Canucks & NHL News, Rumours, and & Fantasy GM | Petey's. Petey's everywhere.

[LemonSauceD]

Why would the Flyers be interested in trading him?

In my thoughts, I use the technique of positive visualization

 

[WTG]

Not everyone is salivating over Cozens, but point taken. Boeser is an enigma in that he's not so much a streaky player, as one who can look so removed from the game with his style of play.

His positioning and play away from the puck doesn't get enough credit and yet we're all aware of how lethal his shot once was.

He's not exactly a play driver, but I think he does make some of his linemates better with his cerebral approach to the game.

For whatever reason, he does seem to dog it sometimes as well, but that certainly could be attributed to his odd injury history.

I'd like to see him back, but would be careful of the cap hit and length of the contract. The Canucks org has always stood by him, through lengthy periods of unproductive play. Curious to see if that affects what he's willing to sign for.

I understand.

Personally, I think we all have cap PTSD from the Benning era. This management group has been very good at cap management. Despite all the contracts that have been signed that haven't worked out. They've been proactive at cutting their losses and getting rid of players who become a cap burden.

The Canucks aren't in a stage where they really need to be stingy about their cap situation. The projected cap space next year is 19.6 million and that is taking into account the OEL buyout (puckpedia). This means that management has a lot of movement when it comes to where to allocate capspace.

 

[sting101]

My preference is to sign Boeser to an extension, assuming it is at a reasonable price point for a reasonable length of time. I don't think it would cost much more than his current contract and the Canucks will have cap space elsewhere to make other additions. The fact is, the guy can score goals, is generally responsible defensively, has performed well in the playoffs and has been a Canuck for his entire career. Obviously if his ask is too much and a first round pick is on the table from another team, I'll drive him to the airport myself.

This is my take also.

Everyone just wants to constantly look elsewhere but by the numbers Boeser is just outside the top50 goal scorers in the NHL over the last 3 seasons which is upper half top line production.

Nobody on this team has as good a shot and finishing ability.

His skating is not great but as we've seen from the data it's not terrible and what he does best is be the catalyst to link plays together is strong smart and talented to do it and keep possession in a good way.

Combine him with a dominant play driver or on fast team that needs someone to execute from the hash marks down and you have an excellent player that is 27 and lots of runway still.

He's expressed a desire to stay and like M.Pett he probably leaves a little on the table to get it done.

 

[arttk]

I understand.

Personally, I think we all have cap PTSD from the Benning era. This management group has been very good at cap management. Despite all the contracts that have been signed that haven't worked out. They've been proactive at cutting their losses and getting rid of players who become a cap burden.

The Canucks aren't in a stage where they really need to be stingy about their cap situation. The projected cap space next year is 19.6 million and that is taking into account the OEL buyout (puckpedia). This means that management has a lot of movement when it comes to where to allocate capspace.

Yeah depending on the upgrades available, garland and Soucy are still assets we can move. Before people jump on me for mentioning Garland, just want to say this is a move we can potentially make.

 

[Agent007]

Friedman mentioned that if Alex Tuch was available the Lightning would go hard for him. I'd trade an extended Boeser for him

For what it's worth there was a post on the trade board that mentioned Tuch's wife is from the Vancouver area and there's talk she would be happy to come back this way to raise their new and growing family.

 

[Hodgy]

Boeser is a .8pts per game player in his career of 525 games. He has 23 points in 29 games in the playoffs. You can call him streaky but he produces.

Everybody here is salivating over Cozens who is 4 years younger than him (23 vs 27) but has 0.22pts/game less than Boeser. Boeser has 8 more points than Cozens in 7 less games this year. All while recovering from a concussion in early November!

Cozens also makes more f***ing money than Boeser does now (7.1m vs 6.65m). What the f*** are we talking about dumping Boeser for? Can Cozens even cover what the team would lose trading Boeser? (EDIT: Came off as a little heated, mb).

I think the problem is that Boeser wants to be paid like a 40 goal scorer, and if he had more consistently played like he did last year (including the playoffs) then I don't think it would be a problem. But the reality is, Boeser is on pace to score 28 goals this year, and before last year, scored 18, 23, 23 (this was the Covid season, so over a 70 game pace he would have had 33 goals), 16, 26, and 29, respectively.

So, Boeser has scored 40 goals once, and in the Covid season, probably would have scored around 33 goals accounting for his pace and his usual injuries.

And there lies the problem. Is Boeser at 30-40 goal scorer? Or is he a 20-30 goal scorer? Probably somewhere in the middle.

And we know he's not a play driver as well.

Frankly, if the Canucks had better depth and young players and prospects who could internally replace Boeser I would easily move on from him. But we don't, so it makes it a difficult decision.

 

[sting101]

Morgan Geekie would be a good target to replace Suter if we cant get a bigger fish through trade.

