C Mikhail Grigorenko (2012, 12th, BUF; traded to COL) IV

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SergeConstantin74

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I don't believe this part is true.

Also, talking about this conditioning stint thing: the Los Angeles Kings were able to successfully pull a similar stunt with Brayden Schenn a few years back (19 year old, junior eligible player, not injured, spent two weeks in minors then joined Team Canada for the World Juniors).

Believe it or not, it is true.

http://tvasports.ca/hockey/lhjmq/servi-de-cobayes-roy-16042013

Patrick Roy was told only on January 28 this year that he could have kept Kucherov last season and play all 3 euros since Buffalo sent Grigorenko back after the QMJHL trade deadline. He wasn't happy at all that the league didn't tell him before since he asked about the new rule related to euros taken first round in the NHL.

A lot of people in Quebec now think this is what Buffalo and Quebec are doing right now, waiting for January to send Grigorenko back in the Q. When a journalist asked him if he was considering it, Boucher just smiled.

I don't know if the league will do something about it before but if the rule doesn't change, it will remain a possibility.
 

Djp

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The solution then is actually very simpler than you think. Just waive Leino.


No....buffalo would send Leino home. They still have 2 compliance buyouts left to use so Hy waive him and risk an njury n the minors.

I don't really have any vested interest in the Sabres or Grigorenko or anything, but I'm glad to hear this. I always thought the "conditioning stint" was a funky grey area ripe for exploitation.


I don't see the issue.

He is still counted against the roster. He is still paid on NHL salary so there isn't any circumvention.

They dress hm against Hiladelphia, claim an injury, put him on an IR then send him down to Rochester legally.

You'd be basically guaranteed that 30 of the top CHL players under 20 would be in the AHL every season. This season they'd probably be missing Petan, Bjorkstrand, Shinakruk, Klimchuk, Drouin, Hudon, Mantha, Poirier, etc. etc. Even that 30 players out of the top end of the pool could potentially kill a lot of interest in the CHL fanbases (not saying it would, but it might).

30 players out of the 60+ teams..teams won't be decimated.

The other issue with Grigs is he takes up a non NA slot. Make these players exemp fom this. Now you are n a pickle with roster slots.

An alternative is allow it for 19 yr old or those a yr after getting drafted can go to the AHL.

Another factor with grigs.....if the player played enough in the NHL to burn his ELC year, then his CHL should be severed. Thus next yr he can go to the AHL.



Would the Sabres be interested in a 1st rounder for Grigorenko ? As a Habs fan I would, and I'm sure the Avs would as well.


No Way in h-e-!- !
 

hototogisu

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I don't see the issue.

He is still counted against the roster. He is still paid on NHL salary so there isn't any circumvention.

They dress hm against Hiladelphia, claim an injury, put him on an IR then send him down to Rochester legally.

Except that's exactly the kind of grey-area issue I was talking about...nothing to do with cap circumvention, necessarily.
 

Chainshot

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Interesting if true. It's been believed on the Sabres boards that he would have to clear all 3 leagues before being eligible to go to the AHL.

That was how it was explained to me by someone who I thought should know. My mistake. :laugh:
 

Chainshot

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Would Quebec be more interested in dealing him since there is talk of a Memorial Cup hosting bid for next year as they could get something for him for later rather than either letting him walk or using him later this year?
 

Nabru

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Aug 29, 2009
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Believe it or not, it is true.

http://tvasports.ca/hockey/lhjmq/servi-de-cobayes-roy-16042013

Patrick Roy was told only on January 28 this year that he could have kept Kucherov last season and play all 3 euros since Buffalo sent Grigorenko back after the QMJHL trade deadline. He wasn't happy at all that the league didn't tell him before since he asked about the new rule related to euros taken first round in the NHL.

A lot of people in Quebec now think this is what Buffalo and Quebec are doing right now, waiting for January to send Grigorenko back in the Q. When a journalist asked him if he was considering it, Boucher just smiled.

I don't know if the league will do something about it before but if the rule doesn't change, it will remain a possibility.

This is very interesting. If Pittsburgh decided to do the same with Olli Maatta, would the same principles apply in the OHL? London would have 3 - Bender, Maatta, Zadorov.
 

SergeConstantin74

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This is very interesting. If Pittsburgh decided to do the same with Olli Maatta, would the same principles apply in the OHL? London would have 3 - Bender, Maatta, Zadorov.

Yes, London is in the same situation. Quebec and London are the only two teams with this possiblity if I'm not mistaken.
 

Number 57

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Yep. That was the big gaffe. If the Sabres had handled him properly, he would've gotten his 9 games and gone right back to the Q, where he would still be tearing it up, and most of this "wow, what a bust" talk would have no reason to exist.

I still maintain that I think he could develop in a very sheltered 3rd line role in the NHL, because he did show some progress up with Buffalo, even if he wasn't lighting the world on fire. But the trouble there is Buffalo doesn't really have a way to provide that kind of role with our roster. Our top 2 forward lines are Moulson/Hodgson/Stafford and Ennis/Leino/Ott; no line there capable of going head to head with other teams' top lines on a nightly basis to provide that shelter to the lower lines. And the bottom 2 lines -- Foligno/Girgensons/Flynn and Scott/McCormick/Tropp -- are clearly chip, chase, and cycle style checking lines, where Grigorenko wouldn't fit in without radically altering his game anyway.

