TSN: Brown will no longer be Captain

[YP44]

I think he's a King at least this year until expansion and then maybe a buyout if he's not claimed due to other contracts (notably TT)

I thought they'd wait a year period just to see what happens recovery-wise and because the buyout terms would be better but the difference there is negligible.

I agree I think he is a king for at least one more year. Remeber buy out cap hit last twice the length of the remaining years on the deal. So one more year save 2.

Also waiting till next year flattens out the buy out cap hit. There would not be a year where it is over $4M

 

[Trolfoli]

How much space do they get next year if they were to buy him out? I'm seeing $5m+, so that would be an additional player somewhere. It's years 3/4, and 5/6 especially, where it hurts. But by then Gaborik and Carter are a few years older, Kopitar, Quick, Martinez, etc. Then years and years of almost $2m in dead cap space.

They're not Cup competitive, as of this October, because of Brown's contract. If it's $5m in cap space this summer buying Brown out, that's keeping Lucic, and getting another guy. That's more Cup competitive as of this October. It kills them in future seasons though.

I see the Kings as needing to wait for the next batch of AHL guys to make the team and start having an impact. It's doubtful that impact comes next year.


16-17 $680,555
17-18 $1,180,555
18-19 $2,180,555
19-20 $2,180,555
20-21 $3,680,555
21-22 $3,680,555
22-23 $1,805,555
23-24 $1,805,555
24-25 $1,805,555
26-27 $1,805,555
27-28 $1,805,555

The next 2 years is about the biggest benefit from a buyout. This is also a time when the Kings are trying to sort things out. Then you tack on the Richards cap hit and the Kings have a good amount, around $3M, of dead cap until some time close to 2030.

The problem with buying out next year is that the cap hit is set in stone. There maybe an opportunity in the next year or two. Maybe Brown gets a career ending injury, maybe he goes fishing in the off season with Richards. Who know what could happen. The second the buyout is done there's no changing it. Waiting allows the opportunity to try and find another way out.

Also the buyout's biggest benefit is in the next 2 years while the Kings are in the middle of a retool. It would make much more sense to trade Brown with 1.8M retained as it would only last half the buyout period and be equal or cheaper then all but 2 years.

 

[SettlementRichie10]

Pretty unbelievable that this team has essentially lost three core players in the span of two years for absolutely nothing.

 

[KingsFan7824]

I agree I think he is a king for at least one more year. Remeber buy out cap hit last twice the length of the remaining years on the deal. So one more year save 2.

Also waiting till next year flattens out the buy out cap hit. There would not be a year where it is over $4M

Brown is going to have such an odd year next season. Already stripped of the C. If he's not bought out now, he's going to cost the Kings either Lucic or an additional proven player. If he or the team struggles, every eye will be on him. More so than currently. If he puts up another 10 goal/25 point season, it's going to be a very weird ending for the guy who got the Cup first. Maybe he gets taken in the expansion draft. Maybe he gets bought out. Maybe he ends up stuck on the team until his contract is done, because how much dead cap space can you have between Brown and Richards?

Brown, Richards, Voynov. Those 3, for various reasons, are why Lombardi has to now scramble for a scoring winger, another center, and a top 4 defenseman. Brown not scoring in 13-14 is why Gaborik was needed, and then needed to be signed to another long contract. Couldn't trust Brown anymore. If Richards could still score, you could move Carter to wing, and Gaborik wouldn't have been as needed, and his long contract wouldn't have to be there. If Voynov doesn't get deported, no need to get Sekera and trade the 2016 pick. Because the 2016 pick was traded, and because the Kings missed the playoffs in 2015, you can't let that 2016 pick be a lottery pick, which in part is why Lucic was acquired. Now you have to try to fit him in with Brown and Gaborik still here, and with Toffoli and Pearson needing new deals.

A tangled web.

 

[KingsFan7824]

I see the Kings as needing to wait for the next batch of AHL guys to make the team and start having an impact. It's doubtful that impact comes next year.


16-17 $680,555
17-18 $1,180,555
18-19 $2,180,555
19-20 $2,180,555
20-21 $3,680,555
21-22 $3,680,555
22-23 $1,805,555
23-24 $1,805,555
24-25 $1,805,555
26-27 $1,805,555
27-28 $1,805,555

The next 2 years is about the biggest benefit from a buyout. This is also a time when the Kings are trying to sort things out. Then you tack on the Richards cap hit and the Kings have a good amount, around $3M, of dead cap until some time close to 2030.

The problem with buying out next year is that the cap hit is set in stone. There maybe an opportunity in the next year or two. Maybe Brown gets a career ending injury, maybe he goes fishing in the off season with Richards. Who know what could happen. The second the buyout is done there's no changing it. Waiting allows the opportunity to try and find another way out.

Also the buyout's biggest benefit is in the next 2 years while the Kings are in the middle of a retool. It would make much more sense to trade Brown with 1.8M retained as it would only last half the buyout period and be equal or cheaper then all but 2 years.

