Canucks News, Rumours, and & Fantasy GM | Off-Season Edition | Not satisfied, so now what?

[Mr. Canucklehead]

Last one was over 1,000. Continue here.

Vector, here, I've taken over this original post. Here's the link to my spreadsheet. Contains regularly updated capspace totals, projected rosters, and UFA & RFA lists with AFP's contract projections.

Click to read more...

 

[Vector]

The young but old looking guy?

That’s the joke, yeah.

 

[ManVanFan]

Twitter is going on about Pettersson having a girlfriend?

 

[Jerry the great]

While it's just for the sake of discussion, there's no way I'd want any part of kotkaniemis contract..comes w the 10 team ntc to boot that kicks in next season. This is the same thing we dealt w dealing away loui. U deal short term pain for long term pain lol. He could come around, but U wanna risk 5 more years of that if he doesn't?

totally different situation IMO. we bought (for an insane price) a guy that had 11 NHL seasons under his belt, had peaked years prior, was being paid ~2x what he was worth and had 6 years left on his deal. There was no possibility that he was ever going to recapture his form let alone any upside. it was obvious from the moment the trade call was made that it was a disaster.

Kotkaniemi is still really young and his contract might age poorly, but it might not. Last season it looked like he was breaking out and scored at a half point/game clip, lots of it at 5v5 (as a 22 year old). FWIW that production was better than what Lindholm or Eriksson Ek put up at the same age. He took a step back this year and was sort of passed by Drury on the depth charts, but he's only 23 and development of pro athletes is often not linear or free of ups and downs. If he ends up a 20-30 point C without much special teams utility, he's probably overpaid by a million or so per year. If he's a 40-50 point player, he's probably underpaid by a million/year if he levels up from there, he's a steal.

If it doesn't look like he's on the right track, he can be bought out for peanuts in the summer of 2026 (850k for 5 years; 470k for 3).

 

[Bleach Clean]

What if we traded Hronek to Seattle for Adam Larsson. signed for 1 year at $4MM and then UFA. Can see him fitting in well with either Hughes or Soucy and would give us a significant amount of cap flexibility on the back end and likely won't be crippling to extend (3X$4.5MM?).

could run with something like

($11.85) Hughes Larson
($$8.25) Soucy Tanev ($5MM)
($$8.50) Zadorov Chatfield ($5MM + $3.5MM)
($$.775) Juulsen
$29.375


Sutter Miller Boeser
Hoglander Pettersson XXX
Joshua ($3.25MM) Blueger ($2.1MM) Garland
Podkolzin Aman PDG
$1MM spare
$42.85MM

After Benning tax + goalies you'd have ~$7MM to spend on XXX (could swap Zadorov for Dillion to free up an additional $2MM.

It's creative, but does Seattle pay Hronek $7.5m to $8m per?

If there's an impasse and Hronek still wants $8m, then yes absolutely, trading him to get Larsson would be a great fallback. I just don't see Seattle ponying up for him.



I wonder, and this is just pure fantasy, but if Brady Tkachuk definitely wants out of OTT right now, could you create a package around Hronek to get it done? This assumes that Chyhcrun is dealt elsewhere and Tanev, whom they've been linked to via rumour, signs elsewhere. They have wanted a right shot Dman solution for the longest time...

 

[iceburg]

I think your projections are too optimistic/low.
Hronek at $6.5 x 7 years is the bare minimum he signs for. Realistically, likely around $7-7.5 mill x 7.

Lindholm will want at least $6.5-7 x 6-7 years.

Zadorov probably wants more term.

Myers is realistic but probably will sign for $3 mill given his role in the playoffs.

I would go longer with Zadorov but would be cautious not to go too much higher. I think Hronek is a candidate for a shorter deal, say 3 years. He could be in for a big pay day as a 29 year old. Right now he's not worth $7M. At this stage in his career Lindholm is a good middle 6 defensive centre, a valuable piece on any team. But he is the classic example of a player who could get really overpaid in his next contract. Don't do it unless the deal matches the projection for the player. To me, the max comes in at $7M for a short to mid term deal or move on.

You’re going to be disappointed.

I should have been a little clearer in my initial message. This is how they could sign all four with the current cap situation. Is it possible, even likely, that these players will get offers significantly greater than the Canucks are able to offer under this scenario. Sure. Then you move on. I'm not one who says the team has to sign these guys.

 

[Orr4Norris]

Oilers suck, and Healy sucks harder.

Somebody needs to post this with a meme of Zadorov going ‘waaaah’

 

[thecupismine]

There's plenty of ways to discredit Seravalli without making fun of his weight. Anyone who chooses to type cast an entire city as "showing off their wealth" vs. "blue jeans white t-shirt people" may as well call themselves Don Cherry. Its as dumb as a reporter saying Vancouver needs more Saskatoon, less Stockholm.

