Better Prime: Evgeni Malkin Or Leon Draisaitl?

[KareemTrustfund]

Had Malkin played in this era in his prime he would have cleared 140 points numerous times. The goalie gear shrank in 2017/18 and the amount of ppg players quadrupled. Players who never even sniffed higher than ppg were hitting 100 points. History won’t be kind to the Malkin/Crosby era of superstars in comparing them to todays stars.

What Malkin did in 11/12 was vastly superior to Drai in 19/20. There are more 100 point players now than ppg players then. Malkin cleared the field. Maybe if Drai had a Kucherov type season it would have been closer. But 128 now doesn’t touch Malkin’s best seasons in my opinion.

Jake Guentzel was on pace to obliterate Malkin’s 36 in the playoffs in the 2018 playoffs. Nobody talks about him being a playoff god. Scoring is different now. It’s easier, much easier.

Geno’s prime a lot longer than people give it credit for as well. Here’s some points per 60 finishes from Geno in years people don’t even consider his prime but he’s every bit as good in 13/14, 15/16, 16/17 , 17/18 and 19/20 (with numerous first places finishes) as his Art Ross years in 09 and 12. The guy is just severely underrated.

Oh and fun fact. Malkin had a HIGHER pp/60 in 2019/20 (Drais only Art Ross year) than Drai did. (He was 4th). Was Geno better in his Drais only Art Ross year!? Probably not but it’s still interesting to see how Malkin was still at Drais level as an old man.

19/20 3rd

17/18 1st

16/17 1st

15/16 6th

13/14 1st

07/08 2nd

 

[BertMcDrai]

Had Malkin played in this era in his prime he would have cleared 140 points numerous times. The goalie gear shrank in 2017/18 and the amount of ppg players quadrupled. Players who never even sniffed higher than ppg were hitting 100 points. History won’t be kind to the Malkin/Crosby era of superstars in comparing them to todays stars.

What Malkin did in 11/12 was vastly superior to Drai in 19/20. There are more 100 point players now than ppg players then. Malkin cleared the field. Maybe if Drai had a Kucherov type season it would have been closer. But 128 now doesn’t touch Malkin’s best seasons in my opinion.

Jake Guentzel was on pace to obliterate Malkin’s 36 in the playoffs in the 2018 playoffs. Nobody talks about him being a playoff god. Scoring is different now. It’s easier, much easier.

Geno’s prime a lot longer than people give it credit for as well. Here’s some points per 60 finishes from Geno in years people don’t even consider his prime but he’s every bit as good in 13/14, 15/16, 16/17 , 17/18 and 19/20 (with numerous first places finishes) as his Art Ross years in 09 and 12. The guy is just severely underrated.

Oh and fun fact. Malkin had a HIGHER pp/60 in 2019/20 (Drais only Art Ross year) than Drai did. (He was 4th). Was Geno better in his Drais only Art Ross year!? Probably not but it’s still interesting to see how Malkin was still at Drais level as an old man.

19/20 3rd

17/18 1st

16/17 1st

15/16 6th

13/14 1st

07/08 2nd

I don't know where your stats are from...in PPG in 16/17 and 17/18 he was 3rd and in total also not 1st...don't know what these stat should be?!

Please clarify, thanks.

 

[Regal]

I don't know where your stats are from...in PPG in 16/17 and 17/18 he was 3rd and in total also not 1st...don't know what these stat should be?!

Please clarify, thanks.

I believe it’s points per 60. But it looks like it’s also all situations points per 60, which is pretty messy.

 

[BertMcDrai]

I believe it’s points per 60. But it looks like it’s also all situations points per 60, which is pretty messy.

Ok...what a weird stat...I prefer actual production...would love to see how they are when OZ or DZ starts are into account.

Remembers me of the days when Matthews was pumped up by some people with his takeaways per 60 to bring him up on McD level.

 

[KareemTrustfund]

I don't know where your stats are from...in PPG in 16/17 and 17/18 he was 3rd and in total also not 1st...don't know what these stat should be?!

Please clarify, thanks.

