Bruno Sucks - The Coaching Thread

[Armourboy]

Question of the day, was it Brunette who was responsible for ROR, Gus and Fil having a career year as a line or was it the players that just gelled and worked? Also, why did it work one year and not the next? I get Gus and ROR aged a year but should they have dropped off the way they did? Puzzling to say the least.

I think the first year you had a guy in ROR that was looking to prove he wasn't done, and honestly I think Nyquist was in the same boat. I think what it boiled down too was you had 3 hungry guys that enjoyed playing with one another and it just worked.

I also think Brunette kind of let them do their thing more than what he did with the guys this season. This year seemed much more like play the system or else. I think you had some internal battles going on because nothing with this team worked. Honestly if Marchessault is still here by training camp I'll be a little bit surprised.

I also think if they start bad like they did last season Trotz probably already has his plan for when he pulls the plug on Brunette. Ain't no way he can let this keep going on and if this season is the same as last I expect that locker room to get real fugly real fast.

 

[glenngineer]

I think the first year you had a guy in ROR that was looking to prove he wasn't done, and honestly I think Nyquist was in the same boat. I think what it boiled down too was you had 3 hungry guys that enjoyed playing with one another and it just worked.

I also think Brunette kind of let them do their thing more than what he did with the guys this season. This year seemed much more like play the system or else. I think you had some internal battles going on because nothing with this team worked. Honestly if Marchessault is still here by training camp I'll be a little bit surprised.

I also think if they start bad like they did last season Trotz probably already has his plan for when he pulls the plug on Brunette. Ain't no way he can let this keep going on and if this season is the same as last I expect that locker room to get real fugly real fast.

I'd keep Marchessault and remove Brunette.

Obviously if this doesn't happen and we have a slow start, Taylor is in Milwaukee as he was re-upped so there's his plan B, unless he goes with one of the current assistants.

 

[Olderfan]

Marchessault may be difficult but he is a good hockey player with stats to prove it. He may be hard to handle but there are some coaches out there somewhere who did handle him and use his talents.Sometimes there are people whose intense will to succeed is what separates them from the crowd. They have the greatest impatience with anyone who isn’t that driven. If you interfere with their intensity they will get mouthy about it. I perceive Marchessault to be that player.
Preds need more players like that, not less. If Preds didn’t have him, they’d be searching for one just like him.
Of course, I may be wrong(again!).

 

[wmupreds]

Marchessault may be difficult but he is a good hockey player with stats to prove it. He may be hard to handle but there are some coaches out there somewhere who did handle him and use his talents.Sometimes there are people whose intense will to succeed is what separates them from the crowd. They have the greatest impatience with anyone who isn’t that driven. If you interfere with their intensity they will get mouthy about it. I perceive Marchessault to be that player.
Preds need more players like that, not less. If Preds didn’t have him, they’d be searching for one just like him.
Of course, I may be wrong(again!).

I wouldn't say this is necessarily wrong, but he's also 34 and under contract for 4 more years. If there's a decent offer to get out of that deal I think you have to consider it.

 

[Olderfan]

I wouldn't say this is necessarily wrong, but he's also 34 and under contract for 4 more years. If there's a decent offer to get out of that deal I think you have to consider it.

There is that and they should consider it. But I’d rather they consider decent offers for Smith and for McCarron and for Sissons. But the key word is decent.

 

[glenngineer]

I like that Marchessault has this intensity. I would've liked to have seen more of this on the ice from him and the other veteran leaders of the team. Why we didn't see that from them is another question I'd have. Did they check out mentally because the system wasn't working, the team was losing and no changes were happening? I want a guy like him around to show the kids the type of work ethic it takes to succeed and win at this level.

Just an observation, the only one who appeared to have that intensity on the ice all year was Forsberg. That was what I saw. Others may have seen it differently. I think what people tend to see are his turnovers because he's forcing things but I think that's because he's trying to put the team on his back and unfortunately, as good a player as he is, he's not that type of player who can will his team to a win night and night out.

Not to harp on my disdain for guys like Smith and McCarron, but when your team isn't playing well and it needs a bit of a wakeup call, you need guys who can be spark plugs and run around the ice playing physical which gets the guys on the bench pumped up. I can't tell you how many times I saw both of these supposed energy guys peel off and not finish checks during the season. I get it, the season is a grind. At the same time, team is half asleep, it's your job to wake them up to some degree. I'd rather see a kid like Weisblatt get a chance as he'll be a little spark plug out there, much like Nichol used to do. It's not a long term solution but we lack guys with intensity and drive.

