Canucks & NHL News, Rumours, and & Fantasy GM | Playing out the stretch.

[sting101]

Yep. I said it then. They should not have traded the Rangers' 1st. Has the potential to be an extremely valuable piece, where if they get lucky could transform the Canucks as a franchise.

you weren't the only one and i had people chewing my head off because i wanted a hard fast reset. Cant do that to Hughes playoffs blah blah blah and now look where we are?

I was was pretty convinced of DPeteys upside before he even came to NA and was willing to wait it out with Soucy or find a stop gap in free agency if he needed another year which he has shown he doesn't to make the team. Would have given us a HUGE piece going into the draft.

M.Pettersson is a good player just would have preferred we got him in free agency vs what we paid. I wanted Zadorov signed and with him and Soucy we could have bridged to DPetey and had the 1st to target a impact forward vs what we did plus not had the shit show of Brannstrom Juulsen Forbort early on that tanked the season.

This off-season we just have a ton of directions we can go in.

1 - Go heavy on the ALL in trade route and get your C and W that way. (Bye Bye Willander)
2 - Combination of Trades and UFA, Target the superstar Wingers and pray young guys like Lekk take a jump (aka target Ehlers / marner)
3 - Target the Mid class UFA Forwards and just even out the targets and look for later steals in the UFA Market and make some trades to balance it all out
4 - Trade Demko for a W and find another G for cheaper and use cap more effectively.
5 - Do nothing in the trade market, Focus only on UFA and keep willander, Dpetey etc and watch Quinn leave in a couple years.

And there are so many more options, it's gonna be wild which direction they will go

Not sure why you keep wigging out about Hughes. Obviously this year was a mess and the drama should be over. If Hughes is so sensitive about being a contender before he becomes a potential UFA then he's already gone because he was on board with moving Miller out.

 

[sting101]

Lol at Miller helping the Rangers. He's helping them miss the playoffs by at least 4-5 points when it's all said and done. In 2 years they'll try to get rid of that contract.

He's been one of their best players what are you talking about?

 

[calnuck]

He's been one of their best players what are you talking about?

Yeah seriously. I'm not a fan of Miller the person, but as a player, to imply in any way he's been bad for them or is a factor in them missing the playoffs is wild

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

D-Petey, Willander and Mancini inject a huge youth movement on Defence and it’s a nice change for once. Probably the highlight of the year has been the play o D-Petey

 

[Bgav]

trading a first and a really good prospect for a 32 year old and still missing the playoffs quite easily is still hilarious

 

[pitseleh]

Yeah seriously. I'm not a fan of Miller the person, but as a player, to imply in any way he's been bad for them or is a factor in them missing the playoffs is wild

I don’t think Miller has been bad by any stretch but it will be interesting to see what happens when at even strength he isn’t shooting 25% any more and his on-ice SH% inevitably drops from its current 13.4%.

 

[Hodgy]

I don’t think Miller has been bad by any stretch but it will be interesting to see what happens when at even strength he isn’t shooting 25% any more and his on-ice SH% inevitably drops from its current 13.4%.

I think we could also just see his play rebound. We sometimes forget he was effectively suspended by the team for ten games this year which would have a pretty significant effect on his play. Both mentally and physically.

 

[dbaz]

If they are actually going to compete next year they have to go in hard and overpay. Ufa isn't the way due to everyone having cap, it will have to be trades/offers sheets.

Buyout/dump Chytil. That's 4.15-4.4mil savings for next year. Use the savings to re-sign Suter

Trade Garland + for Tuch

Trade the Sj 3rd round and a 2026 4th for the 2026 3rd back from Calgary

Offersheet McTavish/Petkera/Knies

Use your 2025 1st, 2027 1st, Mynio etc to trade for a high end forward

 

[pitseleh]

I think we could also just see his play rebound. We sometimes forget he was effectively suspended by the team for ten games this year which would have a pretty significant effect on his play. Both mentally and physically.

Yeah, have no idea where it will go but Miller was having issues at even strength before his leave here while his PP productivity remained fine.

Score adjusted xGF stats pre-leave: Hughes with Miller 62% CF; Hughes without Miller 63%; Miller without Hughes 41%. (For comparison Pettersson was at 53% without Hughes over the same stretch.)

Now with Rangers: Fox with Miller 56%; Fox without Miller 56%; Miller without Fox 45%.

I was expecting Miller’s numbers to rebound after he left but he’s still leaving things to be desired. Of course he may rebound next year but if he doesn’t and his percentages regress he will probably start getting some heat given he still seems prone to the defensive miscues he was having here this year.

 

[sting101]

Yes obviously the Rangers have some rotten internal things going on. To go from Presidents Trophy to out of playoffs and listless spells room issues.

