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Best case for Hall of Fame | Quick , Hellebuyck

Sol said:
Quick easily. Quick has won when it’s mattered most, twice. Hellebuyck has wilted every time the pressure has turned up. I’d be shocked if Hellebuyck made it into the hall of fame. I feel like there has to be something more than being a really good regular season goalie. I think his failures in the post season should disqualify him lol. However judging by the comments on here the bar for entry seems lower than I’d like. Lundqvist took the Rangers to SCF with Stepan as their center. Where has Hellebuyck taken the jets besides disappointment
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Quick's ahead currently yeah but I'm guessing you didnt watch the 2018 or 2021 playoffs?
 
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qcal1427 said:
Conn Smythe < Vezina
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Sadly they don't give Vezina's for postseason numbers or Quick would eclipse Helle. As good as Helle is, Quick eats him alive in the playoffs and it ain't even close.

Given the choice, the Jets would throw Helle and his Vezina's out the front door and win a Cup with Quick and that's NO cap. There's the difference.
 
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It's about cups and playoff success. If you play a primary role in elevating a franchise to a place they never been before and have the stats to match its a no brainer



In 2011-12 Quick had
1.97 GAA and .929 save percentage 10 shutouts.
And he had a chunk of 1-0 games where he had to hold the fort.

Playoffs
1.41 GAA and .947 save percentage

Lundquist had 1.97 and a .930 regular season
Playoffs 1.82 and .930

Rangers ranked 11th in goals scored, Kings ranked 29th

9 GMs left Quick off their ballot completely for the Vezina. Meaning they did not even vote him 3rd best in a year he finished runner up to Henrik.


Have no problem with Henrik winning it, he is a Hall of Famer. But to have 9 GMs say Quick was not top 3 that year is not even reasonable. And why some of these awards as the magical key to get in the hall should be taken with a grain of salt.

Quick has the numbers where it matters and should be first ballot. Conn Smyth that same year he finished 2nd in the Vezina tells me he just might have been the best goalie that year. Playoffs numbers + regular season spell that out. He just crushed opponents souls with his ability to make remarkable saves.

And he has made a career of doing same.
 
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GoldenSeal said:
Sadly they don't give Vezina's for postseason numbers or Quick would eclipse Helle. As good as Helle is, Quick eats him alive in the playoffs and it ain't even close. When and IF Helle can carry his team to a Cup, we can then talk about it.
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Quick has one of the all-time great playoff performances, and that is what puts him in line for the Hall.

If they gave Harts for playoff performance though Jonathan Marchessault, Ryan O'Rielly, and Justin Williams would all be winners (with guys like Phil Kessel and Evgeny Kuznetsov being should-have-wons as well).
GoldenSeal said:
Given the choice, the Jets would throw Helle and his Vezina's out the front door and win a Cup with Quick and that's NO cap. There's the difference.
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No shit they would! Cups are a team success though, and the Hall of Fame is about an individual player's career.

fsanford said:
It's about cups and playoff success. If you play a primary role in elevating a franchise to a place they never been before and have the stats to match its a no brainer
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Some goalies who played a primary role in elevating a franchise to a place they have never been before recently include Adin Hill, Jordan Binnington, and Braden Holtby
 
fsanford said:
It's about cups and playoff success. If you play a primary role in elevating a franchise to a place they never been before and have the stats to match its a no brainer



In 2011-12 Quick had
1.97 GAA and .929 save percentage 10 shutouts.
And he had a chunk of 1-0 games where he had to hold the fort.

Playoffs
1.41 GAA and .947 save percentage

Lundquist had 1.97 and a .930 regular season
Playoffs 1.82 and .930

Rangers ranked 11th in goals scored, Kings ranked 29th

9 GMs left Quick off their ballot completely for the Vezina. Meaning they did not even vote him 3rd best in a year he finished runner up to Henrik.


Have no problem with Henrik winning it, he is a Hall of Famer. But to have 9 GMs say Quick was not top 3 that year is not even reasonable. And why some of these awards as the magical key to get in the hall should be taken with a grain of salt.

Quick has the numbers where it matters and should be first ballot. Conn Smyth that same year he finished 2nd in the Vezina tells me he just might have been the best goalie that year. Playoffs numbers + regular season spell that out. He just crushed opponents souls with his ability to make remarkable saves.