Points per 60 is different than ppg. It more accurately shows how many points they get relative to ice time vs just games. Although PKing can skew it, neither Drai or Malkin do that enough to my knowledge.

Malkin generally sees less ice time than Crosby or other first line players , so I used that

 

[BertMcDrai]

Points per 60 is different than ppg. It more accurately shows how many points they get relative to ice time vs just games.

I get this stat...but to me it's one of those cherry picking stat...I am not saying it's pointless, it isn't but I like actual production and not some fantasy stat...ice time and production increases not similar when ice time increases...if it would, every star player would play the full 60.

 

[Duke74]

How many of those seasons did Draisaitl achieve those totals without being glued to McDavid's hip the majority of his time?

I feel like this ignores context to just look at raw numbers. In his prime Malkin was putting up 100 points with guys like Fedotenko, Sykora, and Malone on his wing, while Draisaitl's racking up his 100 point seasons largely playing next to McDavid (go look up how much his production drops with and without McDavid).

I mean, Malkin literally ripped the league apart when Crosby missed 60 games. I'd like to see Draisaitl run away with the scoring title if McDavid misses 60 games.

Over the years, Draisaitl has spent increasingly smaller amounts of time with McDavid at 5x5. And the time that he does spend with McDavid is balanced out by playing with fourth-liners/AHL tier-players when he runs his own line. McDavid gets the lion's share of the wingers and Draisaitl gets stuck with dregs that no other elite center is forced to carry: Ryan McLeod, Kailer Yamamoto, Jesse Puljujarvi, Tie Ratty, Warren Fogele, Jujhar Khaira, Toby Rieder, Alex Chiasson, Dominic Kahun, etc.

 

[KareemTrustfund]

I get this stat...but to me it's one of those cherry picking stat...I am not saying it's pointless, it isn't but I like actual production and not some fantasy stat...ice time and production increases not similar when ice time increases...if it would, every star player would play the full 60.

Disagree. More ice time more production. Malkin is actually the perfect example of this as everytime Crosby was hurt his production and ice time went up.

 

[BertMcDrai]

Over the years, Draisaitl has spent increasingly smaller amounts of time with McDavid at 5x5. And the time that he does spend with McDavid is balanced out by playing with fourth-liners/AHL tier-players when he runs his own line. McDavid gets the lion's share of the wingers and Draisaitl gets stuck with dregs that no other elite center is forced to carry: Ryan McLeod, Kailer Yamamoto, Jesse Puljujarvi, Tie Ratty, Warren Fogele, Jujhar Khaira, Toby Rieder, Alex Chiasson, Dominic Kahun, etc.

70% of those wingers are not in the NHL anymore, cause they are not good.

It's hard to compare Malkin and Drai when you have to take everything into account...one thing is clear they are both special.

And the argument that he had no good wingers when Crosby didn't even play is also not completely true.

I am sure if Drai would play for the Bruins or Leafs with good players around him he would score as good if not better.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Over the years, Draisaitl has spent increasingly smaller amounts of time with McDavid at 5x5. And the time that he does spend with McDavid is balanced out by playing with fourth-liners/AHL tier-players when he runs his own line. McDavid gets the lion's share of the wingers and Draisaitl gets stuck with dregs that no other elite center is forced to carry: Ryan McLeod, Kailer Yamamoto, Jesse Puljujarvi, Tie Ratty, Warren Fogele, Jujhar Khaira, Toby Rieder, Alex Chiasson, Dominic Kahun, etc.

Over the past 3 seasons, McDavid has been on the ice for 230 of Draisaitl's 334 total points. That's around 69% of Draisaitl's offense comes when he plays with McDavid.

During Malkin's stretch from 2007/2008 to 2009/2010, when he was scoring 100+ points, Crosby had been on the ice for 157 of Malkin's 296 total points. That's around 53% of his offense with Crosby on the ice. If you include Malkin's 2011/12 Art Ross winning season, where Crosby missed 60 games, those totals bump up to 174 points out of 405 total points, for roughly 43% of his offense during that 4-year stretch with Crosby on the ice.

