Brad Treliving is doing a great job.

[conFABulator]

You can't put a crown on a clown and call him a king.

Treliving's first year was a write off. I can't understand this need for new management to observe a team for a year before making changes. Why'd they hire him in the first place.

He should know everything about the team already.

The average fan on this forum could tell you the team's strengths and weaknesses. Even make suggestions about what to do. Why are they paying someone millions of dollars who doesn't have a clue.

Even looking at this team through rose coloured glasses all the red flags still look like red flags.

Were we supposed to break out the brandy and cigars because after a year of watching the team take a step backwards Treliving finally figured out Keefe should be fired. Then giving out all those retirement contracts to washed up vets. Considering the evidence calling Treliving anything but incompetent would be denial of facts.

You can call a fish a dog all you want but it won't make it true.

There was no way Treliving was moving Marner or Tavares last year. It wasn't happening. It all but confirmed by Shanny before he hired Tre and there was not enough time for Tre anyway. Those NMCs are not on him.

This team is quite different from the one Tre inherited. This team has depth and balance that we have not seen in the Matthews era. We have a new coach and a new captain.

We have the core four and a stronger supporting cast of forwards than we have had.

Our D has Liljegren as seven now and possibly movable now. Tanev, Benoit, OEL, Hakanpaa and Myers are nice adds.

Strong goaltending depth too.

We could move out Kampf, Jarnkrok and Liljegren for picks and space without really missing them because have depth and balance.

We are in a strong spot, no?

 

[colchar]

Treliving/Berube have their work cut out for them. They have a bigger, tougher blueline but it's the forwards that need to embrace the mentality: Beat the SH!T out of your opponents, aggravate them, get in their goalie's face, be like a pitbull on the puck, drive to the net like a runaway train. Then come back to bench, take a few deep breaths and go out there and do it again, every shift.

Does anyone really believe that the likes of Marner, JT, Nylander, and Captain America have that in them?

 

[Maple Leaf]

Just finished watching the 3rd episode of the Amazon series focusing on the Boston/Florida series last year.

After the Panthers beat the Bs for the second consecutive year Pasta said (paraphrasing) "They're a nasty team, very tough to play against." Until an opponent says that about the Leafs, they won't win anything.

The Panthers took it to the Bruins and never let up the entire series. The Leafs pounded the Bruins hard in game one (but lost anyway) then let up.

Treliving/Berube have their work cut out for them. They have a bigger, tougher blueline but it's the forwards that need to embrace the mentality: Beat the SH!T out of your opponents, aggravate them, get in their goalie's face, be like a pitbull on the puck, drive to the net like a runaway train. Then come back to bench, take a few deep breaths and go out there and do it again, every shift.

Let's see if there are any signs during the season that they finally understand this or are they still going to try and dangle, shoot from the perimeter and hope that their skill alone wins them games. I'm not optimistic at all, but even halfway to that could open the doors to a mindset change this group desperately needs.

The hard minutes in the playoffs go to the soft oreo core of the team
Same result

 

[Evilhomer]

Just finished watching the 3rd episode of the Amazon series focusing on the Boston/Florida series last year.

After the Panthers beat the Bs for the second consecutive year Pasta said (paraphrasing) "They're a nasty team, very tough to play against." Until an opponent says that about the Leafs, they won't win anything.

The Panthers took it to the Bruins and never let up the entire series. The Leafs pounded the Bruins hard in game one (but lost anyway) then let up.

Treliving/Berube have their work cut out for them. They have a bigger, tougher blueline but it's the forwards that need to embrace the mentality: Beat the SH!T out of your opponents, aggravate them, get in their goalie's face, be like a pitbull on the puck, drive to the net like a runaway train. Then come back to bench, take a few deep breaths and go out there and do it again, every shift.

Let's see if there are any signs during the season that they finally understand this or are they still going to try and dangle, shoot from the perimeter and hope that their skill alone wins them games. I'm not optimistic at all, but even halfway to that could open the doors to a mindset change this group desperately needs.

Meh, did Colorado win a Cup this way? Tampa really didn't (they had a couple of guys who played that way, but they really just won on skill). Pittsburgh certainly never won that way, and nor did Detroit. There is no hard and fast rule about how to win. Every team does it differently. If it was all about toughness and being a "pitbull", every team in the league would look the same, but that isn't reality.

