Brind'Amour throws Tulsky under the bus for the Rantanen situation: "And the question is, should we have known that before we attempted to sign him?"

[Voight]

Jiri Tlusty out here catching strays

When I saw the thread I said what the hell could Jiri have possibly done to RBA? Dudes been out of the league for almost a decade and was teammates with Rod for all of 18 games

 

[Voight]

Per Friedman, he did tell Carolina before the trade that he would consider signing in Carolina. At the 16:30 minute mark of his post-deadline wrap up here Friedman says that the Avs let Carolina talk to Rantanen's management, but Rantanen's team thought it was a Colorado bluff to scare Rantanen into coming back to the table. And if you don't want to listen to it, this is my transcript of it:



And then it turned out that Rantanen didn't want to sign there. The only reason he told Carolina "yes" was because he and his management thought they were calling the Avs' bluff and basically indicating that Rantanen was fine with leaving Denver in the offseason, if it came down to it, and they therefore figured that the Avs would panic and come back with a better offer.

I mean to be fair did he ever say yes to the Hurricanes/Tulsky? Or did he say that to his agent who said that to the Avs. He allegedly said yes hell sign there but that wasn't said to them, and honestly, the majority of elite players won't sign somewhere before meeting with the team and getting the lay of the land.

Who are you arguing against? Neither Rod nor I refuted that.

He's upset because the only guy they offered enough money to is the guy that didn't want to stay, and they should have known he didn't want to stay to begin with.

They also played hardball with Guentzel and by the time they were willing to meet his price it was too late.

Maybe he didn’t play so well becuase he was constantly being pestered to sign a contract. Rod’s system also does not seem to be terribly friendly to stat padding.

How is a trade at the draft going to help win tomorrow? That’s kind of the point of the sport.

It would be different if the Canes were in a position that they need to worry about the future. They’re the darlings after every draft because they take most of the guys that drop that people love. They should have no issue sacrificing futures to put them over the top. Tulsky did that and then chickened out.

Canes are also seen to be one elite/game breaking player away from being a true cup contender and now they lost said player and are back to where they've been the last few seasons.

 

[Connor McConnor]

For me the situation is kinda like “do I want to go to Fred’s house three Saturday's from now?” Someone asks me that I go “yea maybe, I gotta see what I got going on but il probably let you know” Feigning interest not to be rude but I have no intention of going to Fred’s house. Fred’s house is weird, kinda small and smells like old malted 40 bottles and skittles (cause of the candles).

When the time comes to confirm whether I will be going to Fred’s, I got say “Nah man not really, I can think of at least 4 other places I’d rather be.”

It’s kinda like that. Now if Fred bought extra boneless chicken wings and that wine he knows I like to drink, that’s on him. I never confirmed my attendance.

Better hope Fred isn’t on HF!

 

[GirardSpinorama]

The only thing that makes this situation really unique is the Carolina Hurricanes chose to re-sell Rantanen at the deadline. I think a lot of teams would have just accepted the rental and taken a hard run at the cup. This situation is weird where they reloaded on a bunch of futures that didn't help them this year.

They had no choice essentially. No one rantanen was willing to go to would give up a star winner. Except TO would give up Marner (also UFA) but marner said no.

 

[SeanMoneyHands]

Carolina is so desperate for a superstar to play for them. If Rantanen said that Carolina is not one of the 4 teams that he will play for, then why would you dress him? He even told you to your face that he doesn't want to play in Carolina but yet they tried to force the hand.

 

[tarheelhockey]

I actually checked before and they do have direct flights from DFW to Helsinki.

Ah, I thought not based on this chart. Must be out of date.

 

[PanniniClaus]

For Brindamour to go public... boy. He's got a weaker team now than he had and it probably doesn't help watching Necas fit right into the Colorado track team.

 

[Stephen]

Carolina is so desperate for a superstar to play for them. If Rantanen said that Carolina is not one of the 4 teams that he will play for, then why would you dress him? He even told you to your face that he doesn't want to play in Carolina but yet they tried to force the hand.

They shouldn't have fumbled Guentzel and treated Necas with a little more care. None of my business though.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

Carolina is so desperate for a superstar to play for them. If Rantanen said that Carolina is not one of the 4 teams that he will play for, then why would you dress him? He even told you to your face that he doesn't want to play in Carolina but yet they tried to force the hand.