I'm actually beginning to side with some of the Russian posters who insist he would've been better off if he never went to the CHL. If he had gone the KHL route, he would've been able to develop at his own pace and then come over to North America as an NHL player, rather than getting caught in the crappy situation he is.

The gap in your reasoning is the fact the Sabres will finish dead last anyway. Who says you have to play the Ennis line against the other teams' top guys ? What you do is you use Foligno, Ott and Leino against the other other teams' best. Who cares if you get lit up.

You put Grigorenko with good players such as Ennis and Hodgson and you shelter them. Grigorenko will end up with 50 pts and have a lot of confidence. Yet the Sabres will still finish last which is what you guys want.
 

Chainshot

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Will he play in WJC I wonder.

If Buffalo continues to jerk him into and out of the lineup, I'd like to see him get his chance at the WJC's before then going back to Quebec. Putting a wrinkle in that however will be how he plays between now and then. He plead with Nolan to get a chance, Nolan gave it to him and honestly, he was pretty good against both Philly and Detroit in limited minutes. If he keeps it up, he may still be in Buffalo.
 

Heretic

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If Buffalo continues to jerk him into and out of the lineup, I'd like to see him get his chance at the WJC's before then going back to Quebec. Putting a wrinkle in that however will be how he plays between now and then. He plead with Nolan to get a chance, Nolan gave it to him and honestly, he was pretty good against both Philly and Detroit in limited minutes. If he keeps it up, he may still be in Buffalo.

yeah honestly I kind of feel like part of his development is to just piss him off over and over again to get him fired up. The only problem with that being that eventually he might get sick of it and leave, but he's been here long enough, I don't see him doing that unless a slippery agent convinces him otherwise, or the mob...
 

Number 57

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It's official.

Will the Remparts be able to ice three euros now ? It seems so. This is an historic moment for the CHL.
 

Mit Yarrum

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No Mikhail Grigorenko today ... Has most likely been sent back to junior. #Sabres

That's where he needs to be. And next year the AHL. Good for him.
 

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Marc the Habs Fan

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Also is that fact or is it speculation?

All the legit details in there I wrote in my original post...they claim it's fact that he won't report to the Remparts for tomorrow's game and is studying his options right now.

The rest of the article is just a summary of the whole situation. Boucher will talk about it to the media at 4:30 PM today.
 

Mathletic

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It's official.

Will the Remparts be able to ice three euros now ? It seems so. This is an historic moment for the CHL.

If he reports, yes they'll be able to dress all 3 ... rest of the league very happy with this :sarcasm:
 

VancouverCanuck

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damn you regier!

UPDATE:*According to a report from Le Soleil in Quebec City, Grigorenko is refusing to report to the Remparts and is currently weighing his options. What those options might be are unclear at this time. Needless to say, this isn't great news for the Sabres and their relationship with the 19-year-old forward.

Obviously, it’s not Murray’s fault that the first two years of Grigorenko’s contract were wasted. That’s on fired GM Darcy Regier.

A player is allowed to play nine NHL games without burning a year off his contract in a given season. The Sabres kept him around for 25 last season before sending him to Quebec and he’s already played 18 this year. Grigorenko showed flashes in both NHL stints of being ready, but has yet to string together enough consistent play to prove he belongs.

Nolan has been adamant since taking over the team that players shouldn’t be entitled to spots on the roster and if they’re not ready, they should not be in the league. Of course, that now puts the Sabres in a bit of a bind when it comes to Grigorenko’s contract timeline and it also may begin to fray the relationship with the player.

As is the case with any player, how they’re handled in the first few years of their career can go a long way in determining what they’ll become. Grigorenko’s first two pro seasons have essentially been bungled at this point. It’s part on the Sabres and part on the fact that the NHL’s agreement with the Canadian Hockey League to force teams to return their junior eligible players to their junior clubs is becoming less appetizing for NHL teams.

Grigorenko has no business in the QMJHL, a league in which he has averaged over 1.5 points per game in 92 career games. Now he’ll go back as a 19-year-old with pro experience and be one of the biggest and strongest players playing against fellow teenagers.

The other factor in all of this is Grigorenko will have options outside of the NHL when his contract expires. The KHL would gladly take one of its native sons back into the fold, which could leave Buffalo with a gaping hole in its pipeline after Grigorenko's contract is up, which could be as early as next offseason.

With the way young players are making their way to the NHL, this agreement between the NHL and CHL seems to be hindering development of a select few players that have outgrown their junior leagues at 18 or 19, but can’t get their feet wet in the AHL before being thrown into the NHL grind.

NHL teams invest too much in their assets to be put in such a tight spot when it comes to their development. That said, with the new collective bargaining agreement decided, the NHL and CHL agreement regarding players is unlikely to change any time soon. That puts teams like the Sabres in this kind of position, and worst of all, forces a player like Grigorenko to essentially run in place in his development and it’s simply not fair.
 
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