 

[All Mod Cons]

Does anyone really believe that the likes of Marner, JT, Nylander, and Captain America have that in them?

I think Nylander and Matthews have it in them.

 

[notbias]

Meh, did Colorado win a Cup this way? Tampa really didn't (they had a couple of guys who played that way, but they really just won on skill). Pittsburgh certainly never won that way, and nor did Detroit. There is no hard and fast rule about how to win. Every team does it differently. If it was all about toughness and being a "pitbull", every team in the league would look the same, but that isn't reality.

When deciding what kind of team wins a cup, I've noticed most people have the ability to view the most recent winner and nothing else...

Many different kinds of teams can win a cup, but that doesn't allow them to say that our team's problem is "X", so they can't say that.

 

[Dreakmur]

When deciding what kind of team wins a cup, I've noticed most people have the ability to view the most recent winner and nothing else...

Many different kinds of teams can win a cup, but that doesn't allow them to say that our team's problem is "X", so they can't say that.

You don’t have to be any specific style, but you do have to be able to beat specific styles on your way to the cup.

 

[Roo]

Job on paper is done. Excited to find out how he has really done once the games count.

 

[Evilhomer]

You don’t have to be any specific style, but you do have to be able to beat specific styles on your way to the cup.

You mostly just have to get lucky. Thousands of random events have to go your way. That's pretty much it. It's not like the Islanders or the Oilers of the 1980s, or the Canadiens of the 1970s, where a single team was so dramatically better than everyone else. At this point in the NHL, it's basically a coin flip between most teams. The Leafs just need to win a few of those coin flips. Eventually, they will.

 

[Dreakmur]

You mostly just have to get lucky. Thousands of random events have to go your way. That's pretty much it. It's not like the Islanders or the Oilers of the 1980s, or the Canadiens of the 1970s, where a single team was so dramatically better than everyone else. At this point in the NHL, it's basically a coin flip between most teams. The Leafs just need to win a few of those coin flips. Eventually, they will.

That's exactly the kind of flawed logic that cost Dubas and Keefe their jobs.

 

[colchar]

That's exactly the kind of flawed logic that cost Dubas and Keefe their jobs.

And deservedly so.

 

[Nineteen67]

You mostly just have to get lucky. Thousands of random events have to go your way. That's pretty much it. It's not like the Islanders or the Oilers of the 1980s, or the Canadiens of the 1970s, where a single team was so dramatically better than everyone else. At this point in the NHL, it's basically a coin flip between most teams. The Leafs just need to win a few of those coin flips. Eventually, they will.

If you don’t have a capable players then it you don’t win coin flips in the playoffs. No one knows if the Leafs have capable players.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I mean, how credible is it when Bobrovski is in our division?

But hey, so long as we are healthy, we should be MUCH better in net. That has been our biggest issue (though some are still convinced its the core) in my opinion. If Woll can just stay healthy and play to his potential, it should help us take that next step we've been long awaiting.

Goalies do last longer than most forwards and defense but bob is still 36 unless he's Patrick Roy, Brodeur, Hasek or Belfour he's going to fall off relatively soon.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

That's exactly the kind of flawed logic that cost Dubas and Keefe their jobs.

Keefe lost his Job because he's shit at his job.

Thing is nobody sees that because he gets carried by elite talent.

First it was Matthews, now It's Hughes.

 

[notbias]

Keefe lost his Job because he's shit at his job.

Thing is nobody sees that because he gets carried by elite talent.

First it was Matthews, now It's Hughes.

How bad was Babcock then?

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

If you don’t have a capable players then it you don’t win coin flips in the playoffs. No one knows if the Leafs have capable players.

I'm fully confident the Leafs have capable players, they didn't have a capable coach.

Now we will find out, is it the coach like I've always believed it was?

Or is it truly the players?

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

How bad was Babcock then?

Babcock and Keefe are not the same, Babcock is an ass but he's won everything there is to win.

Keefe hasn't won Jack shit.

And Babcock never had anywhere near the caliber of teams Keefe did in Toronto.

Give Babcock those 2021 and 2023 playoff rosters and both those teams are in the finals.

Babcock has a hall of fame resume

Keefe has won 1 round

 

[notbias]

Babcock and Keefe are not the same, Babcock is an ass but he's won everything there is to win.