Once again, maybe it's there and the losing took a toll on them this year. I'm not sure of the team Trotz is trying to build and Brunette is trying to mold. I'm also not sure how you fix it.

I'm interested to see what we do in the draft and FA and possibly via some trades.

 

[nine_inch_fang]

I like that Marchessault has this intensity. I would've liked to have seen more of this on the ice from him and the other veteran leaders of the team. Why we didn't see that from them is another question I'd have. Did they check out mentally because the system wasn't working, the team was losing and no changes were happening? I want a guy like him around to show the kids the type of work ethic it takes to succeed and win at this level.

Just an observation, the only one who appeared to have that intensity on the ice all year was Forsberg. That was what I saw. Others may have seen it differently. I think what people tend to see are his turnovers because he's forcing things but I think that's because he's trying to put the team on his back and unfortunately, as good a player as he is, he's not that type of player who can will his team to a win night and night out.

Not to harp on my disdain for guys like Smith and McCarron, but when your team isn't playing well and it needs a bit of a wakeup call, you need guys who can be spark plugs and run around the ice playing physical which gets the guys on the bench pumped up. I can't tell you how many times I saw both of these supposed energy guys peel off and not finish checks during the season. I get it, the season is a grind. At the same time, team is half asleep, it's your job to wake them up to some degree. I'd rather see a kid like Weisblatt get a chance as he'll be a little spark plug out there, much like Nichol used to do. It's not a long term solution but we lack guys with intensity and drive.

Once again, maybe it's there and the losing took a toll on them this year. I'm not sure of the team Trotz is trying to build and Brunette is trying to mold. I'm also not sure how you fix it.

I'm interested to see what we do in the draft and FA and possibly via some trades.

It been discussed on these boards many times. 4th line plugs/tweeners should never be on long term contracts, they're to replaceable and they get too comfortable.

That's what we've seen with Smith and McCarron. They both finally found a place on a team during their peak which they are now past. If you have a 25-26 y/o AHL guy suddenly make a jump to stick at the NHL level you should only expect 1, maybe 2, seasons.

Same with Rocco and Blankenburg on the small skilled side. There will forever be flash in the pan guys that suddenly seem to put it together while in their physical prime.

 

[Armourboy]

It been discussed on these boards many times. 4th line plugs/tweeners should never be on long term contracts, they're to replaceable and they get too comfortable.

That's what we've seen with Smith and McCarron. They both finally found a place on a team during their peak which they are now past. If you have a 25-26 y/o AHL guy suddenly make a jump to stick at the NHL level you should only expect 1, maybe 2, seasons.

Same with Rocco and Blankenburg on the small skilled side. There will forever be flash in the pan guys that suddenly seem to put it together while in their physical prime.

Exactly, guys like that should be given year to year contracts. All they have going for them is effort, so once they get comfortable the effort level drops. That isn't a knock on them, it happens even with really good players, but those guys have enough skill that it mostly doesn't matter until they find that spark again. These type of players don't have that skill to start with.

It's one reason I'm interested to see what Olivier does in Columbus now that he has that long term deal.

 

[nine_inch_fang]

I thou

Exactly, guys like that should be given year to year contracts. All they have going for them is effort, so once they get comfortable the effort level drops. That isn't a knock on them, it happens even with really good players, but those guys have enough skill that it mostly doesn't matter until they find that spark again. These type of players don't have that skill to start with.

It's one reason I'm interested to see what Olivier does in Columbus now that he has that long term deal.

I thought about him too when I was posting that. He might be one of those players that has the physical endurance and the mental fortitude to put it together but we'll see.

 

[glenngineer]

I thou

I thought about him too when I was posting that. He might be one of those players that has the physical endurance and the mental fortitude to put it together but we'll see.

I think he separates himself from your typical guys as he's earned an "A" to wear on his sweater. Guys like that don't tend to take shifts off.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

I think he separates himself from your typical guys as he's earned an "A" to wear on his sweater. Guys like that don't tend to take shifts off.

Or.... they don't tend to take shifts off... UNTIL they get a 6-year $18M contract? It's impossible to know for sure. He's a guy who was never drafted and had to fight and claw for everything he ever got. Now he's set. Does that change anything?

It probably won't change anything, except history is a little bit rife with guys who weren't all that talented, Got Paid, and faded into oblivion? It would be totally unfair to paint Olivier with that brush, because every player is unique. And I am totally rooting for him and happy to see him get that deal. I guess I'm just saying it won't exactly shock me if he's not going to stick as an 18-goal/32-pt forward for the long haul.