As far as linemates at 5on5 without McDavid, Draisaitl's most common linemates (not including McDavid) over that 3 year time period are Hyman, Yamamoto, E. Kane and RNH. The only bottom sixer that comes close to those 4 is Foegele. Every other player you mentioned got minimal minutes with Draisaitl.

For comparison's sake, Malkin's most common linemates (not including Crosby) over the stretch I listed above are Sykora, Fedotenko, Malone and Dupuis for the 2007-2010 stretch, and then Kunitz, Neal, S. Sullivan and Dupuis during the 2011-12 season.

So essentially it's Hyman, Kane, RNH, Yamamoto and Foegele versus Neal, Kunitz, Fedotenko, Sykora, Malone and Dupuis. And during that time Malkin scored 57% of his points away from Crosby while Draisaitl has only scored 31% of his points away from McDavid.

Oilers fans can "laugh emoji" at my post all they want. But the actual numbers speak for themselves. Draisaitl hasn't proven he can score at this rate without McDavid, while Malkin has shown he can score at his same rate away from Crosby. Just look at the actual numbers because I know people like to just look at the avatar and think this is based on opinion.

 

[GoldenKnight]

Over the past 3 seasons, McDavid has been on the ice for 230 of Draisaitl's 334 total points. That's around 69% of Draisaitl's offense comes when he plays with McDavid.

During Malkin's stretch from 2007/2008 to 2009/2010, when he was scoring 100+ points, Crosby had been on the ice for 157 of Malkin's 296 total points. That's around 53% of his offense with Crosby on the ice. If you include Malkin's 2011/12 Art Ross winning season, where Crosby missed 60 games, those totals bump up to 174 points out of 405 total points, for roughly 43% of his offense during that 4-year stretch with Crosby on the ice.

As far as linemates at 5on5 without McDavid, Draisaitl's most common linemates (not including McDavid) over that 3 year time period are Hyman, Yamamoto, E. Kane and RNH. The only bottom sixer that comes close to those 4 is Foegele. Every other player you mentioned got minimal minutes with Draisaitl.

For comparison's sake, Malkin's most common linemates (not including Crosby) over the stretch I listed above are Sykora, Fedotenko, Malone and Dupuis for the 2007-2010 stretch, and then Kunitz, Neal, S. Sullivan and Dupuis during the 2011-12 season.

So essentially it's Hyman, Kane, RNH, Yamamoto and Foegele versus Neal, Kunitz, Fedotenko, Sykora, Malone and Dupuis. And during that time Malkin scored 57% of his points away from Crosby while Draisaitl has only scored 31% of his points away from McDavid.

Oilers fans can "laugh emoji" at my post all they want. But the actual numbers speak for themselves. Draisaitl hasn't proven he can score at this rate without McDavid, while Malkin has shown he can score at his same rate away from Crosby. Just look at the actual numbers because I know people like to just look at the avatar and think this is based on opinion.

Good post.

The main difference to me is that Malkin and Crosby rarely played at ES together throughout their careers (until last week at age 38, heh). The only other times I remember it is if they were trailing in the third period and Pittsburgh was getting ready to pull their goalie.

McDavid and Draisaitl have spent several season's worth of hockey in their primes on the same line at ES. That to me is a critical difference, and one that your underlying numbers appear to support.

 

[BertMcDrai]

Over the past 3 seasons, McDavid has been on the ice for 230 of Draisaitl's 334 total points. That's around 69% of Draisaitl's offense comes when he plays with McDavid.

During Malkin's stretch from 2007/2008 to 2009/2010, when he was scoring 100+ points, Crosby had been on the ice for 157 of Malkin's 296 total points. That's around 53% of his offense with Crosby on the ice. If you include Malkin's 2011/12 Art Ross winning season, where Crosby missed 60 games, those totals bump up to 174 points out of 405 total points, for roughly 43% of his offense during that 4-year stretch with Crosby on the ice.

As far as linemates at 5on5 without McDavid, Draisaitl's most common linemates (not including McDavid) over that 3 year time period are Hyman, Yamamoto, E. Kane and RNH. The only bottom sixer that comes close to those 4 is Foegele. Every other player you mentioned got minimal minutes with Draisaitl.