There's nuance to every conversation, and Frank has decided lately he'd rather ignore said nuance to create a narrative that generates clicks instead of high quality conversation. All the power to him, but that's not the kind of nonsense even worth discussing.

Also why did the Oilers complain about the green men? Did they not look in the mirror and see the video of the guys repeatedly swearing and calling Zadorov a lot of...unpleasant names in punjabi in Edmonton while he was in the box? That's some soft behavior right there, let the fans have some fun.

 

[Flik]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1794148053169136004

Good grief, what an ignorant, pandering, loser. To think I thought he was all right just a few weeks ago.

 

[TruKnyte]

Good grief, what an ignorant, pandering, loser. To think I thought he was all right just a few weeks ago.

always thought he was a twat

 

[Flik]

always thought he was a twat

What can I say, you were definitely ahead the curve compared to myself.

Like he isn't even bothering to be creative with his disrespect. Just nonsense like HUHUHUH Vancouver rich, Edmonton full of SALT OF THE EARTH BLUE JEAN BLUE COLLAR blah blah blah, idiot.

 

[Bleach Clean]

Good grief, what an ignorant, pandering, loser. To think I thought he was all right just a few weeks ago.

Seravelli is clearly trying to troll Canucks fans at this point.

A thicker skin is in order.

 

[Flik]

Seravelli is clearly trying to troll Canucks fans at this point.

A thicker skin is in order.

I mean if that's true, it's even sadder, and makes him even more of a loser to me.

 

[God]

@MS Any thoughts on Viktor Arvidsson?

Thought about him briefly the other day - he's kind of similar to Garland in terms of work ethic and has a pretty good sense of where to be in the open ice. I think he'd work well with Pettersson. The back surgery + whatever injury he had this season is kind of worrying though, and I expect the Canucks will look elsewhere given that they don't want to operate in LTIR and there's a risk he heads there.

 

[Vector]

Thought about him briefly the other day - he's kind of similar to Garland in terms of work ethic and has a pretty good sense of where to be in the open ice. I think he'd work well with Pettersson. The back surgery + whatever injury he had this season is kind of worrying though, and I expect the Canucks will look elsewhere given that they don't want to operate in LTIR and there's a risk he heads there.

He did come back and played every game in the playoffs. Scored at his usual pace. I’d prefer him on a short term moderate cap hit contract over many of the other free agent options. Primarily because he’s shown he can generate offense in a defensive system.

 

[God]

He did come back and played every game in the playoffs. Scored at his usual pace. I’d prefer him on a short term moderate cap hit contract over many of the other free agent options. Primarily because he’s shown he can generate offense in a defensive system.

yeah but we know with these older players - the first big injury leads to a lot of other injuries and you just hope they're small and not serious. maybe 4M on a 1 year but would rather that number closer to 3M. i think he can probably get more playing for chicago.

 

[Bleach Clean]

With Mikheyev coming back, DeBrusk signed, and a cap trade for Poolman with SJ (Knyzhov):

Also, enough room to handle the OEL buyout figure ($2.3m):

 

[VIPettersson]

yeah but we know with these older players - the first big injury leads to a lot of other injuries and you just hope they're small and not serious. maybe 4M on a 1 year but would rather that number closer to 3M. i think he can probably get more playing for chicago.

I'm not necessarily opposed to smaller players but considering we are already fielding Garland, Hoglander, Suter ( no way is he 5'11), Hughes I would be hesitant.

 

[rea]

totally different situation IMO. we bought (for an insane price) a guy that had 11 NHL seasons under his belt, had peaked years prior, was being paid ~2x what he was worth and had 6 years left on his deal. There was no possibility that he was ever going to recapture his form let alone any upside. it was obvious from the moment the trade call was made that it was a disaster.

Kotkaniemi is still really young and his contract might age poorly, but it might not. Last season it looked like he was breaking out and scored at a half point/game clip, lots of it at 5v5 (as a 22 year old). FWIW that production was better than what Lindholm or Eriksson Ek put up at the same age. He took a step back this year and was sort of passed by Drury on the depth charts, but he's only 23 and development of pro athletes is often not linear or free of ups and downs. If he ends up a 20-30 point C without much special teams utility, he's probably overpaid by a million or so per year. If he's a 40-50 point player, he's probably underpaid by a million/year if he levels up from there, he's a steal.

If it doesn't look like he's on the right track, he can be bought out for peanuts in the summer of 2026 (850k for 5 years; 470k for 3).