* Zibanejad has been a huge problem coming back so unmotivated and falling off a cliff. Team tries to trade him and he almost ends up here but shuts that down....he's being a baby and has become an anchor. Needs to wake up or they will get rid of him somehow
* Trouba getting axed wasn't very popular and threw the core for a loop. Seems like they never really recovered as he wasn't the only one that came back looking old and slow but moving his 9 million was a good thing going forward and for this off season
* Kreider is washed as a top3 line player and is basically a net front PP guy and 4th liner at 6.5 m
* Quick looks like he's almost done
* Zac Jones asked to be traded and is unhappy
* Parssinen Kaliyev are bad additions to that group stylistically. Both are terrible defensive players. They needed some guys who brought the Sherwood type efforts not 2 floaters.
* Perreault Othmann Berard need seasoning not big roles. Rempe is not a good hockey player
* Carrick Brodzinski Aube-Kubel are 4th liners or depth players not 3rd liners

Problem is they have no cap space and are vulnerable to a offer sheet for KAMiller or Cuylle plus the core is getting too old with bloated buy out proof contracts and the depth is terrible. How do you make solid additions without cap space.

 

[I am toxic]

I shudder to think if COL had gotten JT Miller. They would have waltzed* to the Cup

*No, you millenials, nuthin' to do with Disney, jfc learn how to tie shoelaces made out of string instead of velcro and look it up, it's music with a 3/4 beat, you nincompoops**, and you dance to it with a partner in ballroom, like you would even know what that is

** can I say nincompoops, or is it a bannable offence. anyway, yeah, the truth hurts

 

[David71]

This off-season we just have a ton of directions we can go in.

1 - Go heavy on the ALL in trade route and get your C and W that way. (Bye Bye Willander)
2 - Combination of Trades and UFA, Target the superstar Wingers and pray young guys like Lekk take a jump (aka target Ehlers / marner)
3 - Target the Mid class UFA Forwards and just even out the targets and look for later steals in the UFA Market and make some trades to balance it all out
4 - Trade Demko for a W and find another G for cheaper and use cap more effectively.
5 - Do nothing in the trade market, Focus only on UFA and keep willander, Dpetey etc and watch Quinn leave in a couple years.

And there are so many more options, it's gonna be wild which direction they will go

this feels like the likely scenario. you could even trade hoglander for more cap space if needed.

 

[sandwichbird2023]

Yeah, have no idea where it will go but Miller was having issues at even strength before his leave here while his PP productivity remained fine.

Score adjusted xGF stats pre-leave: Hughes with Miller 62% CF; Hughes without Miller 63%; Miller without Hughes 41%. (For comparison Pettersson was at 53% without Hughes over the same stretch.)

Now with Rangers: Fox with Miller 56%; Fox without Miller 56%; Miller without Fox 45%.

I was expecting Miller’s numbers to rebound after he left but he’s still leaving things to be desired. Of course he may rebound next year but if he doesn’t and his percentages regress he will probably start getting some heat given he still seems prone to the defensive miscues he was having here this year.

I thought JTM was injured/playing injured most of the season? He missed most of the preseason and didn't look right when he was playing. That might have something to do with his struggle this season, along with all the drama. I think he comes back better next season.

 

[Canucks LB]

this feels like the likely scenario. you could even trade hoglander for more cap space if needed.

Which feels like?

 

[David71]

Which feels like?

2 high end top 6 forwards but would have to overpay to get them. i.e ehlers/bennet but i doubt he comes back to canada to play. trade scenario is option B. option C=offersheets.

 

[Canucks LB]

2 high end top 6 forwards but would have to overpay to get them. i.e ehlers/bennet but i doubt he comes back to canada to play. trade scenario is option B. option C=offersheets.

The interesting part is, if we decide to go the "over-payment" Route, I think that only makes sense for Sam Bennett.
He fits the age group, seems like a tochett guy, and fills a significant need.
This opens up Chytil to the Wing, which solves a wing spot (if healthy) and also gives Raty a chance as a 3C, which i am fine to give it a shot.
But Sam is gonna cost 9m to come here imo, and that's a crazy price.
Also going after a 2c as a UFA means somebody like Willander would NOT need to be traded, and you can keep him as your myers replacement for the next decade.
I don't mind it

 

[calnuck]

The interesting part is, if we decide to go the "over-payment" Route, I think that only makes sense for Sam Bennett.
He fits the age group, seems like a tochett guy, and fills a significant need.
This opens up Chytil to the Wing, which solves a wing spot (if healthy) and also gives Raty a chance as a 3C, which i am fine to give it a shot.
But Sam is gonna cost 9m to come here imo, and that's a crazy price.
Also going after a 2c as a UFA means somebody like Willander would NOT need to be traded, and you can keep him as your myers replacement for the next decade.
I don't mind it

There's no way this team should go anywhere near Sam Bennett at 9m.

 

[Vector]

I thought JTM was injured/playing injured most of the season? He missed most of the preseason and didn't look right when he was playing. That might have something to do with his struggle this season, along with all the drama. I think he comes back better next season.

Seems like he had a neck issue. To me, the team’s issues boil down to Millet and Pettersson coming into camp injured and with the wrong attitudes. Those two plus Hughes should have been able to hold off the poor defense construction until an in-season trade was made. Sigh.

