Bob McKenzie Pre Season 2025 Draft Rankings

[ORRFForever]

He'll be centering Perreault and Leonard. I think any concerns over his size are silenced by mid-December, if not sooner.

Also,

Crosby 5’10, 175 (post)
Stamkos 5’11, 176 (post)
Bedard 5’10, 183 (pre)
Hughes 5'10, 170 (post)

The scout Bob quoted should have been reminded of this and then allowed to offer a follow-up response clarifying what he said why he said it.

Stamkos is 5'11 ?

 

[ORRFForever]

6 Canadians in Bob's Top 10. 11 in the Top 20. Not too shabby.

Canada's been averaging 15 1st Round Picks since 2020. Looks likely again in 2025.... and 2026.

 

[Steve Kournianos]

Stamkos is 5'11 ?

According to the 2008 Hockey News Draft Preview he was

 

[Juxtaposer]

According to the 2008 Hockey News Draft Preview he was

A more salient point is that among the four guys you listed (Crosby, Stamkos, Hughes, Bedard), only Crosby is a true center. Stamkos has played the best years of his career at wing, Hughes played mostly wing last season, and Bedard is already getting questions about if he should move to wing because he's quite poor defensively in addition to being small.

I actually like Hagens' chances to stick at center more than Stamkos/Hughes/Bedard because he's much more committed defensively than any of those guys, but I absolutely think it's a fair question to ask. There are almost zero 5'10" centers in the league. It's like, Crosby, Point, end of list.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

A more salient point is that among the four guys you listed (Crosby, Stamkos, Hughes, Bedard), only Crosby is a true center. Stamkos has played the best years of his career at wing, Hughes played mostly wing last season, and Bedard is already getting questions about if he should move to wing because he's quite poor defensively in addition to being small.

I actually like Hagens' chances to stick at center more than Stamkos/Hughes/Bedard because he's much more committed defensively than any of those guys, but I absolutely think it's a fair question to ask. There are almost zero 5'10" centers in the league. It's like, Crosby, Point, end of list.

Shouldn’t we be referring to Hagens as 5’11 now? For the record, I agree with your short centers point, although I would say it’s below 5’10, not 5’10, that is the turning point.

 

[Czechboy]

Shouldn’t we be referring to Hagens as 5’11 now? For the record, I agree with your short centers point, although I would say it’s below 5’10, not 5’10, that is the turning point.

Somebody get Benak some lifts..

 

[Steve Kournianos]

A more salient point is that among the four guys you listed (Crosby, Stamkos, Hughes, Bedard), only Crosby is a true center. Stamkos has played the best years of his career at wing, Hughes played mostly wing last season, and Bedard is already getting questions about if he should move to wing because he's quite poor defensively in addition to being small.

I actually like Hagens' chances to stick at center more than Stamkos/Hughes/Bedard because he's much more committed defensively than any of those guys, but I absolutely think it's a fair question to ask. There are almost zero 5'10" centers in the league. It's like, Crosby, Point, end of list.

Whether he plays wing or center shouldn’t matter. Chances are the team drafting him this year will already have at least two blue-chip center prospects anyway, so who cares if he’s a perennial 80-point winger at 23 or 24.

The implication that his size should be concern for teams drafting him is ludicrous.

Hagens’ pre-combine listing is 5’11, 176. He’s going to add muscle by June and he plays a tough, inside game.

Draft-year ht/wt:

Barzal 5’11 (post)
Aho 5’11 (post)
Suzuki 5’11 (post)
Thomas 5’11 (post)

 

[Juxtaposer]

Shouldn’t we be referring to Hagens as 5’11 now? For the record, I agree with your short centers point, although I would say it’s below 5’10, not 5’10, that is the turning point.

If he's truly 5'11", then sure. But as you know I've watched a lot of Hagens and unless he's grown since the U18 (which is definitely possible) then I don't quite believe 5'11".

Whether he plays wing or center shouldn’t matter. Chances are the team drafting him this year will already have at least two blue-chip center prospects anyway, so who cares if he’s a perennial 80-point winger at 23 or 24.