I understand the argument, but he also was a high draft pick, put in a position of success not only in mtl, but in Carolina to start. He could turn the corner, I am not one to say it's not impossible. But he's been given the opportunity, he's been lined up with both franchises best players for extended looks.

Systems matter for sure, but does he strike you as a Tocchet type player? Is his offensive deficiencies covered by a 200 ft game? Whether you decide it's a gamble or not worth taking is up to you, even if a said buyout is optically manageable. Those add up with the graveyard of buyouts that come or inevitably do come.

Everyone assumes the cap goes up astronomically, and yet there's a reason this team had to suffer through alot of dead cap. You can't buy yourselves out of everything, and if that's the mentality, well don't bitch when it all affects the team when they need it the most.

If management wants to take that risk, I'll support the team regardless. I just feel it's a long term risk, which is an unnecessary one.

While just media rumors of car potential buyout of kk, matched with what their own fan base has said, and going back, even how happily mtl was willing to say f*** it with this player on the OS, factor in what our own coach expects of its players, well again, age isn't the problem for me. It's the type of player you believe you can mold and build in this environment.

He didn't succeed in one that was young and building, where he was at the top of the food chain. He didn't show any better in an environment where he was on a contender where they offersheeted him, and at what was the price, can only be assumed he was expected to be part of a core that was going to be a difference maker. To try and wash their hands of a very young promising player of his ilk and style of play, with many years left, do you all believe he would survive a Rick Tocchet lead team?

Also to rebuttal your talks abt what lindy and loui produced at the same age, to be brutally honest, lindholm offensively has only really produced close to or ppg in 3 seasons of his career, all with the Flames in their hayday.(full disclosure I'm an advocate of re-signing him, but not at the assumed amounts) and with loui, he actually was promising consistently his first 4 full seasons, to the point he was traded for a 2nd overall pick. He never produced that way again.

It's not an exact science. I can't say he won't become this insane player, but given a fan base, and management for that matter, that has the patience of a spoiled child with expectations on what they want out of their players, do you think realistically, where a team that luckily had no takers on a brock or a Garland over the course of a couple yrs, who are ready with their torches and pitchforks ready to skewer one of our best offensive players in ep, after one playoffs, without even playing his just signed contract..

Point being is, beyond the scope of living in what ifs, where you feel he belongs on this team as an almost 5m center who by all optics will be on this teams 3rd line, long term, he better be a heart n soul player, someone that can be depended on to shut down other lines and make big stops when needed. If he ain't producing offensively, and also not that dependable 200ft player, what's the justification that makes him worthy of adding to this culture that cheaper, short term, veteran fa couldn't be added in like blueger, which would open up an extra couple mil that we are all trying to debate and chase to give to what are deemed more important additions?

Just my 2 cents.

 

[rea]

Plug him and play him between those two wingers and I suspect he does come around. If not his buyout is negligible, although lengthy. I could see him succeeding in a third line role with Joshua and Garland and our coaching staff.

Could be true, but look up who his linemates were just this year even. The combo in terms of talent he played with is, with all due respect, quite a leap over said wingers here. First half of this season 4 linemates he was with, necas, svechnikov, bunting, teravainen. He wasn't with scrubs

 

[theguardianII]

June is upon us, Rutherford doesn't wait until the last minute.
FA signings usually are pretty quick with the numbers of prominent FA's news should be coming out very soon.
In the recent past Miller in his last year of his contract was extended which led to Horvat's departure.
It appears Rutherord/Allvin don't wait to let the agents get the leverage in negotiations. They have a planned thought process. They don't "marry" the players, the name on the front of the jersey means more than the name on the back. The wins mean more than the mascot playing on the ice.

The Canucks do have cap space, with LTIR they have almost 27 million. That's enough to keep most of the players, at least the high priority ones.

If Hronek does get moved for such as Necas and Pesce that is a huge win even if a sweetener is needed. Large RHD and winger.
throughout the playoffs the Canuck blue line was touted with adjectives such as huge, massive, giants and really really hard to play against. This is in the real season too, when it all counts for more than a paycheck, 1rst string goalie - wins, second string goalie - wins, 3rd string goalie - wins yes they are all competent goalies but that fence in front of them helps a lot.

At any rate the Rutherford/Allvin should be very active over the next couple of weeks.

 

[JT Milker]

Twitter is going on about Pettersson having a girlfriend?

It’s true, I’m the girlfriend.

With Mikheyev coming back, DeBrusk signed, and a cap trade for Poolman with SJ (Knyzhov):

Also, enough room to handle the OEL buyout figure ($2.3m):


View attachment 875532

Just had to sneak in Zaitsev huh.

