Canucks & NHL News, Rumours, and & Fantasy GM | Urge to Frenzy…fading.

[TruGr1t]

If Hoglander can be a piece you move to get a young 2nd pairing defenseman, you absolutely consider it. However, I do like the scoring depth we had early last year, when we were getting regular contribution from the bottom 6. When guys like Suter and Hoglander got promoted, we got basically nothing from the bottom 6 (doesn't help that Joshua got hurt and Lafferty/Blueger went ice cold). The team's lack of scoring depth hurts when the top 2 lines got shut down.

I think a Hog-Suter-Sherwood 4th line has a lot of potential and can contribute some key offense and destroy the other team's bottom end of the roster. This will be valuable, especially at a combined cap hit of like $4.5m. Hog may not be perfect (he is still young and can still improve) and his shooting percentage may regress, but for a contending team, he is a valuable depth piece on a low cap hit. Keep him, you worry about his next contract after the season (similar to Boeser).

**also, some of those middle 6 guys are inevitably going to hit a cold streak. Having guys like Suter and Hoglander on the 4th line to start the season allows Tocchet to change things up during the season.

You probably won't get a straight-up second-pair guy necessarily, but I'd consider parlaying him into a similarly aged defender on a similar development trajectory (ie. a younger, established NHLer that has had some success and potential upside). I have absolutely no clue about targets.

 

[sting101]

given the going price for 20 goal scorers right now garland is about market right now.

i was down on Garland in 22/23 but last year was a revelation in how much he can drive a line while not take possession time away from Miller Pettersson Boeser which could be frustrating. He's arguably the best 3rd liner in the NHL and that has immense value the way we are constructed

Loved the Gadzic story about when he played in the AHL against him in Tucson when he was always the one starting shit but also sticking around to battle it out. Pretty funny stuff and he loves being here now and is entertaining as hell. He's a core player and it would take a big offer that was too good to turn down for me to move him now

 

[bossram]

Would have probably prevented you from signing Heinen and one of the two defensemen. And Tarasenko had less goals than Hoglander.

Much rather have Heinen + Big Vinny D than Tarasenko.

 

[sting101]

If NY can’t get out of Trouba… are there any top four Schneider believers?

uhhh hell yes....Would be a perfect player for us

 

[Blue and Green]

If NY can’t get out of Trouba… are there any top four Schneider believers?

I don't think that the Rangers can trade Schneider because Trouba was so bad last season that they might need Schneider on their second pair. He hasn't proven yet that he's a legit second-pair player, but he's still only 22 so it's quite possible that he gets there.

 

[Lat]

Why is everybody thinking of a RD acquisition instead of an LD? I have way more faith in Desharnais on 3rd pair, with both Freidman and Juulsen behind him as a 7/8 D (both RD also).

I understand RD is more rare and all, but I don't think that should be as critical a factor.

My big concern really is with Forbort's legitimacy as a third pairing D and him being paired with Desharnais, so I feel that we need a good second pairing LD (trade) or third pairing LD (UFA) to bolster our LD.

 

[Bleach Clean]

Toffoli is a much better scorer than Tarasenko at this point.

They went for depth and upside. Heinen had 17 goals, they think they can get more out of Sherwood and Joshua offensively, and Hoglander should be good for 15-20 goals.

I’ll take the two-way play and depth over a 32-year-old ~20 goal guy at north of $4M AAV.

Of course you take a look at him if cap is no consideration, but that’s way too high an annual salary number for the Canucks given the cap situation post-DeBrusk.

I’d look at a guy like that at the deadline pro-rata if we’ve accrued some space.

Toffoli is a better scorer but Tarasenko is a better passer/creator. They both get to about the same 50-60 point total per year. Neither drive play.

I think they went with depth, not upside. The latter gets Pettersson players that think and create, much like Kuzmenko had done (Toffoli/Tarasenko). The former rounds out the roster and are Pettersson agnostic additions (what they did).

The depth route can still work by increasing raw shot differential, but we'll see.

They may have also forwent the Tarasenko option to hold cap back for a Damn too. Hard to tell.