Keefe hasn't won Jack shit.

And Babcock never had anywhere near the caliber of teams Keefe did in Toronto.

Give Babcock those 2021 and 2023 playoff rosters and both those teams are in the finals.

Babcock has a hall of fame resume

Keefe has won 1 round

You can't say Keefe sucks but was propped up by his players, then say Babcock won everything and not mention how stacked his teams were.

Also, they had the same team for one year...

 

[Nineteen67]

I'm fully confident the Leafs have capable players, they didn't have a capable coach.

Now we will find out, is it the coach like I've always believed it was?

Or is it truly the players?

As a series goes along their stars have been pushed out every year, playoffs or play in, which made them incapable, imo.

 

[Tak7]

He has $5.5M in cap space sitting on the fringes of his roster, and both his goaltending and Dmen seem like they are being balanced on a knife edge with injuries just around the corner, ready to derail things.

I'm not sure where this idea has come from that he's doing a GREAT job. He's been okay. Not horrible, but not fantastic either.

 

[GoonieFace]

He has $5.5M in cap space sitting on the fringes of his roster, and both his goaltending and Dmen seem like they are being balanced on a knife edge with injuries just around the corner, ready to derail things.

I'm not sure where this idea has come from that he's doing a GREAT job. He's been okay. Not horrible, but not fantastic either.

Agreed. He’s basically collected a garage sale worth of depth players, some overpaid. He has really done nothing of substance since he took over, which is probably what MLSE wants anyway. Keep the core together and sprinkle the edges and than hope and pray

 

[The Shadow]

Agreed. He’s basically collected a garage sale worth of depth players, some overpaid. He has really done nothing of substance since he took over, which is probably what MLSE wants anyway. Keep the core together and sprinkle the edges and than hope and pray

He also has had a smaller cap space to work with. Give him one more off season of cap flexibility and we can then judge better on what he does with that space

 

[conFABulator]

He has $5.5M in cap space sitting on the fringes of his roster, and both his goaltending and Dmen seem like they are being balanced on a knife edge with injuries just around the corner, ready to derail things.

I'm not sure where this idea has come from that he's doing a GREAT job. He's been okay. Not horrible, but not fantastic either.

I can agree that saying he has done a GREAT job is premature, possibly will never be accurate.

I will say it is possible he is doing a GREAT job. In a little over a year, he has certainly put his stamp on this team.

I know we still have the core four plus one more and that he technically could have moved Marner or Tavares last summer; he just got here, did not have a lot of time, and Shanny had made clear they were not moving before he hired Tre...it is also possibly that keeping them was the right move.

I do like that neither Marner or Tavares has a contract. I would be very OK with KT signing a low-dollar, hometown discount extension any time. I would also be OK with MM doing that but don't see if happening obviously. I like Marner playing for a contract and I like that this will put pressure on him all year to perform, isn't this what we want? Him learning to perform under pressure?

I like the new coach and coaching staff. We needed to move on from Keefe and I think Berube was a good direction to go in.

I like that we have a new captain and am pleased it happened without drama which is a credit to both men involved and the organization. Let's see where Matty can lead us now that this is officially his team.

I like that we have not moved out any top prospects or picks so far and that we even recouped a pick or two. I believe some of Liljegren, Kampf and Jarnkrok may help stock those shelves a bit too.

I really like the competition this camp created across the line-up. Accountability I'd very important and appeared to be lacking for years. A new coach and a new culture of internal competition could go a long way.

The regular season does matter. Our playoff fortunes are impacted by who we play in round one. There are a lot of reasons to believe we might get a different regular season outcome and this gives us hope we might get a different playoff outcome.

 

[DarkKnight]

Not saying he’s doing a great job or terrible job, but I note the season predictions coming in all seem to have us higher than previous years. Athletic for example has us coming out of the East. Nobody I’ve read has us lower than second in the Atlantic. People see something anyways, but that’s on paper so…

 

[GoonieFace]

He also has had a smaller cap space to work with. Give him one more off season of cap flexibility and we can then judge better on what he does with that space

He actually had a decent amount of cap space to work with. He decided to overpay Lily, too many years on OEL and the Tanev contract…not sure how I feel about that one. Also 1.5 mil to a broken Hanky Panky.

I’m not confident he will do anything good with more cap space.