Player Discussion Brady Tkachuk (LW) - Part XI

[PlayOn]

And I dont think the Tkachuks have some mythical bargaining prowess. Every great player has that same leverage through their agents. Stu will have it as well. And all agents will use it. I dont see the Tkachuks being any different or better at it. And again it appears to be our insecurity over maybe losing him but apparently no one else, that has whipped up a frenzy where sens fans are calling him names, questioning his character, and calling for his trade, perhaps hoping to Larry Murphy him out of here to avoid being hurt. I cant think of anything Brady has done that would warrant this. The team still looks poised with key pieces and an ability to grow whether it makes the playoffs this year or not. And that's what counts. We should get over this 8 year navel gazing i think. Past is gone, we are in the present. Looks promising to me, im sure Brady must see it too.

Brady got a NMC on his contract, something the rest of the core didn’t (outside of Hamonic but that’s a given he’s so elite).

You can argue that Stützle and Sanderson and whoever else didn’t try for one, but that probably still speaks to the fact that the Tkachuks are smarter and better about ensuring they have all the leverage. If Brady doesn’t have a NMC none of these discussions are even happening right now.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

Like it's not even close. RK would need maintenance days because he was top 3 in ice time across the league most of the time he was here while playing elite defense. Brady has never been elite at anything but because he hits and is loud, he's considered a warrior. Like we're so starved for talent and on ice success some fans think EKs 30 min games are lesser than apparently whatever Tkachuk is doing.

We're not going deep even if we get into the playoffs because Tkachuks playing hard (hitting everything in sight) isn't sustainable and is going to get him hurt.

The dude lost teeth and came back to score an OT goal with stitches in his mouth, so I won't say he doesn't care but the guy prioritized USA over the team that plays his salary. He's allowed to prioritize his nation, especially when he gets to play with more skilled guys and his brother, but it's short sighted and can cost us wins this season.

Look at a guy like Pietrangelo, he backed out of the tournament and is on ice for Vegas helping them win. This tournament may be huge for the league, but it's so ass for us as Sens fans.

I get what you're saying, and do agree with it a bit, but there's also another factor at play here.

The NHL desperately wanted this tournament to become a Big Thing. They needed it to become a Big Thing. I wouldn't be surprised if the cream of the crop for all teams really had a lot of pressure on them behind the scenes to be on the ice unless they were in a hospital bed. It's not like the all star game where there was a lot of wink wink, nudge nudge injuries to get out of showing up.

 

[ahmedou]

 

[thinkwild]

Brady got a NMC on his contract, something the rest of the core didn’t (outside of Hamonic but that’s a given he’s so elite).

You can argue that Stützle and Sanderson and whoever else didn’t try for one, but that probably still speaks to the fact that the Tkachuks are smarter and better about ensuring they have all the leverage. If Brady doesn’t have a NMC none of these discussions are even happening right now.

That's a fair point. He maximized his leverage and got the team to give him an NMC for the last few years. And for a bit more than i thought was the right value at the time. But now i think it is the right value. But i dont think he got the team to break its stance on not giving bonuses did he?

Imagine we wanted to trade him before the NMC's kick in. I'm not sure we are going to get that much more leverage against that impending deadline than trading him in the last year if he decides not to sign another contract with us.

 

[Micklebot]

Brady got a NMC on his contract, something the rest of the core didn’t (outside of Hamonic but that’s a given he’s so elite).

You can argue that Stützle and Sanderson and whoever else didn’t try for one, but that probably still speaks to the fact that the Tkachuks are smarter and better about ensuring they have all the leverage. If Brady doesn’t have a NMC none of these discussions are even happening right now.

NMC only kicks in for UFA years, so it's only relevant in the final few years of a deal that came off your ELC. A player needs to make a choice between whether they value that clause more than the additional $ they could get by using it as a bargaining chip. The reality though is most players at this level have a defacto NTC since they can make it clear they wouldn't be sticking around if traded to x destination, this is what M.Tkachuk and DeBrincat did.

