Management Bill Guerin

[HotDish]

I’ll take BG over Fletcher right now haha. That Risto trade was so bad

Not only that but he paid someone to take a cheaper and slightly better Risto.

 

[MNRube]

Nobody looks worse than Fletcher right now. The Ghost/Risto deals were awful and the Parise/Suter buyouts are largely a result of his tenure as well. It makes sense that he is all in, because he might need a Cup to turn around his reputation.

 

[thestonedkoala]

Looks like Reinhart is signing his contract with Florida soon and says it shouldn't be a problem.

Yet another swing and a miss from Guerin.

Centers:
Nolan Patrick (not high on him myself)
Cody Glass
Jason Dickinson
Paul Stastny
Max Domi (don't know if he's a center)
Vincent Trocheck
Lias Andersson (not high on him myself)
Jack Roslovic
Pierre-Luc Dubois
Henrik Borgstrom
Jeff Carter (not a long term option)
Adam Gaudette
Sam Bennett
Mattias Janmark
Sam Reinhart

Those were all that were traded

 

[Webster]

Kaprizov-Rossi-Zuccarello

This is Guerin's plan, so he doesn't have to sign any expensive centers. He just needs to get Kap locked up.

 

[DANOZ28]

can nick foligno play center? as for guerin we are all entitled to our own opinions even if other posters don't agree.

 

[TaLoN]

can nick foligno play center? as for guerin we are all entitled to our own opinions even if other posters don't agree.

We're in trouble if he's playing center... his days there are beyond done.

 

[DANOZ28]

i heard a rumor on youtube we may target him but i really dont see a lw slot open.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

i heard a rumor on youtube we may target him but i really dont see a lw slot open.

4th line is open, at the moment.

 

[DANOZ28]

i would think hes too expensive for the 4th line plus where does bjugstad fit?

 

[BuiumSaveUs]

Kaprizov-Rossi-Zuccarello

This is Guerin's plan, so he doesn't have to sign any expensive centers. He just needs to get Kap locked up.

5’9 and under

 

[Ban Hammered]

Looks like Reinhart is signing his contract with Florida soon and says it shouldn't be a problem.

Yet another swing and a miss from Guerin.

Centers:
Nolan Patrick (not high on him myself)
Cody Glass
Jason Dickinson
Paul Stastny
Max Domi (don't know if he's a center)
Vincent Trocheck
Lias Andersson (not high on him myself)
Jack Roslovic
Pierre-Luc Dubois
Henrik Borgstrom
Jeff Carter (not a long term option)
Adam Gaudette
Sam Bennett
Mattias Janmark
Sam Reinhart

Those were all that were traded

K...now make the trades for the Wild...using a dollar in dollar out philosophy that Guerin is now saying is needed because of the dead cap from the buyouts. Yes some of these were made before then but if he was planning on the buyouts for 6 months...it absolutely makes sense that we couldn't give up futures and make any deals.
You keep complaining he isn't doing anything without realizing why that's happening. Self made constraints or not...there are reasons deals aren't being made and they go beyond the "Guerin sucks" trope some of you seem to have.

 

[thestonedkoala]

K...now make the trades for the Wild...using a dollar in dollar out philosophy that Guerin is now saying is needed because of the dead cap from the buyouts. Yes some of these were made before then but if he was planning on the buyouts for 6 months...it absolutely makes sense that we couldn't give up futures and make any deals.
You keep complaining he isn't doing anything without realizing why that's happening. Self made constraints or not...there are reasons deals aren't being made and they go beyond the "Guerin sucks" trope some of you seem to have.

1) His buyout of Suter was unnecessary.
2) He's the one constraining himself; not anyone else. For some reason he didn't want Bennett, didn't even sniff at what it might cost for Reinhart, doesn't want Monahan and honestly believes that Rask is a top line center and Johansson could replace Staal.
3) He signed Spurgeon to that ridiculous contract and then followed up with Brodin, Eriksson-Ek, and Foligno. Not to mention the rumors of signing the other Foligno for a ridiculous amount of money.
4) Guerin just doesn't seem to have a plan more than a week in advance.

 

[Ban Hammered]

1) His buyout of Suter was unnecessary.
2) He's the one constraining himself; not anyone else. For some reason he didn't want Bennett, didn't even sniff at what it might cost for Reinhart, doesn't want Monahan and honestly believes that Rask is a top line center and Johansson could replace Staal.
3) He signed Spurgeon to that ridiculous contract and then followed up with Brodin, Eriksson-Ek, and Foligno. Not to mention the rumors of signing the other Foligno for a ridiculous amount of money.
4) Guerin just doesn't seem to have a plan more than a week in advance.