The only reason to do it now is because how good are the Kings going to be 3, 4, 5, 6 years from now? As you say, the cap hit wouldn't be terrible for the next 2 years. Kopitar is still on the right side of 30. Quick is still spry. Carter will be in his mid 30's in a few years. Gaborik will be in his late 30's or retired by then. You still have Doughty at $7m, instead of however much he'll cost on his next deal in a couple years.

The question is, does the time exist to sort things out for a year or two? This isn't Chicago in 2011 and 2012, when Kane and Toews are in their early 20's. If the Kings have a real shot again, how many do they have, and how many years can you wait? Kopitar is now at $10m. Doughty, if he stays, will be around there. Do you want the most benefit in the short term and get killed in the long term, or do you wait and see how things go? There's a solid argument either way.

 

[BigBrown]

Just pay whatever it takes to get Vegas to pick him in the expansion draft if at all doable. It's gonna suck but not as much as a buyout would.

 

[YP44]

Just pay whatever it takes to get Vegas to pick him in the expansion draft if at all doable. It's gonna suck but not as much as a buyout would.

what do you mean? How would LA pay Vegas to take Brown?

 

[BigBrown]

what do you mean? How would LA pay Vegas to take Brown?

I would assume you can negotiate with the drafting team regarding their pick. That might be completely wrong but I'm assuming you can. So you just ask them what it would take for them to draft Brown instead of whomever, they reply "two first round picks" or whatever, then you try to make it work.

 

[Scottkmlps]

what do you mean? How would LA pay Vegas to take Brown?

Kings did it when Nashville came into the league. Kings dealt Timonen and Cisar to the Preds in exchange for the Preds to take Frederic Chabot.

 

[YP44]

Kings did it when Nashville came into the league. Kings dealt Timonen and Cisar to the Preds in exchange for the Preds to take Frederic Chabot.

Still think it owuld be a pipe dream. LA would have to give vegas something alot better then Timonen(turned out to be great) and Cisar

 

[theMajor]

there is no way in hell Brown is bought out. the cost* of unloading Bickell's contract all but seals Brown's fate as an LA king, he's here for the long haul

 

[YP44]

there is no way in hell Brown is bought out. the coast of unloading Bickell's contract all but seals Brown's fate as an LA king, he's here for the long haul

I am going to pretend that he is only a $2M cap hit with the extra almost $4M a year a service fee for two cups. That way I will be able to cheer for him as he breaks the most games played as a king record.

I hope the last six years of his deal and how he has declined does not take away for all the good he has brought to the organization and how he will be remembered.

 

[theMajor]

Im hoping he comes in with a chip on his shoulder and something to prove. if theres anything that will light a fire under someones ass, its getting the Captaincy taken away. if hes still underwhelming after all thats gone down in the last few weeks, theres no hope!

 

[YP44]

Im hoping he comes in with a chip on his shoulder and something to prove. if theres anything that will light a fire under someones ass, its getting the Captaincy taken away. if hes still underwhelming after all thats gone down in the last few weeks, theres no hope!

I agree that there maybe hope but not optimism (big difference to me).

To me the hope is more that he will have less distractors by not being the captain and will be able to just focus on his play each shift. While on the bench he can focus on his next shift and what he needs to do, not focus on what he needs to say to the refs or anything. I do not know how much of a focus the C actually has, but it has to take some attention and focus.

Brown is better with less distractors IMO, that is why he does better on the road when he is without his family

 

[Little Psycho]

Oh c'mon somebody take Brown!

 

[Trolfoli]

The only reason to do it now is because how good are the Kings going to be 3, 4, 5, 6 years from now? As you say, the cap hit wouldn't be terrible for the next 2 years. Kopitar is still on the right side of 30. Quick is still spry. Carter will be in his mid 30's in a few years. Gaborik will be in his late 30's or retired by then. You still have Doughty at $7m, instead of however much he'll cost on his next deal in a couple years.

The question is, does the time exist to sort things out for a year or two? This isn't Chicago in 2011 and 2012, when Kane and Toews are in their early 20's. If the Kings have a real shot again, how many do they have, and how many years can you wait? Kopitar is now at $10m. Doughty, if he stays, will be around there. Do you want the most benefit in the short term and get killed in the long term, or do you wait and see how things go? There's a solid argument either way.

Valid points, buy we've all heard that Lombardi is switching from all in mode to his 5 year plan. Lombardi seems focused on building (re-inventing) for the future and not next year.

 

[BigKing]

Valid points, buy we've all heard that Lombardi is switching from all in mode to his 5 year plan. Lombardi seems focused on building (re-inventing) for the future and not next year.

It is a large assumption to think he will jump from "all-in" all the way back to a 5-Year plan with guys making $10MM a year on the team.

This will be a re-tool and not a five year plan. Black hole finish--like '15--at worst.

 

[KingsFan7824]

Valid points, buy we've all heard that Lombardi is switching from all in mode to his 5 year plan. Lombardi seems focused on building (re-inventing) for the future and not next year.

If they're going down that road, then I would hope they forget about Lucic and/or a proven top 4 defenseman this summer. Either keep the cap space open, or get a couple guys for a couple million on 1 year deals. Don't commit to anything beyond next year. Give the young guys a shot. See where things stand come the deadline. Then go into next summer with more flexibility with Toffoli and Pearson.