For comparison's sake, Malkin's most common linemates (not including Crosby) over the stretch I listed above are Sykora, Fedotenko, Malone and Dupuis for the 2007-2010 stretch, and then Kunitz, Neal, S. Sullivan and Dupuis during the 2011-12 season.

So essentially it's Hyman, Kane, RNH, Yamamoto and Foegele versus Neal, Kunitz, Fedotenko, Sykora, Malone and Dupuis. And during that time Malkin scored 57% of his points away from Crosby while Draisaitl has only scored 31% of his points away from McDavid.

Oilers fans can "laugh emoji" at my post all they want. But the actual numbers speak for themselves. Draisaitl hasn't proven he can score at this rate without McDavid, while Malkin has shown he can score at his same rate away from Crosby. Just look at the actual numbers because I know people like to just look at the avatar and think this is based on opinion.

Everything you said can be true, but you are ignoring one fact...it's not Drais fault that McD hasn't missed 60 games in a season...so your point is pointless.
As he has given no chance yet (luckily for McD and a little unfortunate for him to show what he can do alone) over such a span.

Now look at the last 8 games where McD was injured...that means it's the equivalent of your comparison while a much smaller sample size...8 games 16 points (please correct me, but it's somewhere around 2.0ppg).
I know that this absurd production will not hold but I can't see it dropping under 1.5-1.3...which is giving him at least equal or better production with McD out of the lineup.(Also in comp to Malkin)
Sample size is around the last 5 years including his MVP season.

Please note, I do like Malkin and I see him pretty similar in some aspects as Drai.

 

[Pass the Saitl Sauce]

More ice time doesn’t always mean more production, it could cause the player to be more exhausted thus getting less out of those minutes. Sure they might get more icetime and production when Crosby/Mcdavid are hurt but they then also play with superior line mates in that situation

 

[BertMcDrai]

Points per 60 is different than ppg. It more accurately shows how many points they get relative to ice time vs just games. Although PKing can skew it, neither Drai or Malkin do that enough to my knowledge.

Malkin generally sees less ice time than Crosby or other first line players , so I used that

I know what you want to say with this stat, but this stat is losing his "argument" at a higher icetime...for example...when someone is playing 10 mins you can maybe use it for his production for 12 or max 15 mins (I am guessing here cause every player is different), but not at 17 -21 mins cause it drops significantly...as I said before otherwise star players would play more time "a la basketball".

I would love to see how Malkin is deployed when it comes to defensive situations...like defensive zone starts...cause Drai is often used in defensive situations cause he is great in the circle...maybe Malkin also, I am just asking as I don't know it.
That's one point some people are not seeing, he is very important for the Oilers in this regard which also benefits McD.

 

[Connor McConnor]

I think if McDavid missed as much time as Crosby and we got to witness Drai dominate without him more like Malkin did in his prime, this would be much closer.

 

[Cursed Lemon]

They're not the same player and I think that's getting some people f***ed up in this thread. Malkin used to play like an absolute truck, Draisaitl meanwhile is a lot more like a Joe Thornton type of player. Honestly can't say which I'd rather have.

 

[Video Nasty]

I think if McDavid missed as much time as Crosby and we got to witness Drai dominate without him more like Malkin did in his prime, this would be much closer.

This forum follows so little hockey outside of their home town—and the knowledge even there is questionable—I doubt most even realize he has 3 goals and 3 assists in two wins over the past handful of days. This insistence that we need to see one all-timer to go down for a lengthy period of time to see how the other one performs is so tiresome. Spoiler guys: I don’t think we have an example where it goes badly.

The problem with Malkin is, despite being the better player and talent, it was just so damn brief. When we think about him at the height of his powers, it wasn’t for that long, and even that time was broken up with inconsistency and injuries. The brilliance of 2007-2008, 2008-2009, and 2011-2012, containing inconsistent, injury riddled years—he wasn’t great during the first third of 2010-2011 before he missed what amounted to be half the season. Malkin is among the three greatest players of his era, but so much of it revolves around just a few seasons.

On the other hand, Draisaitl has been in the conversation for top five players for seven years running now, while actually playing the games—he’s missed just five games over the past seven years, and they’re almost all related to rest in preparation for the playoffs.