Right shot C would fit in well with Garland Joshua on a 3rd line

 

[WTG]

I think the problem is that Boeser wants to be paid like a 40 goal scorer, and if he had more consistently played like he did last year (including the playoffs) then I don't think it would be a problem. But the reality is, Boeser is on pace to score 28 goals this year, and before last year, scored 18, 23, 23 (this was the Covid season, so over a 70 game pace he would have had 33 goals), 16, 26, and 29, respectively.

So, Boeser has scored 40 goals once, and in the Covid season, probably would have scored around 33 goals accounting for his pace and his usual injuries.

And there lies the problem. Is Boeser at 30-40 goal scorer? Or is he a 20-30 goal scorer? Probably somewhere in the middle.

And we know he's not a play driver as well.

Frankly, if the Canucks had better depth and young players and prospects who could internally replace Boeser I would easily move on from him. But we don't, so it makes it a difficult decision.

I haven't seen anywhere what the contract demands are for Boeser and what he and his agent value him as.

 

[Hodgy]

I haven't seen anywhere what the contract demands are for Boeser and what he and his agent value him as.

Ya, fair enough. I am inferring that he is looking for 40 goal type money. It would be surprising if he was looking for 25-30 goal type money and the Canucks weren't willing to extend him at that

 

[iceburg]

I wonder how Boeser took the news that a newly acquired player was signed so quickly when he’s expressed he’s wanted to re-sign here.

Boeser: "I might be asking for too much"

Seriously though, nobody knows what Boeser is asking for and what the club has offered. We know they are talking. We know he has yet to sign. That is all we know.
I would be shocked if they haven't at least talked big picture range. And, if so, neither party is rushing to meet what the other might accept.

 

[Nuckles]

I think the problem is that Boeser wants to be paid like a 40 goal scorer, and if he had more consistently played like he did last year (including the playoffs) then I don't think it would be a problem. But the reality is, Boeser is on pace to score 28 goals this year, and before last year, scored 18, 23, 23 (this was the Covid season, so over a 70 game pace he would have had 33 goals), 16, 26, and 29, respectively.

So, Boeser has scored 40 goals once, and in the Covid season, probably would have scored around 33 goals accounting for his pace and his usual injuries.

And there lies the problem. Is Boeser at 30-40 goal scorer? Or is he a 20-30 goal scorer? Probably somewhere in the middle.

And we know he's not a play driver as well.

Frankly, if the Canucks had better depth and young players and prospects who could internally replace Boeser I would easily move on from him. But we don't, so it makes it a difficult decision.

It also doesn't help that the centre he had great chemistry with last season is gone, and Boeser has looked terrible next to Petey this season.

If after the 4 Nations break he continues to look the same, I'd move on from him. It's not worth the risk to give him a massive long-term contract with his play this season and the previous few seasons.

 

[Hodgy]

It also doesn't help that the centre he had great chemistry with last season is gone, and Boeser has looked terrible next to Petey this season.

Ya, I have said that before as well. I'd hate to be Allvin trying to decide to extend Boeser, to a long term contract, when he is currently not producing with any of our current centres, and had his best years with a centre that is no longer on our team. I think there was always going to be a fair bit of risk with any Boeser extension. He was quite inconsistent under his last contract, and I think its pretty doubtful whether he ultimately provided value given his cap hit under that contract. So you've got that inconsistency you need to deal with, and now you don't even have any comfort that he can play well with either of your top two centres. Kind of like extending a player you acquire via trade before seeing how that player will play.

 

[sandwichbird2023]

I think the problem is that Boeser wants to be paid like a 40 goal scorer, and if he had more consistently played like he did last year (including the playoffs) then I don't think it would be a problem. But the reality is, Boeser is on pace to score 28 goals this year, and before last year, scored 18, 23, 23 (this was the Covid season, so over a 70 game pace he would have had 33 goals), 16, 26, and 29, respectively.

So, Boeser has scored 40 goals once, and in the Covid season, probably would have scored around 33 goals accounting for his pace and his usual injuries.

And there lies the problem. Is Boeser at 30-40 goal scorer? Or is he a 20-30 goal scorer? Probably somewhere in the middle.

And we know he's not a play driver as well.

Frankly, if the Canucks had better depth and young players and prospects who could internally replace Boeser I would easily move on from him. But we don't, so it makes it a difficult decision.

Rumor was, I think, that Boeser was looking at something in the range of $8x8? With the new cap increases, that is no longer a 40 goal scorer money, most likely a 25-30 goal scorer money in a couple years. The cap hit doesn't scare me, its the term. He will want a long term contract but I just don't see him being an effective player in a couple years, and carrying a $8m cap hit on an ineffective player is going to sting.