The truth is that all the players have agents that are well aware of the leverage ramifications of negotiating in a NMC or not, so I don't see how this is a Tkachuk being smarter thing. It's a decision based on personal preferences, nothing else. A player that doesn't have a preference as to where he plays, or who is open to a couple stops along the way to picking his destination as a UFA is better off seeking maximum aav rather than building in protection. Meanwhile a player who wants to build something in one spot and prioritizes team success might take a lower AAV to help the team build around them, but want the NMC to ensure if things go sideways they still have control of their future, And finally, a player that already has all the leverage might demand both the high AAV and the NMC, because they can....

 

[PlayOn]

NMC only kicks in for UFA years, so it's only relevant in the final few years of a deal that came off your ELC. A player needs to make a choice between whether they value that clause more than the additional $ they could get by using it as a bargaining chip. The reality though is most players at this level have a defacto NTC since they can make it clear they wouldn't be sticking around if traded to x destination, this is what M.Tkachuk and DeBrincat did.

The truth is that all the players have agents that are well aware of the leverage ramifications of negotiating in a NMC or not, so I don't see how this is a Tkachuk being smarter thing. It's a decision based on personal preferences, nothing else. A player that doesn't have a preference as to where he plays, or who is open to a couple stops along the way to picking his destination as a UFA is better off seeking maximum aav rather than building in protection. Meanwhile a player who wants to build something in one spot and prioritizes team success might take a lower AAV to help the team build around them, but want the NMC to ensure if things go sideways they still have control of their future, And finally, a player that already has all the leverage might demand both the high AAV and the NMC, because they can....

I don’t think they are better negotiators, I think that players largely take what they’re told they can get and the Tkachuks don’t care about the rules - if they want something they will push.

Ie if the Sens say no NMCs and bonuses, most players shrug it off and take the higher salary. Brady is probably the last guy we should’ve given a NMC to, but he has one because he likely insisted he had one, even if he missed part of camp.

 

[jbeck5]

Pretty sure Noah Gregor won fastest skater and beat the previous record held by Colin Greening.

Hardest shot was Batherson at like 104.4mph I think. He didn’t beat Jared Cowen’s 109mph record apparently.

I think 2-3 players got 4/4 for the accuracy, Stützle was one of them. I think Giroux too.

I feel like they never have accurate measures at the sens skills comp specifically.

I've been to many as I've always gotten free tickets. Got tickets to this year's but couldn't make it.

I always see 100+mph shots...yet never see them in games. The hardest I'll see is like 95-97...even with no traffic and just walking in from the Blueline to crank it. Or a perfect one timer.....95.6mph shows up on TV.

Yet at these things, guys who are not known for having a rocket will all of a sudden shoot 106 or something... apparently batherson has a rocket like she's Weber or Zdeno Chara, yet we're not utilising him at the point on the powerplay?

Is it really so hard to calibrate these things properly?

 

[Micklebot]

I don’t think they are better negotiators, I think that players largely take what they’re told they can get and the Tkachuks don’t care about the rules - if they want something they will push.

Ie if the Sens say no NMCs and bonuses, most players shrug it off and take the higher salary. Brady is probably the last guy we should’ve given a NMC to, but he has one because he likely insisted he had one, even if he missed part of camp.

Why would a guy you envision as your long term captain be the last guy you'd want to give a NTM to?

The last guy I'd want to give a NTM to is Hamonic, followed by anybody that I expect to trade rather than extend.

There seems to be a baseline assumption Tkachuk will want out. Idk if that's a fair assumption, and while it's certainly possible he will want out if we can't become a competitive team before it's time to re-up, he really hasn't telegraphed that desire.

I get it, we've had trouble keeping guys, but idk that the circumstances really align.

