dman on a hot start, not that he was a bottom 25% defender.

Also, Hronek had mixed results in DET. Had one very good year in transition data, but was down outside of that spike. IIRC, it was when he was paired with Maatta.

I said JFresh was stupid, not you.

All this stuff is is raw data that can mean a whole lot of things. Unless you understand the context, it's worthless.

JFresh stuff (and most similar stuff) is just some guy who doesn't understand math taking raw data and then presenting it like Marek Malik was the best defender in the NHL in 2003-04 because he had a good +/-. It's shit. And the people like you lap this stuff up and say 'well the data clearly supports my opinion'.

For the umpteenth time, it was obvious watching the games that Hronek was an excellent player. However, playing next to Quinn Hughes on a team that didn't shoot the puck much led to some weird results in the raw data that these models utterly fail to adjust for.

And just because one other person agreed with your take doesn't mean it wasn't a tiny minority opinion. Again, the club has better analytics than you do and they pretty clearly thought he was a top-pairing defender.

 

[Peen]

Why are you guys completely incapable of speaking to each other respectfully?

society is just destroyed man ppl r nuts

 

[Vector]

society is just destroyed man ppl r nuts

Back to the Japanese mountains for me!

 

[LordBacon]

society is just destroyed man ppl r nuts

Im gonna sound like an old fart for saying this but it's the god damn internet.

 

[AlainVigneaultsGum]

Im gonna sound like an old fart for saying this but it's the god damn internet.

SHARE IF YIU DRANK FROM THE HOSE AND  SURVIVED

 

[mriswith]

Why are you guys completely incapable of speaking to each other respectfully?

There's a common denominator of someone who is purposefully inflammatory and raises the temperature of every argument they're in without initial provocation to do so.

 

[Vector]

There's a common denominator of someone who is purposefully inflammatory and raises the temperature of every argument they're in without initial provocation to do so.

Others are doing it as well and I’m thinking of a very specific conversation over two different threads that isn’t this one.

 

[God]

I posted this earlier in the year but the Hronek perception was also largely influenced by less than stellar WOWYs, which seems bad until you consider that the ice time with non-Hughes partners was low and pretty much only captured times during shift changes, which when delayed (like during a bout of sustained pressure) can pretty much make you look horrible. He's pretty much been stellar this year unless he was paired with Soucy, who made everybody bad.

Notably, JFresh did not understand this concept until maybe ~2 weeks ago when he was trying to figure out why Makar looked so bad without Mackinnon (fwiw I do not think it applies as much to this situation given that defensemen take more shifts than forwards).

 

[credulous]

hronek was trash in detroit. no fan there educated or otherwise was sad to see him go. he's been much better in vancouver but it's tough to get a handle on how good he really is since hughes dominates the puck when they're paired together. hronek is also a big part of why the canucks are the worst team in the league at defending the rush but the entire blueline save forbort are bad at it so he doesn't really stand out

 

[mriswith]

I posted this earlier in the year but the Hronek perception was also largely influenced by less than stellar WOWYs, which seems bad until you consider that the ice time with non-Hughes partners was low and pretty much only captured times during shift changes, which when delayed (like during a bout of sustained pressure) can pretty much make you look horrible. He's pretty much been stellar this year unless he was paired with Soucy, who made everybody bad.

Notably, JFresh did not understand this concept until maybe ~2 weeks ago when he was trying to figure out why Makar looked so bad without Mackinnon (fwiw I do not think it applies as much to this situation given that defensemen take more shifts than forwards).

Personally it wasn't just stats, he also just didn't look great in those brief early samples. Not bad, but not a world beater. Not nearly enough sample size to draw conclusions from of course, but it wasn't just advanced stats.

Up until Hronek every single Hughes partner looked one tier better than they actually were when they played with him, and people got suckered every single time into thinking whoever was paired with Hughes was significantly better than they actually were. And then Hronek didn't look nearly as great away from Hughes in those early tiny samples.

On top of that, last season Hronek looked amazing at the start of the season... but so did everyone. The entire team was on a massive PDO bender for the first half of the season that had everyone here convinced that every player on our entire team was a tier better than they actually were. And as soon as the PDO bender dried up, so did his scoring at almost the exact same time.

I don't think people were seeing substantially different things. I think people had different opinions about why they were seeing what they were seeing and the skepticism was valid at the time before this season started.

There's no skepticism anymore after this season.

 

[Nick Lang]

And back to the test!

 

[F A N]

On top of that, last season Hronek looked amazing at the start of the season... but so did everyone. The entire team was on a massive PDO bender for the first half of the season that had everyone here convinced that every player on our entire team was a tier better than they actually were. And as soon as the PDO bender dried up, so did his scoring at almost the exact same time.

Just commenting on his offensive production, Hronek has been fairly consistent the past 3 seasons where he's in that ~45 point range over 82 games +/- a few points.

 

[Jack Tripper]

hronek was trash in detroit. no fan there educated or otherwise was sad to see him go. he's been much better in vancouver but it's tough to get a handle on how good he really is since hughes dominates the puck when they're paired together. hronek is also a big part of why the canucks are the worst team in the league at defending the rush but the entire blueline save forbort are bad at it so he doesn't really stand out

Not sure where that generalization comes from - it's certainly not a consensus opinion among Red Wings fans.

The optimism around the trade from Detroit isn’t really about Hronek’s performance, but rather the fact that it allowed them to draft Axel Sandin Pellikka with that first-round pick. He's by far their top prospect and could potentially make up for the previous misstep of drafting Zadina over Quinn Hughes.