 

[wmupreds]

Or.... they don't tend to take shifts off... UNTIL they get a 6-year $18M contract? It's impossible to know for sure. He's a guy who was never drafted and had to fight and claw for everything he ever got. Now he's set. Does that change anything?

It probably won't change anything, except history is a little bit rife with guys who weren't all that talented, Got Paid, and faded into oblivion? It would be totally unfair to paint Olivier with that brush, because every player is unique. And I am totally rooting for him and happy to see him get that deal. I guess I'm just saying it won't exactly shock me if he's not going to stick as an 18-goal/32-pt forward for the long haul.

Well he’s set up for failure if that’s the standard he’s judged on. He will almost certainly never score 18 goals again, because he’s extremely unlikely to ever shoot 16% over a full year again.

 

[Predsanddead24]

Or.... they don't tend to take shifts off... UNTIL they get a 6-year $18M contract? It's impossible to know for sure. He's a guy who was never drafted and had to fight and claw for everything he ever got. Now he's set. Does that change anything?

It probably won't change anything, except history is a little bit rife with guys who weren't all that talented, Got Paid, and faded into oblivion? It would be totally unfair to paint Olivier with that brush, because every player is unique. And I am totally rooting for him and happy to see him get that deal. I guess I'm just saying it won't exactly shock me if he's not going to stick as an 18-goal/32-pt forward for the long haul.

I think it's just natural to subconsciously do things different once you have that level of security. And when you're a guy who has largely been a borderline NHLer even the slightest decline is enough to knock you back down to replacement level player territory.

Well he’s set up for failure if that’s the standard he’s judged on. He will almost certainly never score 18 goals again, because he’s extremely unlikely to ever shoot 16% over a full year again.

Yeah shooting twice your career shooting percentage is probably the number one indicator he is likely to regress.

 

[glenngineer]

Or.... they don't tend to take shifts off... UNTIL they get a 6-year $18M contract? It's impossible to know for sure. He's a guy who was never drafted and had to fight and claw for everything he ever got. Now he's set. Does that change anything?

It probably won't change anything, except history is a little bit rife with guys who weren't all that talented, Got Paid, and faded into oblivion? It would be totally unfair to paint Olivier with that brush, because every player is unique. And I am totally rooting for him and happy to see him get that deal. I guess I'm just saying it won't exactly shock me if he's not going to stick as an 18-goal/32-pt forward for the long haul.

I'm not talking about his point total, that's not what my post was about. It's about effort, showing up, shift after shift and playing the right way. It's funny, I almost sounded like Trotz for a second.

Good on Olivier for working hard, finding a home and getting paid for it. He's also a guy who's going to stand up for his teammates, something we sorely lack.

 

[adsfan]

I'm not talking about his point total, that's not what my post was about. It's about effort, showing up, shift after shift and playing the right way. It's funny, I almost sounded like Trotz for a second.

Good on Olivier for working hard, finding a home and getting paid for it. He's also a guy who's going to stand up for his teammates, something we sorely lack.

I forgive you for sounding like Trotz!!!

Olivier worked hard in Milwaukee. I don't ever expect that to change. That doesn't mean he will get the same results.

Marino and Mutter are like Olivier. They have improved their skills since arriving in Milwaukee. Marino scores more and Mutter is a better skater.

 

[Armourboy]

I forgive you for sounding like Trotz!!!

Olivier worked hard in Milwaukee. I don't ever expect that to change. That doesn't mean he will get the same results.

Marino and Mutter are like Olivier. They have improved their skills since arriving in Milwaukee. Marino scores more and Mutter is a better skater.

He's also never had this level of security either though, which is where the interesting part of watching him will come in. He's always worked hard because he has never had a choice not to work hard. This will be the first time in his career that he has ever had a multi-year long term contract, and that has a way of affecting people.

Does he continue to work just as hard now that he knows year to year he is going to make 3 million a season? I hope the guy continues to do well, I just know it take a certain level of drive for people once they have peace of mind like that. It gets a bit harder during the summer to go in rather than taking that day to sit at the beach somewhere or spend it on the golf course.

 

[ShagDaddy]

I forgive you for sounding like Trotz!!!

Olivier worked hard in Milwaukee. I don't ever expect that to change. That doesn't mean he will get the same results.

Marino and Mutter are like Olivier. They have improved their skills since arriving in Milwaukee. Marino scores more and Mutter is a better skater.

I really like Mutter. I’d rather have him playing 4th line than Smith all day everyday.