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Rumor: Cam Robinson - Tuch Availability

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Fatass said:
Shouldn’t every player on Buffalo be available providing the return is good?
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I get what they're saying. I think the disconnect is it's not really part of any plan forward, or at least not one we've seen proven elsewhere. It's like saying, "I've spent all these years drinking water, and I hate water, so I'm gonna stop drinking water."

It's interesting that Tuch is THIS valuable to a team, whereas, for most teams, he's your second tier winger. But I get that if players don't want to play for you, you have to value the ones that do, in hopes that it attracts others.

I get the frustration of Sabers fans. It seems like the plan is to hold still until someone more competent makes the decisions?

TB doesn't have a blue chip prospect. We have two B+ prospects. But I think we are gonna see JBB try to acquire a pricey C from a bad team and send him to Buffalo. I don't know if it will work; I just think the attempt will be there. Tuch is too perfect a fit for us to not try everything.
 
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DFC said:
I get what they're saying. I think the disconnect is it's not really part of any plan forward, or at least not one we've seen proven elsewhere. It's like saying, "I've spent all these years drinking water, and I hate water, so I'm gonna stop drinking water."

It's interesting that Tuch is THIS valuable to a team, whereas, for most teams, he's your second tier winger. But I get that if players don't want to play for you, you have to value the ones that do, in hopes that it attracts others.

I get the frustration of Sabers fans. It seems like the plan is to hold still until someone more competent makes the decisions?

TB doesn't have a blue chip prospect. We have two B+ prospects. But I think we are gonna see JBB try to acquire a pricey C from a bad team and send him to Buffalo. I don't know if it will work; I just think the attempt will be there. Tuch is too perfect a fit for us to not try everything.
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"It's interesting that Tuch is THIS valuable to a team, whereas, for most teams, he's your second tier winger."

I don't get this statement... Why is it so hard to fathom that a team like Buffalo would value Alex Tuch? Whether you think of him as a 1st tier winger or 2nd tier winger.... He is a guy that provides excellent 5v5 production and is very good on the PK ...is fast and big..pressures the puck all over the ice and is a veteran on a team filled with kids. Throw in the fact that he is on a great contract and is a hometown kid who grew up loving the Sabres.

You really have to ask why Buffalo isn't interested in giving him up for a blob of prospects? Why he is valued here?



"
 
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DFC said:
I get what they're saying. I think the disconnect is it's not really part of any plan forward, or at least not one we've seen proven elsewhere. It's like saying, "I've spent all these years drinking water, and I hate water, so I'm gonna stop drinking water."

It's interesting that Tuch is THIS valuable to a team, whereas, for most teams, he's your second tier winger. But I get that if players don't want to play for you, you have to value the ones that do, in hopes that it attracts others.

I get the frustration of Sabers fans. It seems like the plan is to hold still until someone more competent makes the decisions?

TB doesn't have a blue chip prospect. We have two B+ prospects. But I think we are gonna see JBB try to acquire a pricey C from a bad team and send him to Buffalo. I don't know if it will work; I just think the attempt will be there. Tuch is too perfect a fit for us to not try everything.
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Honestly, Howard might be valued above a B+ prospect with the season he's having. Should probably win the Hobey Baker.
 
boltsfan86 said:
Honestly, Howard might be valued above a B+ prospect with the season he's having. Should probably win the Hobey Baker.
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People only really care about draft position, age and WJC stats. You can have 2 Puljujarvi's running around your farm system and no one gives a shit as long as he isn't over 20, was drafted top 10 and had a good tourney.

Howard might win a Hobey and had a great WJC but yet he's a B+ prospect because he'll be 21 in a few weeks
 
Beerz said:
"It's interesting that Tuch is THIS valuable to a team, whereas, for most teams, he's your second tier winger."

I don't get this statement... Why is it so hard to fathom that a team like Buffalo would value Alex Tuch? Whether you think of him as a 1st tier winger or 2nd tier winger.... He is a guy that provides excellent 5v5 production and is very good on the PK ...is fast and big..pressures the puck all over the ice and is a veteran on a team filled with kids. Throw in the fact that he is on a great contract and is a hometown kid who grew up loving the Sabres.

You really have to ask why Buffalo isn't interested in giving him up for a blob of prospects? Why he is valued here?



"
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I get why he's valued. (I said it's "interesting," and it is -- the situation is unique.) But he's 28 on a team that's still a few years away. I do think part of it is he's one of few bright spots. I'm not in the camp that says Buffalo should/will be forced to move him or anything. But I do think severe overpayments will be offered, at least in comparison to what he would be worth to another team.

