World Cup: Canada 4 Nations Tournament 2025 Roster Talk

[Dirtyf1ghter]

I would disagree. This, like the late 90s, is a golden generation for the states of draft years 2015-2019. Ever since then, the players thar they have produced from the preceding drafts have been good, but there are no superstars in there. And Canada is likely to go on a run where they have their best ever drafts over the next 18 months, topped off by perhaps the best ever WHL class (off the back off the academies which have become absolute player factories), whilst it looks incredibly weak for the usa. Both NTDP teams got battered by the WHC17 and CHL teams this year. And I ultimatley think that the NCAA/CHL agreement will hurt american players by taking away spots and top roles from them in NCAA.

You look at the rank in the draft without looking at the level in the NHL.

The best Canadians of 2020 (Lafreniere, Byfield) are not at the expected level. Faber and Sanderson are better than them. Only Jarvis is on their level.

2021 : Power is not as strong as hoped, Knies joins Hughes and Beniers in a top 10 redraft

2022 : Cooley and Hutson are the two best players from this draft, Casey has already ridden a lot

2023 : Bedard is already not that strong. Leonard, Perreault, Musty has leveled up

2024 : Cole Hutson would already be much higher in a redraft. Buium and Connelly are seen higher too. Several Canadians selected very high have dropped in the evaluations.

In the last Atom and Pee Wee tournaments that I saw (players born in 2012-2013-2014), I generally found the American elite better than the Canadian elite.

It is not with a demographic 10 times lower and a fertility rate of 1.2 children/woman that Canada will resist the rise of American hockey.

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

I’m talking to you about actual players that are coming. We have been hearing about Canadas downfall since the 90’s lol it isn’t going to happen…other countries are absolutely improving though. Not mutually exclusive.

I see much further. I see in 20 years-30 years. The 2005-2009 generation will only slow down an illusion.

 

[TheBeastCoast]

I see much further. I see in 20 years-30 years. The 2005-2009 generation will only slow down an illusion.

Ah well damn only a few decades to go.

 

[jj cale]

It's funny how hilarious the shit talk was. Apparently to many of the USA hockey fans this game suddenly is "stupid" and "doesn't mean anything"

It meant a lot last weekend.

They're full of shit............as usual.

 

[BigDaddyLurch]

You look at the rank in the draft without looking at the level in the NHL.

The best Canadians of 2020 (Lafreniere, Byfield) are not at the expected level. Faber and Sanderson are better than them. Only Jarvis is on their level.

2021 : Power is not as strong as hoped, Knies joins Hughes and Beniers in a top 10 redraft

2022 : Cooley and Hutson are the two best players from this draft, Casey has already ridden a lot

2023 : Bedard is already not that strong. Leonard, Perreault, Musty has leveled up

2024 : Cole Hutson would already be much higher in a redraft. Buium and Connelly are seen higher too. Several Canadians selected very high have dropped in the evaluations.

In the last Atom and Pee Wee tournaments that I saw (players born in 2012-2013-2014), I generally found the American elite better than the Canadian elite.

It is not with a demographic 10 times lower and a fertility rate of 1.2 children/woman that Canada will resist the rise of American hockey.

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

View attachment 980573

No arguments. No value.

I can give a statistic: Canadians represent only 38.8% of NHL U25 players with 10 games and more. It has never been this low in the history of the league. If you take all the players, it’s 41.3%.

This is a sign of a significant drop in the % of Canadian players between players born in the 1990s and those born in the 2000s (4% in a decade).

 

[Mathieukferland]

No arguments. No value.

I can give a statistic: Canadians represent only 38.8% of NHL U25 players with 10 games and more. It has never been this low in the history of the league.

I don’t know what you’re trying to accomplish here, but the future in Canadian hockey is more than secure with the players that are coming and I would take the nucleus of players that is coming over any other country. Canada just had perhaps their weakest team ever still win a quasi best on best, so I don’t see what you’re trying to prove here

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

I don’t know what you’re trying to accomplish here, but the future in Canadian hockey is more than secure with the players that are coming and I would take the nucleus of players that is coming over any other country. Canada just had perhaps their weakest team ever still win a quasi best on best, so I don’t see what you’re trying to prove here

However, I have already said it. The % of Canadian players has been declining continuously without any recovery phase since the beginning of the league's history (1917).

