Calder Watch : 2024-25 Season

[Patty Ice]

Lol some people really forgot how good Thornton was.

Wouldn't be entirely surprised if Celebrini surpassed him but let's pump the breaks a little bit.

I don't think they forgot more than how excited they are about Celebrini's future. He's giving them every reason to be.

 

[StrawHatEklund]

Clarification

Cheechoo was in his 3rd season when he put up 50.

He also had 2 years of AHL experience and 20 games in the SEL. 3rd NHL with 2 years in AHL and 20 SEL games. lol. It’s a facetious comparison all around.

 

[karltonian]

Not a single Sharks rookie in franchise history has been as good as Celebrini. Not one. By quite a large margin too.

 

[StrawHatEklund]

I don't think they forgot more than how excited they are about Celebrini's future. He's giving them every reason to be.

I used the wrong wording so edited it. He has the calibre of potential to be better than Joe. Just overexcited from the game.

 

[BigDaddyLurch]

Elite defenseman are simply rarer than elite forwards do to much less players overall. And Hutson is having a historic season with much better support than Celebrini. That’s my primary point.

..."much" better is kind...Montreal was in the Bottom 5 for the last three years for a reason...they aren't World Beaters...

 

[StrawHatEklund]

..."much" better is kind...Montreal was in the Bottom 5 for the last three years for a reason...they aren't World Beaters...

Bottom 5 last year was 76 points for them?. They’re leagues better than the Sharks last year and this year. Not even close. Making up nearly 30 points is a massive difference in quality. This year it’s nearly 40 and Hutson plays a huge role but others have improved quite a bit too. Suzuki in particular.

 

[BigDaddyLurch]

Not a single Sharks rookie in franchise history has been as good as Celebrini. Not one. By quite a large margin too.

...no one said anything to the contrary...it's just annointing him better than 3 HHoFers already was a bit much...

 

[SannywithoutCompy]

Elite defenseman are simply rarer than elite forwards do to much less players overall. And Hutson is having a historic season with much better support than Celebrini. That’s my primary point.

Better support yeah, but still not sniffing the playoffs without him. I think Hutson's season, taken as is and what he's accomplished, is better than Celebrini's but I don't have much doubt that Celebrini will be the better player moving forward. It's like he was created in a hockey factory, a guy who won't be best in the league at any particular skill but will be the only one who's top 10 in most of them.

I hope your insane prospect pool pans out and surrounds him with some worthy talent, I want a Habs-Sharks cup final someday.

 

[Bizz]

To be fair, Cheechoo's downfall was due to his injuries. He wasn't some scrub.

Cheechoo was a large part of the surprise WCF run of 2004. Before Thornton came here.

 

[Giant Panda]

Irrelevant

Cheechoo had 50+ goals as a rookie feeding off of Joe

How did he turn out? After that rookie season

All we're saying is that saying the Sharks had never had something/someone so good when you had prime Joe Thornton is really premature

Cheechoo was fantastic even before Thorton. He scored 28 goals as a 21 year old in the NHL, the year before he played with Thorton.

Cheechoo has a great shot and an incredible knack for finding spots on the ice. His decline wasn't due to not playing with Thorton, it was his knee and groin injuries that destroyed his skating ability.

Healthy Cheechoo would've been a consistent 40 goal scorer had he been healthy.

 

[Bizz]

Lol some people really forgot how good Thornton was.

Wouldn't be entirely surprised if Celebrini surpassed him but let's pump the breaks a little bit.

They're both gonna end up being dominant in their own ways.

 

[Captain97]

I feel like every couple days this needs to be said. Hutson is putting up one of the best ever seasons by a rookie Dman.

Celebrini is having a great season, but Hutsons is absurd, he is likely ending up top 5 all time in points for rookie dmen island is top in scoring for dmen league wide.

 

[MrLunatik]

But but Celebrini might never reach Jumbo Joe’s level.

Mark Jankowski had a 4 goal game as a rookie... I guess Celebrini will never be on his level using this ass backwards logic

 

[koyvoo]

Someone should start a poll on the mains - will Celebrini have a better career than Joe Thornton?

I don’t have the balls to do it, but hopefully I might influence a braver soul than me.

 

[Big Trout]

There are a lot more forwards than defensemen is easier to climb the list as an elite defenseman. And Celebrini’s individual defensive ability and puck winning abilities (for a 18 year old) should factor in.

Most Points Rookie Season NHL Defenseman | StatMuse

The last entry in the ''easy to climb'' list of defenseman was 40 years ago lol. Makar would have done it if not for covid seasons, not even sure about Hughes.

Along with Mcdavid, Hutson is the only current active player to hit 60 carreer assist in their first 80 games, his season have been that crazy.

And don't get me wrong I'd still take Celibrini to build a team around, but he's not winning the calder.