The implication that his size should be concern for teams drafting him is ludicrous.

Hagens’ pre-combine listing is 5’11, 176. He’s going to add muscle by June and he plays a tough, inside game.

Draft-year ht/wt:

Barzal 5’11 (post)
Aho 5’11 (post)
Suzuki 5’11 (post)
Thomas 5’11 (post)

As a fan of one of those teams who has two blue chip center prospects, I personally don't care if Hagens ends up a winger or center if my team ends up with 1st overall and Hagens is still the clear-cut BPA at the end of the year, but what about, say, the Flames? If I were a Flames fan, I would be very invested in whether Hagens will end up a center or winger. And while Hagens is definitely big enough that I have no concerns that he'll play, it'll definitely be a talking point.

 

[Dominance]

As a fan of one of those teams who has two blue chip center prospects, I personally don't care if Hagens ends up a winger or center if my team ends up with 1st overall and Hagens is still the clear-cut BPA at the end of the year, but what about, say, the Flames? If I were a Flames fan, I would be very invested in whether Hagens will end up a center or winger. And while Hagens is definitely big enough that I have no concerns that he'll play, it'll definitely be a talking point.

To your point - this will especially be the case if his closest competition come June has an enormous size advantage and comparable skating. Obviously McQueen will not be scoring 4 goals a game all season, but if he puts up 1.5-1.75+ P/GP and shows well internationally, that 6’5” 195 foundation could put him over the top for some teams.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

If he's truly 5'11", then sure. But as you know I've watched a lot of Hagens and unless he's grown since the U18 (which is definitely possible) then I don't quite believe 5'11".

This isn’t some random website listing. NHL Central Scouting reportedly measured him and probably weighed him too. It’s been four months since the U18’s (1/3 of a year). Not at all unreasonable he’s grown since then.

And look, we might be talking about 1/2 an inch or 3/4 of an inch that takes it from 5’10 to 5’11. He was 5’10 for essentially like a year or more in the NTDP listings. Hard to believe he didn’t grow at all in that long span of time, if he wasn’t done growing. Might’ve been that he went from like 5’9.5 to 5’10.25 in that span. And maybe now the new jump is from 5’10.25 to the now listed at 5’10.75 (5’11) rounded up. Sometimes these height listings are on the margins of both extremes, and the change from one height to the next is not a full inch.

I don’t know. It seems believable to me anyone could grow that type of amount in four months, or even like a month.

 

[landy92mack29]

With how good Jackson Smith looked game 1 I expect him to push for a top 10 pick

 

[JackSlater]

A more salient point is that among the four guys you listed (Crosby, Stamkos, Hughes, Bedard), only Crosby is a true center. Stamkos has played the best years of his career at wing, Hughes played mostly wing last season, and Bedard is already getting questions about if he should move to wing because he's quite poor defensively in addition to being small.

I actually like Hagens' chances to stick at center more than Stamkos/Hughes/Bedard because he's much more committed defensively than any of those guys, but I absolutely think it's a fair question to ask. There are almost zero 5'10" centers in the league. It's like, Crosby, Point, end of list.

This isn't pertinent to the thread but this very topic (ignoring height) has interested me for a while. Slowly in Canada it became decided that big time prospects growing up would play at centre, even if they play more in the manner that a winger traditionally would. MacKinnon would be another who fits in that mold, McDavid too in many ways. Going back many decades you go from a situation where wingers were equal to or in some cases beyond centres as stars/talents/prospects and it becomes increasingly rare until the country produces relatively few star wingers, and those who are star wingers are often late bloomers and many times are still tried at centre.

Anyway, I'll see myself out. Looks like Hagens will go first.

 

[ORRFForever]

To your point - this will especially be the case if his closest competition come June has an enormous size advantage and comparable skating. Obviously McQueen will not be scoring 4 goals a game all season, but if he puts up 1.5-1.75+ P/GP and shows well internationally, that 6’5” 195 foundation could put him over the top for some teams.