Karlsson wanted out because of Melnyk and the expectation that we'd flip him either way, Spezza wanted out because we were headed for a rebuild, DeBrincat never wanted to be here, Stone, at least according to York, wanted to stay but we refused to give him a NTC, meanwhile you had people fear monger about Ryan leaving, but he extended (kind of bit us in theass but oh well) and the same happened with Methot to a lesser degree.

If we want to keep our star players, we just need to treat them right, and be successful. Guys are saying this is one of the tightest groups they've seen so I suspect we are doing ok on the first part, the last part is obviously the tricky one, but I think we are on the right path.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

That's a fair point. He maximized his leverage and got the team to give him an NMC for the last few years. And for a bit more than i thought was the right value at the time. But now i think it is the right value. But i dont think he got the team to break its stance on not giving bonuses did he?

Imagine we wanted to trade him before the NMC's kick in. I'm not sure we are going to get that much more leverage against that impending deadline than trading him in the last year if he decides not to sign another contract with us.

If we trade him before the NMC kicks in, the acquiring team can choose to ignore the NMC (unless that has changed? Happened to Subban when he went to Nashville) so I'm not worried about the return: a signed B. Tkachuk is worth a fortune.

We are still better off keeping him though.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

If we trade him before the NMC kicks in, the acquiring team can choose to ignore the NMC (unless that has changed? Happened to Subban when he went to Nashville) so I'm not worried about the return: a signed B. Tkachuk is worth a fortune.

We are still better off keeping him though.

Under the old CBA, trade protection was voided if a player was traded before it kicked in. They modified that when they updated the CBA. Now, all trade protection travels with the layer.

That is why Brady's NMC will still give him some leverage. If a team like Columbus or San Jose meets our price, they may want some sort of assurance before completing the trade that Brady actually wants to be there. Imagine giving up the value of Brady without a NMC, then having to trade him in 1-2 years because he is unhappy with the fit and is explicit that he won't re-sign. Like with Miller, Brady's NMC would neuter what they could recover.

 

[DueDiligence]

the biggest draw in the community is Brady. He is creating more young fans and putting more bums in the seats than virtually all the other players combined. That fact alone makes him an untouchable asset as far as Andlauer is concerned.

 

[PlayOn]

Why would a guy you envision as your long term captain be the last guy you'd want to give a NTM to?

The last guy I'd want to give a NTM to is Hamonic, followed by anybody that I expect to trade rather than extend.

There seems to be a baseline assumption Tkachuk will want out. Idk if that's a fair assumption, and while it's certainly possible he will want out if we can't become a competitive team before it's time to re-up, he really hasn't telegraphed that desire.

I get it, we've had trouble keeping guys, but idk that the circumstances really align.

Karlsson wanted out because of Melnyk and the expectation that we'd flip him either way, Spezza wanted out because we were headed for a rebuild, DeBrincat never wanted to be here, Stone, at least according to York, wanted to stay but we refused to give him a NTC, meanwhile you had people fear monger about Ryan leaving, but he extended (kind of bit us in theass but oh well) and the same happened with Methot to a lesser degree.

If we want to keep our star players, we just need to treat them right, and be successful. Guys are saying this is one of the tightest groups they've seen so I suspect we are doing ok on the first part, the last part is obviously the tricky one, but I think we are on the right path.

Honestly, I’d rather give one to Hamonic lol. The consequences of him exercising it are far less.

But I get your point. And I agree with you, it is probably not entirely fair. He is a star with a brother in the NHL (playing in one of the more desirable markets), has a history of family that left Canada to play in the US, and there is always a ton of media noise around him. None of that means that Brady himself plans on leaving - I don’t think we can possibly know one way or another - but they are elements to consider. And so he does feel like a much higher flight risk than say Stützle, who has no roots anywhere in North America besides Ottawa.

It is kind of a pointless thing to worry about though. We’ll see what happens when the time comes, hopefully he’s in it for the long haul.