Because they want to win games? Unless you think Tyson Jost should be in the lineup instead of Rantanen.

But it’s funny. I bet if Carolina had scratched Rantanen for those games, you’d be on here going “Why is Carolina ruining Rantanen like that?!”

 

[Czechboy]

View attachment 991051
This man is innocent!

Glad you chose this photo and not the famous one.lol

 

[Nogatco Rd]

To play devils advocate…

If we are to believe what Friedman speculated - that the Rantanen camp thought the Avs were using the Canes interest as a pressure tactic to get him to sign - then, it’s certainly feasible to assume that Rantanen called their “bluff” and said “sure I’d be interested in signing there”. The Avs, in turn, communicate that to the Canes and the Canes take that as them having a shot to sign him and move ahead with the trade.

Can you explain why it would benefit Rantanen to say he was interested in signing with Carolina if that wasn’t true? What leverage does he gain by saying he would be open to signing with Carolina after a trade?

 

[Nogatco Rd]

For me the situation is kinda like “do I want to go to Fred’s house three Saturday's from now?” Someone asks me that I go “yea maybe, I gotta see what I got going on but il probably let you know” Feigning interest not to be rude but I have no intention of going to Fred’s house. Fred’s house is weird, kinda small and smells like old malted 40 bottles and skittles (cause of the candles).

When the time comes to confirm whether I will be going to Fred’s, I got say “Nah man not really, I can think of at least 4 other places I’d rather be.”

It’s kinda like that. Now if Fred bought extra boneless chicken wings and that wine he knows I like to drink, that’s on him. I never confirmed my attendance.

Sounds like Fred had a really special evening planned for you guys and you played him for a fool. Sometimes I don’t know why he even bothers.

 

[Oilslick941611]

There was talk about the deal close to being done the night before the deadline (granted it was late at night i think)........And you run out of time ?

I'm not privy to how it all works behind the scenes but that feels so amateurish....

deal was contingent on Rantanen signing an extension and that didn't get done until the home stretch. But the deal was done in principle the night before and there are rumours that Canes were talking to Vancouver about Boeser with 30ish minutes left before the deadline.

 

[wetcoast]

There’s a lot of Monday morning QB’ing going on.

Everyone, and I mean EVERYONE thought this was a great move by the Canes when it was done. If someone said otherwise at the time, I’ll give them credit but I wanna see receipts first.

Agree but for the record I thought it was a good move for the Avs as well assuming that they were under the impression that Rantanen wasn't resigning with them.

 

[Oilslick941611]

Rantanen was not a good player for us. He made the decision to part ways quite easy (and lost a lot of my respect in the process).

I’m sure he’ll sleep fine.

100%

I have no love for the Canes on account of 2006 and all, but Rantanen did you guys dirty, even if what he did was within his rights, it was still a shitty thing to give false hope before the deal was made and then drag it out until the last minute.

I never cared for Rantanen before, but i think a lot less of him now.

 

[JaegerDice]

Rantanen comes off as a bit of a **** in this reading. Like, you’re so closed minded you cant even give a city or organization a chance to impress you?

Tulsky took a shot on the kind of player you rarely get a shot at, hoped he could sell him on the vision. I dont really blame him.

 

[Nogatco Rd]

There’s a lot of Monday morning QB’ing going on.

Everyone, and I mean EVERYONE thought this was a great move by the Canes when it was done. If someone said otherwise at the time, I’ll give them credit but I wanna see receipts first.

I’ll go ahead and pat my own back here.

I didn’t know a ton about Rantanen but I know that for a team to walk away from a fan favorite player who sells a million jerseys and scores a million points, that tells me they must know something everyone else doesn’t. Whether it has to do with the player’s work ethic or just their own internal evaluation of his replaceability within the org, I can’t say.

The idea that this was sparked by a difference of a million or two AAV didn’t hold water for me. Teams figure out a way to make it work if they truly value what that player will bring to the table for the next 7-8 years.

Clearly they felt the money — 11.5, 12, 13M, whatever — was best spent elsewhere, and early returns have vindicated them.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

Can you explain why it would benefit Rantanen to say he was interested in signing with Carolina if that wasn’t true? What leverage does he gain by saying he would be open to signing with Carolina after a trade?