 

[MrLunatik]

Relative to their peers it's Hutson and not really debatable. If you don't believe me look at the records book for rookie D and the current betting odds for the calder.

You started so good and then you bring up betting odds? Betting odds don't mean shit. Using them as a basis for anything is beyond stupid since they are massively skewed by how people are betting.

 

[Steve Austin]

Celebrini is so f***ing good! It's too bad Celebrini, Hutson, Wolf, and Michkov are all pitted against one another for the Calder. Such a remarkable year for all of them!

I still think Hutson wins the Calder (because of the records & making the playoffs), but the real winners are the Sharks, the Flames, the Flyers, and the Habs for having 4 absolute stud players! They're all going to be so exciting to follow for years to come!

 

[Big Trout]

You started so good and then you bring up betting odds? Betting odds don't mean shit. Using them as a basis for anything is beyond stupid since they are massively skewed by how people are betting.

Fair enough I guess, I just assume they're a good measuring stick to see who's the current favorite since they've been posted all season long but I don't gamble and don't really know how they get calculated

 

[BigDaddyLurch]

Celebrini is so f***ing good! It's too bad Celebrini, Hutson, Wolf, and Michkov are all pitted against one another for the Calder. Such a remarkable year for all of them!

I still think Hutson wins the Calder (because of the records & making the playoffs), but the real winners are the Sharks, the Flames, the Flyers, and the Habs for having 4 absolute stud players! They're all going to be so exciting to follow for years to come!

 

[MrLunatik]

Fair enough I guess, I just assume they're a good measuring stick to see who's the current favorite since they've been posted all season long but I don't gamble and don't really know how they get calculated

Well they are skewed by bettors... which means for the most part, it's a bunch of f***ing morons looking to give money away

 

[coooldude]

...I've been watching hockey for almost 50 years and have seen hundreds of Sharks games, so the "I've seen it all" doesn't really work...Celebrini is a phenomenal kid, but to already annoint him ahead of 3 Hall of Famers is a ridiculous take...period...it's like the few Habs fans here already annointing Hutson over guys like Chelios...



...he certainly has POTENTIAL, but it's far too early to crown him "The Greatest San Jose Shark Ever"...that's a bit much...

Absolutely, I can't believe these takes tonight. I have massive hopes for Celebrini but Jumbo is a first ballot Hall of famer. Let's see Celebrini make it out of his ELC before we go too crazy.

I think it's fair to say he's our best ROOKIE and 18yo ever, because he's definitely having a better rookie season than Marleau.

This thread has been borderline insane from the start, but it’s gone full bat shit crazy tonight.

Agreed. Embarrassing as a sharks fan honestly.

2023-2024 Connor Bedard clears his throat. In fact, last year's Blackhawks were far worse - but that's for another thread.

Macklin now has 1 more point than Bedard last year, in 2 fewer games, with 4 games to go. He surpassed Jagr and Linden and now is the 14th best season by an 18yo all time. If he goes PPG in the last 4, he'll be tied with Housley for 9th best season by an 18yo all time.

Hutson absolutely currently the favorite but tonight's game put Celebrini back in the race. It'll be a historic D rookie season by Hutson vs a historic 18yo season by Celebrini. (This link not yet updated for tonight).

18-Year Old NHL Players - Regular Season Stats

18-year old NHL player stats. NHL player statistics segmented by age group.

www.quanthockey.com

 

[Kennedys]

Hutson will probably win the calder but man the Sharks are in business with Celebrini and Smith

 

[MrLunatik]

Celebrini is so f***ing good! It's too bad Celebrini, Hutson, Wolf, and Michkov are all pitted against one another for the Calder. Such a remarkable year for all of them!

I still think Hutson wins the Calder (because of the records & making the playoffs), but the real winners are the Sharks, the Flames, the Flyers, and the Habs for having 4 absolute stud players! They're all going to be so exciting to follow for years to come!

for someone wo doesn't believe in CTE, this is a rather intelligent post

 

[Garbageyuk]

Celebrini: 18 years old, 66 GP 24 G 38 A 62 P = 0.93 PPG

Hutson: 21 years old, 78 GP 6 G 58 A 64 P = 0.82 PPG

Not even close. Celebrini's season is way more impressive.

Hutson: currently 4th in scoring among NHL D

Celebrini: currently 55th in scoring among NHL forwards

Hutson:

Having what is currently the 7th highest scoring rookie season in NHL history among D, could end up as high as 3rd (needs just 5 more points), has broken NHL records for rookie defensemen.

Celebrini:

Having what is currently the 107th highest scoring rookie season in NHL history among forwards, likely ends up around ~75th, has broken no significant NHL records.

Not even close. Hutson’s season is in an entirely different tier.

 

[ORRFForever]

Macklin now has 1 more point than Bedard last year, in 2 fewer games, with 4 games to go.

You are missing the point of my comment.