That's the thing.
SJS choked. I feel like Carolina has generally gone as far as they're capable of going.
Biggest Chokers Showdown: Toronto Maple Leafs VS San Jose Sharks
- Thread starter Danarqhy
- Start date
SJS choked. I feel like Carolina has generally gone as far as they're capable of going.
Dr John Carlson
Registered User
God bless 2018 for ensuring us Capitals fans never have to deal with Choke Wars threads like these.
God bless 2018 for ensuring we don't have to deal with dimwits claiming OV isn't one of the greats because he never won a Cup.
Hockeyville USA
Registered User
2021 Hurricanes were damn good, maybe not as good as the Lightning, but they were right on par. Stymied.
2022 Hurricanes were much better than the Rangers and choked.
2023 Hurricanes were better than that iteration of the Panthers and massively underachieved, maybe not an outright choke.
But yes, they don't score enough against other great teams so they might not be able to get further. At least Carolina wins more series than Toronto lmfao.
Gil Gunderson
Registered User
That Cup final was after their scheduled “contention window”.
I kind of seperate that 2016-2019 Sharks era with the 2006-2013 one. The make up of the teams was very different.
The undisputed champions are now the Leafs without a doubt.
The Leafs are much worse than the Sharks at this point, despite the Sharks having the blowing a 3-0 series lead stain, and despite the fact that the logo is made for choking
Hockeyville USA
Registered User
The Sharks had more dawg in them when it was officially Couture's team and not Thornton or Marleau's team. Couture was an absolute beast in the playoffs, same goes for Pavelski, sad neither got a Cup.
tiburon12
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- Jul 18, 2009
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You're half right. It was Pavelski's team from 2016-2019, even though Couture was the biggest playoff performer. The team went off the rails when it became Couture's team (not blaming him, just denoting time).
Roasted Nuts
Registered User
Celebrini sitting in Joe Thornton's home and browsing this thread...
Celebrini: Hey Joe, they're polling which team choked more, yours or the Leafs.
Thornton: ...
Celebrini: Hey Joe, they're polling which team choked more, yours or the Leafs.
Thornton: ...
Its the Leafs AINEC.
I have always viewed Thornton as a playoff choker, but yeah.. Maybe he was not Claude Lemieux but still.
During his era the Sharks had
14 won playoff series in 14 playoff years, and they missed playoff once
1 Stanley Cup final, 3 losses in the Conference Finals, only 3 seasons lost in first round.
Matthews in his 9 years.
2 won playoff series in 9 years.
I have always viewed Thornton as a playoff choker, but yeah.. Maybe he was not Claude Lemieux but still.
During his era the Sharks had
14 won playoff series in 14 playoff years, and they missed playoff once
1 Stanley Cup final, 3 losses in the Conference Finals, only 3 seasons lost in first round.
Matthews in his 9 years.
2 won playoff series in 9 years.
Hockeyville USA
Registered User
Just didn't seem like Thornton and Marleau scored the clutch goals/made the big plays in a lot of series when they needed it. Sure, it did happen occasionally, but they didn't have the Pavelski & Couture esque moments that a lot of us remember.
lawrence
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- May 19, 2012
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lucky bastards got that out of the way for good. Well done. Kucherov too. have he not won any cups he be the biggest con artist of all time yum sayin.
Again, Me First Matthews and Big Money Mitch deflecting blame to the “passengers”. It’s pathetic. They want all the responsibility when they are signing their monster contracts but when it goes sideways the enter the Matrix and start dodging bullets and let them hit the guys who make 1/3 their salary.
I guess Big Money Mitch takes the bullet on his way out, as is the Maple Leaf tradition. But funny for all the guys who left the team and took the blame nothing changes. Maybe it wasn’t the guys who left, maybe the problem is with the guys still there.
At what point will the 2nd highest paid player in the league be held responsible for his team? He is the highest paid player, he is the Captain, this is Me First Matthews team.
I guess Big Money Mitch takes the bullet on his way out, as is the Maple Leaf tradition. But funny for all the guys who left the team and took the blame nothing changes. Maybe it wasn’t the guys who left, maybe the problem is with the guys still there.