Suter's buyout isn't necessary to you...you aren't the GM or the owner.
Again...make the deals you want here while also sending money out as that's what now needs to happen. It's not going to be just a futures deal to get it done.
Your opinion of the contracts...not the GM's.
You not knowing the plan doesn't mean he doesn't have one.

 

[guitarhunterdude]

Suter's buyout isn't necessary to you...you aren't the GM or the owner.
Again...make the deals you want here while also sending money out as that's what now needs to happen. It's not going to be just a futures deal to get it done.
Your opinion of the contracts...not the GM's.
You not knowing the plan doesn't mean he doesn't have one.

Not to jump in the middle of this, but:
1) appeal to authority with no actual rebuttal
2) Think I'm fine with Guerins inaction overall as he's not sent out futures for mediocre returns, and it's probably ridiculous for me to really hope he'd moved Kap and Fiala by now for substantial futures.
3) appeal to authority, no rebuttal
4) Having a plan is no guarantee it's a good one and/or is being well-executed.

 

[Ban Hammered]

Not to jump in the middle of this, but:
1) appeal to authority with no actual rebuttal
2) Think I'm fine with Guerins inaction overall as he's not sent out futures for mediocre returns, and it's probably ridiculous for me to really hope he'd moved Kap and Fiala by now for substantial futures.
3) appeal to authority, no rebuttal
4) Having a plan is no guarantee it's a good one and/or is being well-executed.

Well sorry...but to say the buyout wasn't necessary is an opinion...one that can't be backed up by fact. All I can say is everything I've read on these two says that they were problems in the locker room not good teammates and possibly complete divas. I've not read one thing saying that they'd be missed in the locker room or missed as teammates just thanking them for their contributions on the ice. That doesn't sound like two people you want to have around long term. Also if these buyouts were being discussed for 6 months this wasn't a spur of the moment action from a guy who "doesn't seem to have a plan more than a week in advance."
Again from the sounds of it we now have to make dollar for dollar trades so all these deals he's bitching about Guerin not being involved in, I want to know how he makes them. He talks about Guerin saying that Rask is a top line player... Do you honestly expect him to badmouth a player to the public or the press when it could be somebody he knows he has to move if he wants to make an upgrade at center?
"Yeah we really need to make an upgrade at center because this guy Rask sucks, so can you give me one of your better centers and take on this crap contract that I didn't sign or trade for?" No GM in the world is going to do that.
As for the contracts I personally don't give two rips how much these guys are paid, it's not my money and I'm not paying it. But I am also of the belief that for some reason Minnesota doesn't get "hometown deals" from other people... So if these guys are a little overpaid so be it, that's what it ends up having to be here, oh well.
I also never said the plan was good or bad... I said just because someone doesn't know it doesn't mean he doesn't have one. But it does seem interesting to me that it's always the same people complaining about whatever the GM does regardless of whether it's considered "good or bad."
So again I'm left to wonder if Guerin isn't damned if he does and damned if he doesn't because people are going to bitch about it no matter what he does. I get it that pretty much no GM is liked by any of the fans and that's why I really don't put a whole lot of stock into what fans think of their GM. The best GM in the world is likely refiled by his fan base so why should anyone give a crap what fans think about it? I certainly wouldn't want a GM who cared what the fan base thought of his moves his signings his trades or whatever he does. That's a bad way to run a business... Especially one where the fans think they know more than the people in charge when in all likelihood they know maybe a percentage... if that... of what actually happens.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Guerin himself has said on numerous occasions that he doesn't like/want "yes men".

Seems like questioning his moves and his plans, when you feel is warranted, is exactly what he would want.

I don't see an issue with it.

 

[MNState0fHockey]