 

[AlphaBravo]

There is no point in buying out Brown this year. At this point, the Kings would be reckless not to at least try and see if Vegas will take him next year. DL needs to shift the focus on trading Gaborik, which I think is possible considering his decent cap hit (although bad term) and scoring abilities. We can also bury Brown in the minors for a $900k cap savings, although its probably better to use him considering he is worth $3 million to be in the bottom 6.

 

[YP44]

There is no point in buying out Brown this year. At this point, the Kings would be reckless not to at least try and see if Vegas will take him next year. DL needs to shift the focus on trading Gaborik, which I think is possible considering his decent cap hit (although bad term) and scoring abilities. We can also bury Brown in the minors for a $900k cap savings, although its probably better to use him considering he is worth $3 million to be in the bottom 6.

agree with you, especially on dealing Gaborik.

 

[Trolfoli]

It is a large assumption to think he will jump from "all-in" all the way back to a 5-Year plan with guys making $10MM a year on the team.

This will be a re-tool and not a five year plan. Black hole finish--like '15--at worst.

I'm assuming Lombardi's 5 year plan is about opening a cup window in years 3-5. Going past 5 years with the current core is pushing it. The next 2 years are going to be about addressing holes and letting the adjustments come in and gel.

If you accept that the Kings aren't going all in over the next 2 years, some things change. It would make no sense to buyout Brown before that. Carter may need to be moved due to age. Even if Carter isn't moved, there's a decent chance he moves back to RW by the time the next window is open.

Also I think it's pretty clear after last year, not picking up another top 4D for the playoffs that Lombardi isn't at a point where he's selling off future assets to put the team over the top.

I don't get why it's either All in, or blow it up. There maybe a 3rd option.

 

[CanadianKingsFan14]

Gaborik will also retire before his contract is up. Let's face it Gabby won't be playing until he's 39. Not with all his injuries he's faced over the years. I think if they retained 1 mill someone would take him in a trade.

 

[YP44]

I'm assuming Lombardi's 5 year plan is about opening a cup window in years 3-5. Going past 5 years with the current core is pushing it. The next 2 years are going to be about addressing holes and letting the adjustments come in and gel.

If you accept that the Kings aren't going all in over the next 2 years, some things change. It would make no sense to buyout Brown before that. Carter may need to be moved due to age. Even if Carter isn't moved, there's a decent chance he moves back to RW by the time the next window is open.

Also I think it's pretty clear after last year, not picking up another top 4D for the playoffs that Lombardi isn't at a point where he's selling off future assets to put the team over the top.

I don't get why it's either All in, or blow it up. There maybe a 3rd option.

agreed with the bolded, can we not be all in with the current make up? This team did not need to bring in VL, versteeg, and Schenn to be considered a favorite to win the cup. They were considered that beforehand.

This team as constructed should be competitive to win it all. That said there are obvious areas of improvement (D) and alot of stuff owuld have to go right for that to happen.

 

[Trolfoli]

Gaborik will also retire before his contract is up. Let's face it Gabby won't be playing until he's 39. Not with all his injuries he's faced over the years. I think if they retained 1 mill someone would take him in a trade.

This. The rumor at the time of the signing was Gabby wanted 3 years at 6M. The first 3 years of the contract are at 6M. It was an under 35 contract so there are no penalties for him retiring before the contract is up. Next year is the 3rd year of his contract. Gabby retiring after next season or the season after wouldn't surprise me at all.

agreed with the bolded, can we not be all in with the current make up? This team did not need to bring in VL, versteeg, and Schenn to be considered a favorite to win the cup. They were considered that beforehand.

This team as constructed should be competitive to win it all. That said there are obvious areas of improvement (D) and alot of stuff owuld have to go right for that to happen.

VL was a good gamble, Schenn was not a top 4D, Scuderi was not a top 4D. Moving Weal + 3rd, Zykov (passed on depth), Ehrhoff at the deadline doesn't scream all in to me.

I disagree that this team as constructed is good enough to win it all. They are close, but a dynamic player on the second D pair and a legit scoring threat on the 3rd line are a must. Kings don't have those players today. They've just lost too much.

 

[BigKing]

This. The rumor at the time of the signing was Gabby wanted 3 years at 6M. The first 3 years of the contract are at 6M. It was an under 35 contract so there are no penalties for him retiring before the contract is up. Next year is the 3rd year of his contract. Gabby retiring after next season or the season after wouldn't surprise me at all.



VL was a good gamble, Schenn was not a top 4D, Scuderi was not a top 4D. Moving Weal + 3rd, Zykov (passed on depth), Ehrhoff at the deadline doesn't scream all in to me.

I disagree that this team as constructed is good enough to win it all. They are close, but a dynamic player on the second D pair and a legit scoring threat on the 3rd line are a must. Kings don't have those players today. They've just lost too much.

Trading for Lucic knowing it would mean no 1st round picks for two consecutive years--along with the possibility of only having one year of Lucic--was the "all-in" move.

Everything during the season was just DL trying to address areas of weakness.