 

[sting101]

Would much rather Krebs than Bennett if you consider contracts

At the same age
Bennett had 128pts in 364 games.........29per 82
Krebs has 92 in 290 games....................26per 82

Certainly the immediate success and physicality or Bennett makes him much more attractive but his contract is gonna be a problem within short order and he's a grump at the best of times which could further sour the relationship if he fails to live up to expectations which is a certainty

 

[MS]

Yeah, have no idea where it will go but Miller was having issues at even strength before his leave here while his PP productivity remained fine.

Score adjusted xGF stats pre-leave: Hughes with Miller 62% CF; Hughes without Miller 63%; Miller without Hughes 41%. (For comparison Pettersson was at 53% without Hughes over the same stretch.)

Now with Rangers: Fox with Miller 56%; Fox without Miller 56%; Miller without Fox 45%.

I was expecting Miller’s numbers to rebound after he left but he’s still leaving things to be desired. Of course he may rebound next year but if he doesn’t and his percentages regress he will probably start getting some heat given he still seems prone to the defensive miscues he was having here this year.

I mean, aren't these just totally expected numbers given context and usage?

Miller is a two-way C who gets used in both high-leverage defensive situations and high-opportunity offensive situations. When he's being used in offensive situations, he'd generally be on the ice with Fox or Hughes. The team will score more. When he's being used as a defensive C in matchup situations and faceoffs in his own zone, he'd generally be with the D-pairing who gets buried in those minutes and would be expected to score much less.

 

[Hughes Clues]

A name that I've not seen mentioned here to sign as a ufa is drouin. Not a perfect player by any means but I wonder if he can be had for 5m or close to. That can be our winger replacement maybe?

And if we have any extra change we should go and get Tanner Jeannot too. He's a tocc player through and through.

 

[VanJack]

I shudder to think if COL had gotten JT Miller. They would have waltzed* to the Cup

*No, you millenials, nuthin' to do with Disney, jfc learn how to tie shoelaces made out of string instead of velcro and look it up, it's music with a 3/4 beat, you nincompoops**, and you dance to it with a partner in ballroom, like you would even know what that is

** can I say nincompoops, or is it a bannable offence. anyway, yeah, the truth hurts

Well, the Rangers got Miller. And they couldn't even 'waltz' into the playoffs.

 

[Ernie]

Yeah, have no idea where it will go but Miller was having issues at even strength before his leave here while his PP productivity remained fine.

Score adjusted xGF stats pre-leave: Hughes with Miller 62% CF; Hughes without Miller 63%; Miller without Hughes 41%. (For comparison Pettersson was at 53% without Hughes over the same stretch.)

Now with Rangers: Fox with Miller 56%; Fox without Miller 56%; Miller without Fox 45%.

I was expecting Miller’s numbers to rebound after he left but he’s still leaving things to be desired. Of course he may rebound next year but if he doesn’t and his percentages regress he will probably start getting some heat given he still seems prone to the defensive miscues he was having here this year.

I'm curious where you're getting your numbers from? NST has Miller at 46% without Hughes up until he was traded. Pettersson was at 47% without Hughes.

This would seem to be more of a symptom of how bad the defense was at moving the puck for the 1st half of the season without Hughes on the ice. When none of those 3 players were on the ice, the team was at 43%, so Miller was not a liability.

 

[Ernie]

I thought JTM was injured/playing injured most of the season? He missed most of the preseason and didn't look right when he was playing. That might have something to do with his struggle this season, along with all the drama. I think he comes back better next season.

The quality of Miller's play depends entirely on how motivated he is. He needs to be going 100% to be effective. Even for an intense guy like him that's hard to do.

We'll see how he responds to his team missing the postseason. If he comes out strong next season while the team around him falters, I could see him being traded again.

 

[pitseleh]

I mean, aren't these just totally expected numbers given context and usage?

Miller is a two-way C who gets used in both high-leverage defensive situations and high-opportunity offensive situations. When he's being used in offensive situations, he'd generally be on the ice with Fox or Hughes. The team will score more. When he's being used as a defensive C in matchup situations and faceoffs in his own zone, he'd generally be with the D-pairing who gets buried in those minutes and would be expected to score much less.

Usage needs to be taken into account but wouldn’t affect expected results that much. In the Hughes minutes you may expect an average player to put up ~52% and in the other minutes ~48% based on what we know about the effect of zone starts and qual comp.

Pettersson got much better results while also taking on a bunch of d-zone starts without Hughes. His minutes were slightly easier from a zone start perspective (42% o-zone starts vs 31% for Miller) but the difference is swapping one o-zone faceoff for a d-zone faceoff every three games or so for Miller.

You’ve got the usual small sample caveat when you start slicing and dicing things to this extent but I didn’t think he was playing particularly well either (relatively speaking) when watching him.

I'm curious where you're getting your numbers from? NST has Miller at 46% without Hughes up until he was traded. Pettersson was at 47% without Hughes.

This would seem to be more of a symptom of how bad the defense was at moving the puck for the 1st half of the season without Hughes on the ice. When none of those 3 players were on the ice, the team was at 43%, so Miller was not a liability.

I used NST’s line tool up to isolate from the beginning of the season up to November 18, not up to the trade. The comment I was responding to was about the leave potentially affecting his play so I was pointing out his results weren’t great up until the leave either.