Well sorry...but to say the buyout wasn't necessary is an opinion...one that can't be backed up by fact. All I can say is everything I've read on these two says that they were problems in the locker room not good teammates and possibly complete divas. I've not read one thing saying that they'd be missed in the locker room or missed his teammates just thanking them for their contributions on the ice. That doesn't sound like two people you want to have around long term. Also if these buyouts were being discussed for 6 months this wasn't a spur of the moment action from a guy who "doesn't seem to have a plan more than a week in advance."
Again from the sounds of it we now have to make dollar for dollar trades so all these deals he's bitching about Guerin not being involved in, I want to know how he makes them. He talks about Guerin saying that Rask is a top line player... Do you honestly expect him to badmouth a player to the public the press when it could be somebody he knows he has to move if he wants to make an upgrade at center?
"Yeah we really need to make an upgrade at center because this guy Rask sucks so can you give me one of your better centers and take on this crap contract that I didn't sign or trade for?" No GM in the world is going to do that.
As for the contracts I personally don't give two rips how much these guys are paid it's not my money and I'm not paying it. But I am also of the belief that for some reason Minnesota doesn't get "hometown deals" from other people... So if these guys are a little overpaid so be it, that's what it ends up having to be here, oh well.
I also never said the plan was good or bad I said just because someone doesn't know it doesn't mean he doesn't have one. But it does seem interesting to me that it's always the same people complaining about whatever the GM does regardless of whether it's considered "good or bad."
So again I'm left to wonder if Guerin isn't damned if he does and damned if he doesn't because people are going to bitch about it no matter what he does. I get it that pretty much no GM is liked by any of the fans and that's why I really don't put a whole lot of stock into what fans think of their GM. The best GM in the world is likely refiled by his fan base so why should anyone give a crap what fans think about it? I certainly wouldn't want a GM who cared what the fan base thought of his moves his signings his trades or whatever he does. That's a bad way to run a business... Especially one where the fans think they know more than the people in charge when in all likelihood they know maybe a percentage... if that... of what actually happens.

Except Bill Guerin himself has said multiple times that the buyouts had nothing to do with the locker room.

 

[Ban Hammered]

Except Bill Guerin himself has said multiple times that the buyouts had nothing to do with the locker room.

He's also said it was completely about a clean slate for the club and the players. That can't be just about production on the ice.

 

[MNState0fHockey]

He's also said it was completely about a clean slate for the club and the players. That can't be just about production on the ice.

If you take him at his word, and the word “evidence” was used in this discussion, then it wasn’t about the room. He was as unequivocal as you can be about that. Multiple times.

 

[Ban Hammered]

If you take him at his word, and the word “evidence” was used in this discussion, then it wasn’t about the room. He was as unequivocal as you can be about that. Multiple times.

And I could be wrong. I'm not on the staff or in the room. I'm also looking at what has been written and the reactions of those not on the team. Not saying Guerin is lying..but I also don't think we are ever going to get the full story either.
It's the same thing with talking up the roster...he's not going to say guys on the team suck if they are guys he wants to move to upgrade his roster. He's also not going to bad mouth guys on their way out the door even if they were the biggest assholes on the planet. That's not his job.

 

[Ban Hammered]

Guerin himself has said on numerous occasions that he doesn't like/want "yes men".

Seems like questioning his moves and his plans, when you feel is warranted, is exactly what he would want.

I don't see an issue with it.

Staff and fans are completely different..you can want discussion and moves questioned and also not give a fig what the fan base thinks about those moves.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Staff and fans are completely different..you can want discussion and moves questioned and also not give a fig what the fan base thinks about those moves.

Even so, it seems like he welcomes questions and constructive dissent, wherever it might come from.

Seems good enough to me to not just be a head bobber.

 

[Bazeek]

Staff and fans are completely different..you can want discussion and moves questioned and also not give a fig what the fan base thinks about those moves.

I'll go out on a limb and say that no one here cares about what Guerin thinks about what they think about what Guerin does any more than Guerin cares about what they think about what Guerin does. It is entirely orthogonal to any discussion that happens here.

 

[MNState0fHockey]

And I could be wrong. I'm not on the staff or in the room. I'm also looking at what has been written and the reactions of those not on the team. Not saying Guerin is lying..but I also don't think we are ever going to get the full story either.
It's the same thing with talking up the roster...he's not going to say guys on the team suck if they are guys he wants to move to upgrade his roster. He's also not going to bad mouth guys on their way out the door even if they were the biggest assholes on the planet. That's not his job.

I don’t think we’ll ever know the whole story. However, you can’t say others have no evidence to support their opinions while basing yours on a contradiction directly from the GM.

I think there is room for both sides to be right on this. The buyouts can be a good thing in some respects and a bad thing in others at the same time. At the end of the day, the contract situation meant no good choices.

 

[Ban Hammered]

I'll go out on a limb and say that no one here cares about what Guerin thinks about what they think about what Guerin does any more than Guerin cares about what they think about what Guerin does. It is entirely orthogonal to any discussion that happens here.

I'd disagree with that as I'm certain there are fans here who not only want Guerin to know what they think but are absolutely sure they could do a better job.... laughable as that may be.