If he/his agent make it sound like he’s only going to sign with Colorado, Colorado can keep him past the deadline and until the end of the year and offer him less. So they assumed that the potential “trade to Carolina” was a bluff by Colorado to see if Rantanen would only sign there. Instead, it wasn’t a bluff, it was a legitimate ask, and by “calling the bluff”, it set this entire thing in motion.

 

[Nogatco Rd]

If he/his agent make it sound like he’s only going to sign with Colorado, Colorado can keep him past the deadline and until the end of the year and offer him less. So they assumed that the potential “trade to Carolina” was a bluff by Colorado to see if Rantanen would only sign there. Instead, it wasn’t a bluff, it was a legitimate ask, and by “calling the bluff”, it set this entire thing in motion.

Sorry but I don’t see how there’s anything to be gained in terms of leverage by feigning interest in Carolina that he couldn’t just as easily get by saying “I’m considering exploring free agency this summer if my demands aren’t met.”

You might have a point if he had 2 years left on his deal and they were discussing a prospective extension, but the guy was months from free agency.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

Sorry but I don’t see how there’s anything to be gained in terms of leverage by feigning interest in Carolina that he couldn’t just as easily get by saying “I’m considering exploring free agency this summer if my demands aren’t met.”

You might have a point if he had 2 years left on his deal and they were discussing a prospective extension, but the guy was months from free agency.

Look no further than Elias Pettersson if you want a better example. Vancouver was having trouble getting Pettersson to sign a new deal. Vancouver started discussing a trade with Carolina, to the point where both sides needed to have “serious discussions about where the relationship was heading“ Pettersson, when faced with the possibility of a trade, came back to the bargaining table and signed a new deal with Vancouver.

Rantanen/his agent thought the same move was being played here. They assumed the trade threat to Carolina was a bluff to get them to reconsider their position, and it wasn’t.

 

[qc14]

This rant by Rod wasn't only about Rantanen, which is why he brought up other players and Guentzel. Basically saying no player has ever wanted to leave, they just don't get paid like they should in Carolina.

He himself was nickel and dimed by the owner. He's tired of that shit. He's probably frustrated that the people in charge above him are more concerned about maximizing value than doing what it takes to put the team over the top.

If you're someone who thinks they "salvaged" the situation fine, but for him as a coach, he's trying to win the Cup and his team is worse now than it was a month or so ago and it's clear he thinks they don't do enough to make it better.

Yep this was my exact read on it. A guy that has dealt first hand with how the FO needs to "win" every negotiation and ends up losing good players because of it.

As much as I think Rod is a major asshole I completely understand his frustration here. He's out here trying to win a cup and management has made his roster worse.

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

Sorry but trading Necas without signing Rantanen was god stupid

 

[bleedgreen]

Yep this was my exact read on it. A guy that has dealt first hand with how the FO needs to "win" every negotiation and ends up losing good players because of it.

As much as I think Rod is a major asshole I completely understand his frustration here. He's out here trying to win a cup and management has made his roster worse.

You have to take things in context. The Canes took a step back last summer and this year is the beginning of the new build. There really isn’t any real huge expectations of the Canes winning this season. They made the roster better for the future. Necas wasn’t a long term option. We’ve got Hall who’s playing well and it sounds like he’s staying, plus Stank who’s got a good chance of being a core player plus two first rounders to either draft or trade.

Sure it would be great to use Necas to target a 2C or RD but they got good value for him in the end.

RBA wants to win every season so of course he gets annoyed but Necas annoyed him just as much. The only true mistake I think the Canes have made recently is grinding Jake and losing him. Long term that’s probably a good choice though.

 

[OilersFanatics505]

As a habitual Avs GDT lurker I can confirm, his reputation for laziness is almost as ubiquitous as MacK’s reputation of being a hard-ass.

The best part is that the records are there and people are just refusing to believe it. The Avs fans have been hard on Rantanen for his effort quite often. They think, and I believe it to be true too, that he’d be a perennial Hart candidate if he put in more effort…

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

I’m laughing at the scientist part. Admirable but absolutely hilarious and not surprising

Makes me think Tlusky is the one who created/edited the wikipage and the unsure birth year was just a ploy so no one would know he's the one who wrote down 'scientist'.