The Canadians became a minority in the NHL from the 2015/16 season.

Now we are already at 41% and 38% among players born in the 2000s.

I don't see how Canada will counter the decline with the drop in the number of young people practicing.

There are still excellent Canadian players but they are proportionally fewer and fewer.

Season 1997/98 (first season i watched)

Canadians 61%
Europeans 22%
Americans 17%

Season 2024/25 (currently)

Canadians 41% (lowest in history)
Europeans 31%
Americans 28% (highest in history)

It is obvious that the phenomenon is profound and is not linked to a generational circumstance. The crossing between Europeans and Canadians then Americans and Canadians will take place in the not very distant future

 

[FLAMESFAN]

However, I have already said it. The % of Canadian players has been declining continuously without any recovery phase since the beginning of the league's history (1917).

The Canadians became a minority in the NHL from the 2015/16 season.

Now we are already at 41% and 38% among players born in the 2000s.

I don't see how Canada will counter the decline with the drop in the number of young people practicing.

There are still excellent Canadian players but they are proportionally fewer and fewer.

Season 1997/98 (first season i watched)

Canadians 61%
Europeans 22%
Americans 17%

Season 2024/25 (currently)

Canadians 41% (lowest in history)
Europeans 31%
Americans 28% (highest in history)

It is obvious that the phenomenon is profound and is not linked to a generational circumstance. The crossing between Europeans and Canadians then Americans and Canadians will take place in the not very distant future

So.....you're saying we're still #1?

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

So.....you're saying we're still #1?

I never said otherwise. I said that in the coming decades this would no longer be the case.

 

[FLAMESFAN]

I never said otherwise. I said that in the coming decades this would no longer be the case.

That's right, because robots will take a higher %.

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

That's right, because robots will take a higher %.

Europeans, Americans mainly. This has always been the case since the beginning of the history of the league where the Canadiens were 100%

 

[FLAMESFAN]

Europeans, Americans mainly. This has always been the case since the beginning of the history of the league where the Canadiens were 100%

Let me ask you this, in the past 8 or so years has there been much of a change? I'd guess hat %age has stabilized mostly. There was a big change with opening it up globally around 2000, but the NHL isn't going to turn into a Euro/NCAA league man. You can't keep projecting the same decline, you have zero idea what will happen decades from now.
All I know is that today there are more Canadians paid to play hockey than any other country, and that is just plain fact.

 

[Mathieukferland]

Europeans

Europe isn’t a country, I don’t know why you’re putting them all together. In any event, thanks for your musings on Canadian hockey, have a nice day

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

Let me ask you this, in the past 8 or so years has there been much of a change? I'd guess hat %age has stabilized mostly. There was a big change with opening it up globally around 2000, but the NHL isn't going to turn into a Euro/NCAA league man. You can't keep projecting the same decline, you have zero idea what will happen decades from now.
All I know is that today there are more Canadians paid to play hockey than any other country, and that is just plain fact.

The % of Canadians has fallen by 9% in 9 years with an even lower % among players born in the 2000s. I don't call that stagnation.

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

Europe isn’t a country, I don’t know why you’re putting them all together. In any event, thanks for your musings on Canadian hockey, have a nice day

I put them together so I don't have to make an exhaustive list.

I always talked about USA as a country that would become better.

Afterwards what merit is there for Canada in being better than Finland or Slovakia, countries of 5 million where hockey is not even the national sport.

 

[FLAMESFAN]

The % of Canadians has fallen by 9% in 9 years with an even lower % among players born in the 2000s. I don't call that stagnation.

OK, I can play the same game.
Canada's population growth over the past 5 years is double that of the USA. In 100 years Canada will have a bigger population and reclaim a higher % of players in the NHL.
Does that sound like good logic?

 

[Fatass]

Isn’t it a good thing great players come from a lot of countries now? Seems that makes the game stronger.

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

OK, I can play the same game.
Canada's population growth over the past 5 years is double that of the USA. In 100 years Canada will have a bigger population and reclaim a higher % of players in the NHL.
Does that sound like good logic?

The population has increased because Trudeau has brought in more than 1 million 40-year-olds per year in recent years.