Malkin’s prime was effectively over after the age of 25. Draisaitl still seems to be in his as the calendar turned to age 29 for him just a week ago.

I’m not sure this is the slam dunk most people think it is.

 

[redwings86]

German favour 2018-2024.

 

[jigglysquishy]

Draisaitl has struggled to play late in playoffs. A lot is injuries, but a lot of it is just being outhustled.

Over the last three series the Oilers have been eliminated in.

Against Avs 2022
McDavid: 4 GP 3 G 4 A 7 P -4
Draisaitl: 4 GP 0 G 6 A 6 P -3

Against Knights 2023
McDavid: 6 GP 5 G 5 A 10 P +0
Draisaitl: 6 GP 6 G 1 A 7 P -5

Against Panthers 2024
McDavid: 7 GP 3 G 8 A 11 P +5
Draisaitl: 7 GP 0 G 3 A 3 P -2

Overall
McDavid: 17 GP 11 G 17 A 26 P +1
Draisaitl: 17 GP 6 G 10 A 16 P -10

Injuries are a part of the playoffs. I think part of it is Draisaitl plays too much. McDavid is given extra minutes and thrives. Draisaitl gets extra minutes and gets hurt.


That Malkin outplayed Crosby at critical Stanley Cup series is a big part of his legacy.

 

[Regal]

This forum follows so little hockey outside of their home town—and the knowledge even there is questionable—I doubt most even realize he has 3 goals and 3 assists in two wins over the past handful of days. This insistence that we need to see one all-timer to go down for a lengthy period of time to see how the other one performs is so tiresome. Spoiler guys: I don’t think we have an example where it goes badly.

The problem with Malkin is, despite being the better player and talent, it was just so damn brief. When we think about him at the height of his powers, it wasn’t for that long, and even that time was broken up with inconsistency and injuries. The brilliance of 2007-2008, 2008-2009, and 2011-2012, containing inconsistent, injury riddled years—he wasn’t great during the first third of 2010-2011 before he missed what amounted to be half the season. Malkin is among the three greatest players of his era, but so much of it revolves around just a few seasons.

On the other hand, Draisaitl has been in the conversation for top five players for seven years running now, while actually playing the games—he’s missed just five games over the past seven years, and they’re almost all related to rest in preparation for the playoffs.

Malkin’s prime was effectively over after the age of 25. Draisaitl still seems to be in his as the calendar turned to age 29 for him just a week ago.

I’m not sure this is the slam dunk most people think it is.

You’re significantly underrating Malkin’s prime after 25. His top 10 PPG finishes after 25 (2,7,4,3,3,6) aren’t that far off Draisaitl’s PPG finishes over the last 6 years (4,1,2,4,2,7), and he lead the playoffs in scoring at 30. Also he was way better than Draisaitl early so even if we say Draisaitl’s better after 25, he needs to be in order to be better. Draisaitl’s health is a big positive, but Malkin was still in the top tier of elite players until his early 30s, he just missed time.

 

[Duke74]

Draisaitl has struggled to play late in playoffs. A lot is injuries, but a lot of it is just being outhustled.

Over the last three series the Oilers have been eliminated in.

Against Avs 2022
McDavid: 4 GP 3 G 4 A 7 P -4
Draisaitl: 4 GP 0 G 6 A 6 P -3

Against Knights 2023
McDavid: 6 GP 5 G 5 A 10 P +0
Draisaitl: 6 GP 6 G 1 A 7 P -5

Against Panthers 2024
McDavid: 7 GP 3 G 8 A 11 P +5
Draisaitl: 7 GP 0 G 3 A 3 P -2

Overall
McDavid: 17 GP 11 G 17 A 26 P +1
Draisaitl: 17 GP 6 G 10 A 16 P -10

Injuries are a part of the playoffs. I think part of it is Draisaitl plays too much. McDavid is given extra minutes and thrives. Draisaitl gets extra minutes and gets hurt.


That Malkin outplayed Crosby at critical Stanley Cup series is a big part of his legacy.