I also feel Boeser's past numbers are deceiving. On talent, I don't think he is a 40 goal player, but he was put in a good situation the last 5 years playing with either Petey, JT or both, and almost all the PP1 time. He has probably one of the best deployment for a winger in the league. It doesn't look likely that he will be lining up with another 100 pt center here again, so his offensive projection needs to be adjusted accordingly.

I would do $8m for 4 years, but I doubt he will take that.

**Edit: also Boeser doesn't have any other utilities outside of scoring goals. He can't PK, shouldn't be relied on to be on a matchup line, doesn't drive offense, isn't an elite playmaker, nor does he bring speed or physicality. The only intangibles you can argue is that he was drafted by Vancouver and played his career here, and is a good teammate and an amazing person. On the ice, you are really paying for a one-dimensional scorer that doesn't score consistently and is no guarantee to score 35+ again. Its a risky proposition. The only reason you would do an extension with him is that you can't find anything better (or better value) than him.

 

[theguardianII]

Boeser: "I might be asking for too much"

Asking not enough! Remember he asked for a trade twice before and the Canuck's (Allvin) even had his agent searching for trade partners. That is an a lot of effort and not insignificant.

Now he has a choice. Last contract he was still a RFA and it was the beginning of a new regime.
Still it was less than 14 months and the trade demand.

If it gets rumored he was asking too much that eases the reactions from the market, not on management. But that is just a story

Just to point out that having younger players under contract control (RFAs) last a long time at less of a cap hit.

There are real contending teams that he could go to as a reward for being a good soldier, Winnipeg, Carolina, Devils or reunite with Horvat of Miller

 

[arttk]

Cap super tight for 1 year but it COULD work.

 

[Hodgy]

Rumor was, I think, that Boeser was looking at something in the range of $8x8? With the new cap increases, that is no longer a 40 goal scorer money, most likely a 25-30 goal scorer money in a couple years. The cap hit doesn't scare me, its the term. He will want a long term contract but I just don't see him being an effective player in a couple years, and carrying a $8m cap hit on an ineffective player is going to sting.

I also feel Boeser's past numbers are deceiving. On talent, I don't think he is a 40 goal player, but he was put in a good situation the last 5 years playing with either Petey, JT or both, and almost all the PP1 time. He has probably one of the best deployment for a winger in the league. It doesn't look likely that he will be lining up with another 100 pt center here again, so his offensive projection needs to be adjusted accordingly.

I would do $8m for 4 years, but I doubt he will take that.

**Edit: also Boeser doesn't have any other utilities outside of scoring goals. He can't PK, shouldn't be relied on to be on a matchup line, doesn't drive offense, isn't an elite playmaker, nor does he bring speed or physicality. The only intangibles you can argue is that he was drafted by Vancouver and played his career here, and is a good teammate and an amazing person. On the ice, you are really paying for a one-dimensional scorer that doesn't score consistently and is no guarantee to score 35+ again. Its a risky proposition. The only reason you would do an extension with him is that you can't find anything better (or better value) than him.

Generally agreed. I guess we will or may hear what his current salary demands are, but I would be surprised if it is in the 25-30 goal scorer range post salary cap inflation. Teams and agents aren't stupid, and any negotiations will already bake in the salary cap inflation. And if I am Boeser, and unless I want to take a home town discount, I would just wait until free agency and price myself in the 35-40 goal scorer market.

 

[xtr3m]

Cap super tight for 1 year but it COULD work.
View attachment 973473

Apparently Ranta is looking for 14+. Avs probably knew it and decided to nope out of it without even trying to re-sign him. There will be a bidding war and his camp will probably use Canucks as leverage, Guentzel-style.

 

[sandwichbird2023]

Generally agreed. I guess we will or may hear what his current salary demands are, but I would be surprised if it is in the 25-30 goal scorer range post salary cap inflation. Teams and agents aren't stupid, and any negotiations will already bake in the salary cap inflation. And if I am Boeser, and unless I want to take a home town discount, I would just wait until free agency and price myself in the 35-40 goal scorer market.

I think if Boeser provides more utilities, than even if he only projected as a 25-30 goal scorer going forward, management would've signed him to $8x8 by now. Its the fact that he doesn't do much else that is the problem. A 25-30 goal scorer that can kill penalties, or that plays hard EV minutes and winning them, or even just really good at faceoff or on the PP, or score 25 goals but put up 70 pts, etc, those players are still worth $8m+. I just don't see that with BB6.

There is also the opportunity cost as well. Keeping Brock means we lose out on any assets via a TDL transaction (likely a high pick and/or a prospect). It also mean we are unlikely to dole out significant money for an upgrade on F as he would be taking a chunk of the available money. He would also block a younger player from bigger role. There are a lot more that goes into this decision than just money and term.