Posters want to see a kid from their country go first (I'm guilty of it, too) and they'll fight to the death to prove he belongs at 1.

 

[Nabrules]

Interestingly enough, though I guess expected, none of the 3 upper talented, small guys got much of a mention. (Schmidt, Benák, Mooney)

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Interestingly enough, though I guess expected, none of the 3 upper talented, small guys got much of a mention. (Schmidt, Benák, Mooney)

NHL teams have proven that they don’t like players like this that much. It is what it is. The USHL player of the year last year only went round 7. I don’t see any of those guys being earlier than round 2, and it might not be easy for them to get picked round 2 either.

 

[Finster8]

Misa should break out this year with an increased role due to the departures. Last season he had 11 goals on the PP with the extra quality TOI this season that will have to change. Having Willis, Parekh, Mangone, Epperson to start and Chernyshov ready for the new year. Misa will light it up this season. He played banged up in the MC and showed his maturity with a solid two way game at 17. 100 pt + this year will help rise his stock for the draft.

 

[ORRFForever]

Misa should break out this year with an increased role due to the departures. Last season he had 11 goals on the PP with the extra quality TOI this season that will have to change. Having Willis, Parekh, Mangone, Epperson and Mangone to start and Chernyshov ready for the new year. Misa will light it up this season. He played banged up in the MC and showed his maturity with a solid two way game at 17. 100 pt + this year will help rise his stock for the draft.

Help him recover some of the ground he lost in the rankings.

 

[wetcoast]

With how good Jackson Smith looked game 1 I expect him to push for a top 10 pick

The fact that he wasn't in the top 20 tells us maybe how good of a draft it will be in 2025 as he is an excellent prospect who I expect to rise.

Interestingly enough, though I guess expected, none of the 3 upper talented, small guys got much of a mention. (Schmidt, Benák, Mooney)

I'm really high on Schmidt but his ceiling is probably late in the first round due to his size right now.

Speaking of size Benak isn't much bigger really at 5'7" 161 lbs (Schmidt is 5'8" 153) but he is still enjoying the success of the Hlinka and it's too early to tell how his initial USHL season will go but he remains in the hunt for a 21st round pick.

Mooney is tiny compared to these 2 guys though listed at 5'6" 146 lbs so he will have an uphill battle and most likely is drafted 3rd out of this trio.

Even with the size concerns for me it's a 50/50 bet that one of Benak/Schmidt gets drafted on the first day in the 25 draft but time will tell.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

The fact that he wasn't in the top 20 tells us maybe how good of a draft it will be in 2025 as he is an excellent prospect who I expect to rise.


I'm really high on Schmidt but his ceiling is probably late in the first round due to his size right now.

Speaking of size Benak isn't much bigger really at 5'7" 161 lbs (Schmidt is 5'8" 153) but he is still enjoying the success of the Hlinka and it's too early to tell how his initial USHL season will go but he remains in the hunt for a 21st round pick.

Mooney is tiny compared to these 2 guys though listed at 5'6" 146 lbs so he will have an uphill battle and most likely is drafted 3rd out of this trio.

Even with the size concerns for me it's a 50/50 bet that one of Benak/Schmidt gets drafted on the first day in the 25 draft but time will tell.

Little John was 5’8 157 in the NTDP preseason measurements.

 

[wetcoast]

Little John was 5’8 157 in the NTDP preseason measurements.

Well that helps his case then but all 3 will be watched for growth spurts no doubt.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Well that helps his case then but all 3 will be watched for growth spurts no doubt.

I personally don’t see any of the three being realistic first round targets (whether we like it or not) until they appear 5’9 on a reputable listing.

 

[Castle8130]

Griva twins starting out hot

 

[On The Prowl]

5’11 176 before even turning 18 isn’t really an issue for a guy who is like the most skilled player in the draft. Hughes and Bedard both measured in as smaller than that.

By the way, I lost brain cells reading this line.


Example #100 that NHL scouts are not overly impressive people. No smarter than the average poster here.

You don't need to be an academic genius to be a quality judge of somebodies hockey potential.