 

[TruGr1t]

Toffoli is a better scorer but Tarasenko is a better passer/creator. They both get to about the same 50-60 point total per year. Neither drive play.

I think they went with depth, not upside. The latter gets Pettersson players that think and create, much like Kuzmenko had done (Toffoli/Tarasenko). The former rounds out the roster and are Pettersson agnostic additions (what they did).

The depth route can still work by increasing raw shot differential, but we'll see.

They may have also forwent the Tarasenko option to hold cap back for a Damn too. Hard to tell.

I just see Tarasenko basically as Kuzmenko 2.0. He is terrible defensively, and Tocchet would bury him somewhere unmarked. I doubt the Canucks had any interest.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1808611009248034923

 

[credulous]

the canucks need a second penalty killer in the lineup on the left side d so unless you replace forbort with someone who can also pk the puck moving bottom four dman pretty much has to be on the right side. hronek and myers can both kill penalties so you don't care if the guy you replace desharnais with is any good on the pk

 

[Bleach Clean]

I just see Tarasenko basically as Kuzmenko 2.0. He is terrible defensively, and Tocchet would bury him somewhere unmarked. I doubt the Canucks had any interest.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1808611009248034923

Those charts are debatable. I think Tarasenko is nowhere near as visibly terrible on defense as Kuzmenko had been. Not even close.

He definitely cheats offense though and doesn't play as hard on defense. Granted.

We have to remember that Kuzmenko wasn't jettisoned for being clueless on defense, but for having that and not scoring at the same time. If the scoring kept up, who knows? He may still be here.

They were in on Skinner too, so I think a one way scorer seemed to have been in the cards... For a price.

Edit: Maybe they felt that was Hoglander's spot to start? That they didn't want to move Hoglander away from Pettersson.

 

[Slapshot_11]

Why is everybody thinking of a RD acquisition instead of an LD? I have way more faith in Desharnais on 3rd pair, with both Freidman and Juulsen behind him as a 7/8 D (both RD also).

I understand RD is more rare and all, but I don't think that should be as critical a factor.

My big concern really is with Forbort's legitimacy as a third pairing D and him being paired with Desharnais, so I feel that we need a good second pairing LD (trade) or third pairing LD (UFA) to bolster our LD.

Myers is not a top 4 D

 

[VanillaCoke]

Hoglander and/or Podkolzin are going to be traded this year with our 1st. It’s almost guaranteed.

Kinda just want to do it now, get someone who moves the needle.

would take tarasenko if boeser was being moved, but in the absence of that, much happier with the guys we did target

Boeser either extends or is in Minnesota. A certain winger they have expires at the same time..

 

[BenningHurtsMySoul]

Gotta try to get my company tickets to the Dec 31st game. Corner glass seats.

Kinda just want to do it now, get someone who moves the needle.

At this point I think we know what we have with both of them. Hoglander must have more value but a higher ceiling.

 

[rypper]

Kinda just want to do it now, get someone who moves the needle.


Boeser either extends or is in Minnesota. A certain winger they have expires at the same time..

Ok I'll bite, Kaprizov has 2 more years, Boldy is locked up long term. The only winger who expires the same time as Boeser is Johansson and I'm sure you don't mean him.

 

[F A N]

I just see Tarasenko basically as Kuzmenko 2.0. He is terrible defensively, and Tocchet would bury him somewhere unmarked. I doubt the Canucks had any interest.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1808611009248034923

Tarasenko's two Cup rings would shine brightly enough to be quickly found if buried.

 

[VanillaCoke]

Ok I'll bite, Kaprizov has 2 more years, Boldy is locked up long term. The only winger who expires the same time as Boeser is Johansson and I'm sure you don't mean him.

Well dang, this is why you don't go off memory, but the Russian dynamo I was talking about

 

[arttk]

Why is everybody thinking of a RD acquisition instead of an LD? I have way more faith in Desharnais on 3rd pair, with both Freidman and Juulsen behind him as a 7/8 D (both RD also).

I understand RD is more rare and all, but I don't think that should be as critical a factor.