 

[credulous]

the issue with boeser isn't going to be whether the canucks can afford him it's how long he can remain effective. two of his last four seasons he's been more or less a replacement level player. do you really want to sign someone to an 8 year deal where when you take aging into account you might get 3 good seasons out of them? and not even necessarily three consecutive seasons up front?

i think the canucks might be backed into a corner somewhere where they have no depth on wing and not enough assets to go out and fix that and are forced into signing boeser but it's a real gamble whether you get a top line winger who can put in 30+ goals like 2020 and 2024 boeser or you get a guy making 8-9m to score 20 and look slow and poor defensively like you got in 2021-2023 boeser

 

[ahmon]

I think if Boeser provides more utilities, than even if he only projected as a 25-30 goal scorer going forward, management would've signed him to $8x8 by now. Its the fact that he doesn't do much else that is the problem. A 25-30 goal scorer that can kill penalties, or that plays hard EV minutes and winning them, or even just really good at faceoff or on the PP, or score 25 goals but put up 70 pts, etc, those players are still worth $8m+. I just don't see that with BB6.

There is also the opportunity cost as well. Keeping Brock means we lose out on any assets via a TDL transaction (likely a high pick and/or a prospect). It also mean we are unlikely to dole out significant money for an upgrade on F as he would be taking a chunk of the available money. He would also block a younger player from bigger role. There are a lot more that goes into this decision than just money and term.

yup
exactly.

You basically summed it up well.

 

[Wisp]

the issue with boeser isn't going to be whether the canucks can afford him it's how long he can remain effective. two of his last four seasons he's been more or less a replacement level player.

What? Replacement level? All of his last 4 seasons have him hid him at a 20+ goal pace and 50+ point ballpark, usually doing it versus tough comp on Miller's wing.

I have plenty of time for arguments around age related decline will affect him and how many more 30 goal paced seasons he has in him. But lets not say silly things like "he's been a replacement level player."

 

[Just A Bit Outside]

Friedman mentioned that if Alex Tuch was available the Lightning would go hard for him. I'd trade an extended Boeser for him

f*** off Tampa.

You stole Guentzel away from us.

Let us have Tuch.

 

[sting101]

It also doesn't help that the centre he had great chemistry with last season is gone, and Boeser has looked terrible next to Petey this season.

If after the 4 Nations break he continues to look the same, I'd move on from him. It's not worth the risk to give him a massive long-term contract with his play this season and the previous few seasons.

Does this not apply to anyone that doesn't drive their own offense? It's really a nothing point this year

The 2 have had past success and will still be good on the PP with Hughes. the issue is both of them need speed and strength to help them maintain possession or be with a guy like Hughes dancing around everyone.

It makes the most sense to split them up at 5v5 and then find the 2 guys to compliment them best

I don't think were in a position to chisel off more goals from this group

**Edit: also Boeser doesn't have any other utilities outside of scoring goals. He can't PK, shouldn't be relied on to be on a matchup line, doesn't drive offense, isn't an elite playmaker, nor does he bring speed or physicality. The only intangibles you can argue is that he was drafted by Vancouver and played his career here, and is a good teammate and an amazing person. On the ice, you are really paying for a one-dimensional scorer that doesn't score consistently and is no guarantee to score 35+ again. Its a risky proposition. The only reason you would do an extension with him is that you can't find anything better (or better value) than him.

Who cares about the PK. Did just fine last year with Miller as a match up line. He doesn't have to drive offense it's nothing new. Speed and physicality is nothing without skill. He's an excellent playmaker and players with his scoring ability are hard to get. If it was so easy then why have we constantly been spinning our wheels here trying to add quality scoring.

It's nonsensical building a case against Boeser until we know his ask. If he plays ball and wants to take a good contract for both sides then get it done...."the risk" is going to UFA with 31 other teams loaded with insane amounts of cap space and getting into bidding wars over 29-35yr olds

 

[Breakers]

Funny hearing Ferraro talking about Pettersson

“He plays Detroit and is flying through the neutral zone and had those 2 on 1’s and barely missed and hit the crossbar in the slot, and you are so encouraged and want to think he’s back”

“Then he plays Colorado against Mackinnon who was dangerous every shift, and Pettersson looked like an AHL call up”

“I just don’t get it with him right now, it is so polarizing as a player, the interest level from him when he is off is non existent”

 

[sting101]

the issue with boeser isn't going to be whether the canucks can afford him it's how long he can remain effective. two of his last four seasons he's been more or less a replacement level player. do you really want to sign someone to an 8 year deal where when you take aging into account you might get 3 good seasons out of them? and not even necessarily three consecutive seasons up front?

i think the canucks might be backed into a corner somewhere where they have no depth on wing and not enough assets to go out and fix that and are forced into signing boeser but it's a real gamble whether you get a top line winger who can put in 30+ goals like 2020 and 2024 boeser or you get a guy making 8-9m to score 20 and look slow and poor defensively like you got in 2021-2023 boeser

2yrs of which he was going through off ice and injury issues with a team in turmoil