 

[Soups On]

Very hesitant on the Kotkaniemi rumours. He was utter shit last year despite being fed easy minutes. Hronek for Necas only makes sense if Allvin knows for a certainty he can shore up the defense with Zadorov and high value guys like Chatfield/Carrier while securing someone more high end like DeMelo, Roy, Walker and/or Pesce.

If the team is projecting Willander and D-Petey to make the team in the next 2-3 seasons, they can't anchor themselves to 5+ year deals on multiple FA signings. The Soucy deal was perfect, would be amazing if Allvin could make something like that happen again.

 

[ManVanFan]

The Chicago trade timing is odd. Possible that Chicago is could make a play for Hronek? Van paid 17th and 43rd in the for him to Detroit. Chicago now has 18th, 34th and 50th.

RHD out there
Seider (Detroit not going to give him up)
Montour 4 years older than Hronek
Hronek next best available.

Sign and trade Hronek 8 year.
18th and 50th, Connor Murphy for Hronek and Mikheyev???

Murphy is bigger more physical than Hronek. Less offence.

Reasonable rest of the cap hits.
Myers 2x3.1
Zadorov 6x4.75
Joshua 5x2.75
Lindholm 6x7

Leaves around 4.2M for a winger for Petey. Tarasenko? Duclair? Perron?

 

[Rowlet]

I'd like to see the Canucks try and sign Danton Heinen.

Local boy who had a pretty good year and could come quite cheap, he's had 3 years of 1 year deals now. Also an ex-Penguin.

 

[Jerry the great]

I understand the argument, but he also was a high draft pick, put in a position of success not only in mtl, but in Carolina to start. He could turn the corner, I am not one to say it's not impossible. But he's been given the opportunity, he's been lined up with both franchises best players for extended looks.

Systems matter for sure, but does he strike you as a Tocchet type player? Is his offensive deficiencies covered by a 200 ft game? Whether you decide it's a gamble or not worth taking is up to you, even if a said buyout is optically manageable. Those add up with the graveyard of buyouts that come or inevitably do come.

Everyone assumes the cap goes up astronomically, and yet there's a reason this team had to suffer through alot of dead cap. You can't buy yourselves out of everything, and if that's the mentality, well don't bitch when it all affects the team when they need it the most.

If management wants to take that risk, I'll support the team regardless. I just feel it's a long term risk, which is an unnecessary one.

While just media rumors of car potential buyout of kk, matched with what their own fan base has said, and going back, even how happily mtl was willing to say f*** it with this player on the OS, factor in what our own coach expects of its players, well again, age isn't the problem for me. It's the type of player you believe you can mold and build in this environment.

He didn't succeed in one that was young and building, where he was at the top of the food chain. He didn't show any better in an environment where he was on a contender where they offersheeted him, and at what was the price, can only be assumed he was expected to be part of a core that was going to be a difference maker. To try and wash their hands of a very young promising player of his ilk and style of play, with many years left, do you all believe he would survive a Rick Tocchet lead team?

Also to rebuttal your talks abt what lindy and loui produced at the same age, to be brutally honest, lindholm offensively has only really produced close to or ppg in 3 seasons of his career, all with the Flames in their hayday.(full disclosure I'm an advocate of re-signing him, but not at the assumed amounts) and with loui, he actually was promising consistently his first 4 full seasons, to the point he was traded for a 2nd overall pick. He never produced that way again.

It's not an exact science. I can't say he won't become this insane player, but given a fan base, and management for that matter, that has the patience of a spoiled child with expectations on what they want out of their players, do you think realistically, where a team that luckily had no takers on a brock or a Garland over the course of a couple yrs, who are ready with their torches and pitchforks ready to skewer one of our best offensive players in ep, after one playoffs, without even playing his just signed contract..

Point being is, beyond the scope of living in what ifs, where you feel he belongs on this team as an almost 5m center who by all optics will be on this teams 3rd line, long term, he better be a heart n soul player, someone that can be depended on to shut down other lines and make big stops when needed. If he ain't producing offensively, and also not that dependable 200ft player, what's the justification that makes him worthy of adding to this culture that cheaper, short term, veteran fa couldn't be added in like blueger, which would open up an extra couple mil that we are all trying to debate and chase to give to what are deemed more important additions?

Just my 2 cents.

To say he didn't have success Montreal or Carolina is flat out wrong. Made the NHL in his first post draft season and put up quite solid rookie numbers...essentially all of them at ES. Injured early in his sophomore season...never got going. Covid ended that one early and probably didn't do anything positive to his development over the bubble season...but he had a productive bubble playoff run. First season in Carolina was okay, but not great. probably an adjustment. last season was solid. this season was a step back. It has been up and down, but there have been ups to be sure.