That is a good point. I don't know if it's simply bad luck that Draisaitl has sustained major injuries in each of the last three playoff series or if exhaustion plays a role in that. Maybe Knoblauch (and other Oilers coaches) should/should have considered load management during the regular season. Regardless, I'd like to see how he performs when the Oilers go on a deep run (Conference final minimum) and he manages to remain uninjured.

 

[Duke74]

Over the past 3 seasons, McDavid has been on the ice for 230 of Draisaitl's 334 total points. That's around 69% of Draisaitl's offense comes when he plays with McDavid.

During Malkin's stretch from 2007/2008 to 2009/2010, when he was scoring 100+ points, Crosby had been on the ice for 157 of Malkin's 296 total points. That's around 53% of his offense with Crosby on the ice. If you include Malkin's 2011/12 Art Ross winning season, where Crosby missed 60 games, those totals bump up to 174 points out of 405 total points, for roughly 43% of his offense during that 4-year stretch with Crosby on the ice.

As far as linemates at 5on5 without McDavid, Draisaitl's most common linemates (not including McDavid) over that 3 year time period are Hyman, Yamamoto, E. Kane and RNH. The only bottom sixer that comes close to those 4 is Foegele. Every other player you mentioned got minimal minutes with Draisaitl.

For comparison's sake, Malkin's most common linemates (not including Crosby) over the stretch I listed above are Sykora, Fedotenko, Malone and Dupuis for the 2007-2010 stretch, and then Kunitz, Neal, S. Sullivan and Dupuis during the 2011-12 season.

So essentially it's Hyman, Kane, RNH, Yamamoto and Foegele versus Neal, Kunitz, Fedotenko, Sykora, Malone and Dupuis. And during that time Malkin scored 57% of his points away from Crosby while Draisaitl has only scored 31% of his points away from McDavid.

Oilers fans can "laugh emoji" at my post all they want. But the actual numbers speak for themselves. Draisaitl hasn't proven he can score at this rate without McDavid, while Malkin has shown he can score at his same rate away from Crosby. Just look at the actual numbers because I know people like to just look at the avatar and think this is based on opinion.

It looks like you did your research and you made some good points. However, I was going back further than three years, probably back as far as 2017-18, when listing the quality of his linemates. Moreover, Draisaitl's time with Hyman and/or Kane occurs when he's already with McDavid. I was talking about the situations in which he played entirely away from McDavid and was/is usually left with two spare parts for wingers. That being said, however, Malkin has also shown a proclivity for working with lesser linemates and stepping up in Crosby's absence. It would be interesting to see how Draisaitl performs with McDavid out for a large chunk of the season, but as an Oiler fan, I don't necessarily wish to be without McDavid for that length of time simply to test a hypothesis.

 

[Connor McConnor]

This forum follows so little hockey outside of their home town—and the knowledge even there is questionable—I doubt most even realize he has 3 goals and 3 assists in two wins over the past handful of days. This insistence that we need to see one all-timer to go down for a lengthy period of time to see how the other one performs is so tiresome. Spoiler guys: I don’t think we have an example where it goes badly.

The problem with Malkin is, despite being the better player and talent, it was just so damn brief. When we think about him at the height of his powers, it wasn’t for that long, and even that time was broken up with inconsistency and injuries. The brilliance of 2007-2008, 2008-2009, and 2011-2012, containing inconsistent, injury riddled years—he wasn’t great during the first third of 2010-2011 before he missed what amounted to be half the season. Malkin is among the three greatest players of his era, but so much of it revolves around just a few seasons.

On the other hand, Draisaitl has been in the conversation for top five players for seven years running now, while actually playing the games—he’s missed just five games over the past seven years, and they’re almost all related to rest in preparation for the playoffs.

Malkin’s prime was effectively over after the age of 25. Draisaitl still seems to be in his as the calendar turned to age 29 for him just a week ago.

I’m not sure this is the slam dunk most people think it is.

I have absolutely 0 problem with people saying Peak Malkin > Peak Drai, because as someone who watched both in the "prime" of my own hockey fandom, he was arguably more dominant than even Ovi and Sid when he was on.