My big concern really is with Forbort's legitimacy as a third pairing D and him being paired with Desharnais, so I feel that we need a good second pairing LD (trade) or third pairing LD (UFA) to bolster our LD.

If we get a puck moving D then letting Hronek run a paring is an option.

 

[MarkusNaslund19]

Remember when LA looked so promising 2 years ago?

They somehow look a lot worse now

It's almost like the spreadsheet nerds coronated them far too prematurely.

 

[arttk]

It's almost like the spreadsheet nerds coronated them far too prematurely.

It’s more like nobody expected Blake to piss away all the assets and get like nothing in return.

 

[Burke's Evil Spirit]

Do not move Hoglander unless you're bringing in a young player like Pinto etc.
Canucks have done this in the past.. you draft a guy, bring him in, a bit of early success and then they're too fkin impatient to watch him further develop. McCann anyone? there were a few others too that slip my mind.

23 years old, 24 goals, 36 points. you dont trade this guy. You let him develop and you teach him and foster growth... then when he's 28 he's putting up 60 points and you have a legit top 6 winger.

This represents such a superficial understanding of Hoglander's contributions to the team. Anyone can put up promising stats riding shotgun with Pettersson and getting some fortuitous bounces. He doesn't have the hockey IQ to play in a prominent offensive role in this league.

You know who else was a promising 23 year old with a 36 point season? Jake Virtanen. Cutting him loose then would have absolutely been the right call. Instead we re-signed him to a contract we bought out.

 

[Wisp]

I wonder if Hoglander could be dangled for Brodin early season? This is their last season of huge dead cap (14m).

Edit: Hoglander can both be a good young player and a tradeable asset. You could go either way on him, IMO, and it'd be a reasonable move based on where the team is at. Canucks have a small window now.

 

[credulous]

It’s more like nobody expected Blake to piss away all the assets and get like nothing in return.

yeah they turned iaffalo, vilardi, kupari and durzi into darcy kuemper (via pld and the durzi for a 2nd deal) and moved walker, grans and a 2nd just to get rid of cal petersen's contract (and they also had to retain on provorov for some reason)

just all time panic gming

 

[Quinton Byfield]

Myers is not a top 4 D

He is closer to one than Soucy, who performed worse by pretty much all defensive metrics.

Either way, there's work to be done there, I can't imagine management is perfectly content with such a lack of foot speed and puck movement from the back end. None of us here can control what the team does, so there's no point worrying about it in July.

 

[Diamonddog01]

Why is everybody thinking of a RD acquisition instead of an LD? I have way more faith in Desharnais on 3rd pair, with both Freidman and Juulsen behind him as a 7/8 D (both RD also).

I understand RD is more rare and all, but I don't think that should be as critical a factor.

My big concern really is with Forbort's legitimacy as a third pairing D and him being paired with Desharnais, so I feel that we need a good second pairing LD (trade) or third pairing LD (UFA) to bolster our LD.

This is my thinking as well, and it lines up with contracts too. Forbot is here on a 1 year 1.5M deal while Desharnais was signed for 2 years at 2M. Not that necessarily means much but to me Forbort will be a very expensive #7 (once they upgrade the defense) while Desharnais will play on the bottom pairing regularly as he's definitely better than Juulsen and Friedman.

So

Hughes - Hronek
Soucy - Myers
LD - Desharnais
Forbort

Honestly I don't care for it at all. I will give management the benefit of the doubt as their pro-scouting has largely been good but man I hope there is a trade sooner than later.

 

[Nucker101]

Why is everybody thinking of a RD acquisition instead of an LD? I have way more faith in Desharnais on 3rd pair, with both Freidman and Juulsen behind him as a 7/8 D (both RD also).

I understand RD is more rare and all, but I don't think that should be as critical a factor.

My big concern really is with Forbort's legitimacy as a third pairing D and him being paired with Desharnais, so I feel that we need a good second pairing LD (trade) or third pairing LD (UFA) to bolster our LD.

Totally agree. Forbort is also pretty injury prone I believe and Soucy got injured a couple of times last season.