And he has made a career of doing same.
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And yet people to this day sleep on Quick and claim that other netminders who can't even get their team to the Finals are as good or better.
 
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GoldenSeal said:
In Quick's case, he won the Conn Smythe and the Cup, so that Cup /is also/ a personal success without which the Kings wouldn't have won it and his stats alone on the matter make it not even up for debate.
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I 100% agree. His (relative when discussing HoFers!) lack of personal success in the regular season as evidenced by not winning a Vezina and only being a 2x finalist to me put a dent in his HoF case that is at minimum equal to the boost he gets from his playoff performance.

It is the exact same as Mike Vernon, who was pretty widely acknowledged as a weak inductee when he got in in 2023 more than 15 years after he first became eligible.
 
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Both should be locks but the hall has a weird track record on goalies.

Quick has all but proved his case and Helle has a ton of time to put up better playoff numbers (and hasnt exactly got a lot of help in the playoffs either.)
 
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fsanford said:
9 GMs left Quick off their ballot completely for the Vezina. Meaning they did not even vote him 3rd best in a year he finished runner up to Henrik.


Have no problem with Henrik winning it, he is a Hall of Famer. But to have 9 GMs say Quick was not top 3 that year is not even reasonable. And why some of these awards as the magical key to get in the hall should be taken with a grain of salt.
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Amen.

And people here constantly come up with a resume of trophy’s. You can win no major trophy and still be elite due to someone being marginal better that particular season or having bad luck to be part of horrible teams for your entire career (Luongo, Weber, Palffy etc.).

Its a total farce.
 
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Quick is not HOF material. But Hellebuyck is about to win his third Vezina. So yeah, figure it out.

Quick had one magical year in 2011-12, when he just lost out on a Vezina, with a GSAA of 28.1. However his career GSAA is 17.9, which means that outside of that one year he's been basically a below-league-average goalie.

By contrast, Hellebuyck's career GSAA is already at 156.3. Even if he falters badly from here this is a HOF shoo-in.
 
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HockeyGuy1964 said:
Quick carried 2 teams all the way to the Stanley Cup on teams not even as close to as good as the Jets of the last few seasons so I'll go with Quick.
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Quick did have one amazing playoff run. In the other one his GSAA was below average (-2.3), which means his team won in spite of him.

Again, Quick's legacy is all about one season: 2011-12. Heck of a season. He was also quite solid in 2017-18. Otherwise decent-to-bad in most years.
 
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Fantomas said:
Quick is not HOF material. But Hellebuyck is about to win his third Vezina. So yeah, figure it out.

Quick had one magical year in 2011-12, when he just lost out on a Vezina, with a GSAA of 28.1. However his career GSAA is 17.9, which means that outside of that one year he's been basically a below-league-average goalie.

By contrast, Hellebuyck's career GSAA is already at 156.3. Even if he falters badly from here this is a HOF shoo-in.
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ok pal
 
Sol said:
Quick easily. Quick has won when it’s mattered most, twice. Hellebuyck has wilted every time the pressure has turned up. I’d be shocked if Hellebuyck made it into the hall of fame. I feel like there has to be something more than being a really good regular season goalie. I think his failures in the post season should disqualify him lol. However judging by the comments on here the bar for entry seems lower than I’d like. Lundqvist took the Rangers to SCF with Stepan as their center. Where has Hellebuyck taken the jets besides disappointment
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You have a point, but there's no way that the HOF keeps Helle out if he has 3 Vezinas, and there's no saying he won't win a fourth after this year.
 
Fantomas said:
Quick is not HOF material. But Hellebuyck is about to win his third Vezina. So yeah, figure it out.

Quick had one magical year in 2011-12, when he just lost out on a Vezina, with a GSAA of 28.1. However his career GSAA is 17.9, which means that outside of that one year he's been basically a below-league-average goalie.

By contrast, Hellebuyck's career GSAA is already at 156.3. Even if he falters badly from here this is a HOF shoo-in.
Click to expand...
This post is a perfect example of an imbalance of dependance on purely statistics for player evaluation versus a balance of the eye test AND stats for eval.
 
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