But in terms of births, USA still has 10 times more births and a higher fertility index (1.6 vs 1.2)

Anyway, I don't see the connection. If your guys don't play hockey, it won't raise the level.

I gave you a statistical census as it is, observing a 20% drop in the ratio of Canadian players in the NHL in 27 years and a 9% drop in 9 years.

What's funny is that in the 2000s when I talked about the fact that Canadians would become a minority in the NHL in the next decade, I had the same kind of reaction of denial. Yet it happened. There I tell you, that Canadians will become less than 1/3 in the next decade.

 

[Mathieukferland]

The population has increased because Trudeau has brought in more than 1 million 40-year-olds per year in recent years.

But in terms of births, USA still has 10 times more births and a higher fertility index (1.6 vs 1.2)

Anyway, I don't see the connection. If your guys don't play hockey, it won't raise the level.

I gave you a statistical census as it is, observing a 20% drop in the ratio of Canadian players in the NHL in 27 years and a 9% drop in 9 years.

What's funny is that in the 2000s when I talked about the fact that Canadians would become a minority in the NHL in the next decade, I had the same kind of reaction of denial. Yet it happened. There I tell you, that Canadians will become less than 1/3 in the next decade.

I don’t know why you’re trying to « brasser d’la marde » in this thread, but even in the worst drafts Canada has ever had the percentage is usually still around 40%, so I have a hard time seeing 1/3 becoming reality, 40% has been the number for the last 6 or 7 years and has stabilised at that. Go start your own thread if you want to talk about that stuff, this thread is about the 4 nations teams that just won the championship

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

I don’t know why you’re trying to « brasser d’la marde » in this thread, but even in the worst drafts Canada has ever had the percentage is usually still around 40%, so I have a hard time seeing 1/3 becoming reality, 40% has been the number for the last 6 or 7 years and has stabilised at that. Go start your own thread if you want to talk about that stuff, this thread is about the 4 nations teams that just won the championship

It's not the number of players drafted that matters, it's the number of players who enter the league.

There was a time when the ratio of Europeans drafted (2000s) was very high but the ratio of Europeans from this generation joining the NHL was much lower.

Canadians have more visibility with the CHL.

Among players born in 2000 and after, we are already at a ratio of 38% and the ratio is falling from year to year.

38% is not very far from 33%. And the effects of the progress of the Czechia and Slovakia have not yet been activated. These two nations will easily take several % from Canada in the coming years.

 

[bobber]

No arguments. No value.

I can give a statistic: Canadians represent only 38.8% of NHL U25 players with 10 games and more. It has never been this low in the history of the league. If you take all the players, it’s 41.3%.

This is a sign of a significant drop in the % of Canadian players between players born in the 1990s and those born in the 2000s (4% in a decade).

The league has expanded also. Players have to come form some where. The more they expand the league the more watered down the game becomes. Hockey at the minor level has become an elite sport. The average Canadian family can't afford the cost of putting a child in the game. This effects the numbers of players getting to the pro level. Still the top players in the world are mostly Canadian.

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

The league has expanded also. Players have to come form some where. The more they expand the league the more watered down the game becomes. Hockey at the minor level has become an elite sport. The average Canadian family can't afford the cost of putting a child in the game. This effects the numbers of players getting to the pro level. Still the top players in the world are mostly Canadian.

Yet in the top 20 forwards with the most PPG, there are only 7 Canadians.

In the top 20 defenders with the most PPG, there are only 7 Canadians.

In the top 20 goalkeepers with the best efficiency, there are only 6 Canadians.

In fact, if you take NHL elite players, it's already at 33%.

 

[centipede2233]

I replayed Canada’s bench reaction to the mcdavid goal, interesting observation, the second mcdavid got the pass from Mitch, stone and Reinhart were the first ones up off their seat, outside of Crosby they are the 2 highest IQ guys on the team.

 

[Bradely]

While there was alot of arrogance, now I see it on Canadian side. I am tempted also, I am no different.
I don't think it is good.

One man and his group are provoking this. And people on both side of one of the best historical country neighbour friendship will suffer of this. Let's pay attention to try and not broke completely what was done since +100 years in 30 f... days.... hopefully things will change, at a certain time before it is to late.

Americain are not full of shit, like Canadian aren't. Let's all be better.