I have the same quips as you though, this is a prime argument and how is a guy that was injury riddled for so much of his career considered better than a guy that is this consistent? People just have memories from Malkins dominant peak etched into their minds and come in saying "AINEC".

Again, I think this is a very close argument and by the time Drai's career is complete, especially if it's with a Cup and potential Smythe (or just maintaining anywhere near his current playoff performances) he will go down as better.

Over the past 3 seasons, McDavid has been on the ice for 230 of Draisaitl's 334 total points. That's around 69% of Draisaitl's offense comes when he plays with McDavid.

During Malkin's stretch from 2007/2008 to 2009/2010, when he was scoring 100+ points, Crosby had been on the ice for 157 of Malkin's 296 total points. That's around 53% of his offense with Crosby on the ice. If you include Malkin's 2011/12 Art Ross winning season, where Crosby missed 60 games, those totals bump up to 174 points out of 405 total points, for roughly 43% of his offense during that 4-year stretch with Crosby on the ice.

As far as linemates at 5on5 without McDavid, Draisaitl's most common linemates (not including McDavid) over that 3 year time period are Hyman, Yamamoto, E. Kane and RNH. The only bottom sixer that comes close to those 4 is Foegele. Every other player you mentioned got minimal minutes with Draisaitl.

For comparison's sake, Malkin's most common linemates (not including Crosby) over the stretch I listed above are Sykora, Fedotenko, Malone and Dupuis for the 2007-2010 stretch, and then Kunitz, Neal, S. Sullivan and Dupuis during the 2011-12 season.

So essentially it's Hyman, Kane, RNH, Yamamoto and Foegele versus Neal, Kunitz, Fedotenko, Sykora, Malone and Dupuis. And during that time Malkin scored 57% of his points away from Crosby while Draisaitl has only scored 31% of his points away from McDavid.

Oilers fans can "laugh emoji" at my post all they want. But the actual numbers speak for themselves. Draisaitl hasn't proven he can score at this rate without McDavid, while Malkin has shown he can score at his same rate away from Crosby. Just look at the actual numbers because I know people like to just look at the avatar and think this is based on opinion.

So Prime is 2-3 years now? Since when? Isn't that what Peak would be?

 

[I Hate Blake Coleman]

How many of those points did Malkin put up while on Crosby's wing

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Everything you said can be true, but you are ignoring one fact...it's not Drais fault that McD hasn't missed 60 games in a season...so your point is pointless.
As he has given no chance yet (luckily for McD and a little unfortunate for him to show what he can do alone) over such a span.

Now look at the last 8 games where McD was injured...that means it's the equivalent of your comparison while a much smaller sample size...8 games 16 points (please correct me, but it's somewhere around 2.0ppg).
I know that this absurd production will not hold but I can't see it dropping under 1.5-1.3...which is giving him at least equal or better production with McD out of the lineup.(Also in comp to Malkin)
Sample size is around the last 5 years including his MVP season.

Please note, I do like Malkin and I see him pretty similar in some aspects as Drai.

How is it pointless? The bulk of Draisaitl's offense comes when McDavid is on the ice with him. Malkin has produced even when not on the ice with Crosby. Dismissing my post entirely essentially says you're not willing to look at actual stats and just go on "feel" for how each player would do without their respective star teammates (McDavid and Crosby, respectively).

In any case, my point isn't to say Draisaitl sucks or couldn't produce without McDavid. My original point is that the person I quoted didn't use any sort of context and just showed "raw totals" to show Draisaitl is superior to Malkin. No nuance, like who they play with or the league scoring environment. Just raw points. The problem with that is it ignores, as I pointed out, how much those raw points are a product of being regular linemates with McDavid.

It's like the Jari Kurri thing. I think we can all agree that Kurri was a great player regardless of who he played with. But I also think it would be naive to ignore who Kurri played his peak with when looking at his raw totals in any sort of comparison between him and someone who didn't play with Gretzky. It would be like saying Jari Kurri is a better player than Sidney Crosby because he scored over 130 points twice in his career and Crosby never scored more than 120 points. It ignores the important context about a]who just so happened to be on their line and b]the scoring environment of the league at the time.