At what point will the 2nd highest paid player in the league be held responsible for his team? He is the highest paid player, he is the Captain, this is Me First Matthews team.
Grinner
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- May 31, 2022
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trentmccleary
Registered User
They have seven 100+ point (or equivalent seasons in the past eight years and only have two postseason series wins to show for it.
Has there ever been another team with this many 100+ point seasons (or equivalent) and so few playoff series wins than this current edition of the Leafs?
Has there ever been another team with this many 100+ point seasons (or equivalent) and so few playoff series wins than this current edition of the Leafs?
A lot is written about Joe Thornton and his failure in San Jose,
But here's the honest truth to guys who remembered Thornton's career in Boston.
Joe Thornton was a superstar 100 point player for the Boston Bruins, who notoriously choked each post-season.
Before the 04-05 lockout Joe Thornton had 2 horrendous playoff series against the Habs.
The second time he was skunked with 0 points in a 7 game series against the extreme underdog the HABS.
ZERO.
No points. That was the birth of the "No-Show-Joe" moniker. He just did not play the style of game that could win in the playoffs, nor could he elevate his play.
That's what lead to his trade amidst an Art-Ross Season for a literal bag of pucks:, widely considered one of the most lopsided trade in NHL history.
The Bruins rejigged themselves as a gritty- physical defense-first team that eventually won a Stanley Cup. And Joe Thornton remained a cupless player who disappeared in the playoffs.
Fast forward to 2025. And these same questions are being asked about Auston Matthews and Mitch Marner.
It's uncanny how similar the rhetoric is with these 2 as it was with Thornton.
They're not built for the playoffs.
But here's the honest truth to guys who remembered Thornton's career in Boston.
Joe Thornton was a superstar 100 point player for the Boston Bruins, who notoriously choked each post-season.
Before the 04-05 lockout Joe Thornton had 2 horrendous playoff series against the Habs.
The second time he was skunked with 0 points in a 7 game series against the extreme underdog the HABS.
ZERO.
No points. That was the birth of the "No-Show-Joe" moniker. He just did not play the style of game that could win in the playoffs, nor could he elevate his play.
That's what lead to his trade amidst an Art-Ross Season for a literal bag of pucks:, widely considered one of the most lopsided trade in NHL history.
The Bruins rejigged themselves as a gritty- physical defense-first team that eventually won a Stanley Cup. And Joe Thornton remained a cupless player who disappeared in the playoffs.
Fast forward to 2025. And these same questions are being asked about Auston Matthews and Mitch Marner.
It's uncanny how similar the rhetoric is with these 2 as it was with Thornton.
They're not built for the playoffs.
tiburon12
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Perhaps you're a young fan but they absolutely had clutch moments in lat 00s and early 10s.
Hockeyville USA
Registered User
tiburon12
Registered User
- Jul 18, 2009
- 4,752
- 5,871
so you DO remember them. Makes your statement a bit more puzzling then.
We've established in this thread that the Sharks huge playoff run had two distinct "eras", 06-14 and 16-19. For the most part, Thornton and Marleau had the clutch moments in the first "era", Pavs and Couture in the second "era". And yes, despite those early years being marred by chocking, those two did have big moments.
Fans remember both equally
Hockeyville USA
Registered User
There are no clutch Conference Final moments from the 2006-2014 true contention window era, no Final appearances. Most believe the 2016-2019 contention window was after their true contention window. Pavelski and Couture consistently elevated their games in the playoffs, I don't believe Thornton and Marleau did that to where expectations were.
ManofSteel55
Registered User
First, I don't think its fair to label the Sharks as chokers. They were a legitimate threat every year - the fact they didn't quite get the cup shouldn't give them a label like "choker". It's really hard to win the cup. Not every contending team will get there. They came up short, but to label them as "chokers" is wrong.
The Leafs? As others have said in this discussion, their story isn't over yet. I enjoy watching the Leafs lose, but I don't anticipate that this core from the Leafs is done contending yet, unless they decide to move in a different direction or something.
The Leafs? As others have said in this discussion, their story isn't over yet. I enjoy watching the Leafs lose, but I don't anticipate that this core from the Leafs is done contending yet, unless they decide to move in a different direction or something.