I also don't think it's zero chance. We have seen JBB get very creative with trades -- if I'm not mistaken, he was the first guy to get double retention. So, if he REALLY wants Tuch, don't be surprised if we see him pull a rabbit out of the hat.

boltsfan86 said:
Honestly, Howard might be valued above a B+ prospect with the season he's having. Should probably win the Hobey Baker.
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Is the NHL full of star forwards who won the Hobey Baker? To me it seems like the occasional one who win it young.
 
Rschmitz said:
About half of the Hobey Baker winners turn into stars, the other half turn out to be meh. I'll take those %'s
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He's about to turn 21 though. I'm making an assumption here (and I might be wrong) but I'm gonna guess the stars won it as teenagers, with very few exceptions.

I don't see him as an A-grade or blue chipper.
 
Rschmitz said:
About half of the Hobey Baker winners turn into stars, the other half turn out to be meh. I'll take those %'s
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I'd suggest you actually look at the list of Hobey Baker winners. There's far more guys who flamed out or never really amounted to much. That said, it's been a bit better of late with guys like Eichel, Makar, Fantilli, and Celebrini. However the one thing all those guys had in common is they were very high draft picks. I like Howard enough as a prospect, but he's certainly getting a bit overhyped by some TB fans as he's a bit of a big fish in a small pond.
 
is the answer jesus said:
I'd suggest you actually look at the list of Hobey Baker winners. There's far more guys who flamed out or never really amounted to much. That said, it's been a bit better of late with guys like Eichel, Makar, Fantilli, and Celebrini. However the one thing all those guys had in common is they were very high draft picks. I like Howard enough as a prospect, but he's certainly getting a bit overhyped by some TB fans as he's a bit of a big fish in a small pond.
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I think it’s picked up since 2014, and you’re right- before that the trophy hardly meant a thing.
 
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is the answer jesus said:
I'd suggest you actually look at the list of Hobey Baker winners. There's far more guys who flamed out or never really amounted to much. That said, it's been a bit better of late with guys like Eichel, Makar, Fantilli, and Celebrini. However the one thing all those guys had in common is they were very high draft picks. I like Howard enough as a prospect, but he's certainly getting a bit overhyped by some TB fans as he's a bit of a big fish in a small pond.
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I agree actually. He's OUR best prospect and therefore we (some of us, and nothing against these guys) celebrate him a little more than is warranted.

If I'm not mistaken, Eichel won it before he was drafted. So that's apples and oranges. I mean, I don't think even our most optimistic fans are thinking Jack Eichel, but still. I can't think of a star player who won it in his 20s. Guys who win in their 20s, if I'm not mistaken, get a whole bunch of hype and then turn into average NHL players.

That said, I do think there are signs that Howard is just a bit of a late bloomer. And TB commonly identifies guys who get a lot better after their draft year. Well, more common 5 yeara ago than now... But even so, I can't see Howard above a B+ (and I think that might be generous) because even to get to that level he has to break the mold a bit.

I think Buffalo fans are correct to sneer at our prospect pool. But I do think we can offer valuable packages, although to use such a package in a Tuch deal seems like it will certainly require a 3rd team.
 
If Alex Tuch is traded for any of what's being offered here it will be a terrible move by us and we will be laughed at by the time April rolls around. Don't think many in here understand how good Tuch really is and I don't blame them, I wouldn't watch the Sabres either.
 
5 Minute Major said:
Still going to disagree. This “hockey trade” stuff shouldn’t cloud anything in a trade process. IMO, you always take what you feel is a higher value, whether it be NHL roster players or prospects and picks.
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That's assuming that Buffalo is somehow obligated to trade Tuch. Last I checked they're not. There's cases to be made for trading him now rather than in the offseason or next deadline, but 1) that's not the same thing as such an obligation and 2) those cases necessarily involve more stringent considerations as to what acceptable returns are.
 
Win the Hobey Baker before your draft year and I’m impressed.

Winning it three years after you’re drafted is infinitely less impressive.

I like the player fine…but the award is meaningless to me at this age.
 
Rschmitz said:
It’s simpler than that. We have no shortage of scoring, Tuch is somewhat of a luxury and not needed. Moser however is essential to our defense going forward, cheap, and is the heir to Hedman/McDonagh while Tuch is a year away from UFA. Here I am being a homer though.
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So, because of the state of your roster and how it's presently built vis a vis your team's future plans, this player turns out to be disproportionately valuable to your team and thus one that cannot and should not be traded barring very specific circumstances for the return?

Okay, cool. That happens all the time. Often enough that it sounds very familiar - almost as though it's applied in this thread before.
 
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