Post-Game Talk: Below average goaltending + below average finishing + below average defense = ugly losses

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

It’s not loser talk. It’s a sad reality that you can’t keep putting your team down early and expect that’s not going to start wearing on them.

It’s pretty sad to think otherwise.

What's stopping the Oilers from going out and pumping any of these bad teams? The goalie we faced last night had worse stats than ours and once again the Oilers made him look so much better than he was. The Sabres are 30th in GA/G.

We improved that stat because this team doesn't have the offense that we were told it did. Regression across the board.

 

[K1984]

They are not but on the flip side one could argue when they were playing good hockey the goalies were still costing them games.

Don’t you think at some point it becomes a drag on the team when they always have to dig themselves out of a hole?

I'll call that out when I see it. Haven't seen a lot of it lately.

 

[Soundwave]

Champions dont do that. They fight through adversity.

Maybe our guys aren’t what we thought they were?

I expect more from everybody who puts on that jersey. Drai has been the only one to show up this season.

Yeah because every team down 0-3 fights back to make it 3-3. The Panthers would have quit if the situation was reversed.

This team fights back from a management enforced handicap moreso than any other contender in the league.

You show me the contender in this league with below average-average at best goaltending. Where are all these amazing "never quit" teams? They don't exist. Where was Colorado earlier this season when their goaltending was bad? Sitting outside of the playoffs even for stretches of time.

 

[K1984]

Yeah because every team down 0-3 fights back to make it 3-3. The Panthers would have quit if the situation was reversed.

This team fights back from a management enforced handicap moreso than any other contender in the league.

You show me the contender in this league with below average-average at best goaltending. Where are all these amazing "never quit" teams? They don't exist. Where was Colorado earlier this season when their goaltending was bad? Sitting outside of the playoffs even for stretches of time.

Other teams score on wide open nets. We don't. Other teams bury poor opposition down one goal trying to come back. We don't.

Skinner could have played the same game last night and we win going away if there was any detail whatsoever in the forward's game offensively.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Yeah because every team down 0-3 fights back to make it 3-3. The Panthers would have quit if the situation was reversed.

This team fights back from a management enforced handicap moreso than any other contender in the league.

You show me the contender in this league with below average-average at best goaltending. Where are all these amazing "never quit" teams? They don't exist. Where was Colorado earlier this season when their goaltending was bad? Sitting outside of the playoffs even for stretches of time.

Not seeing a whole lot of fight back lately.

Last year was an outlier. This is who the team really is. The team that got swept by the Jets and lost to the worst playoff hockey team ever.

 

[Soundwave]

Haven't said anything about #1 in the division so you can stop projecting that now.

No team plays well for 82 straight games. Good teams don't play like complete f***ing ass for the better part of about the last 20 games. If you want to blame the team for being an abject joke in front of him for more or less the entirety that stretch, then you do you.

We've seen this team play well and get clipped by goaltending. That's pretty clearly not what this is at this point.

Actually teams do go through 15-20 game lulls. Vegas did it last year and had a similiar-ish kind of lull.

The teams that tend to not do that are either riding a coaching bump or are very well built (yes, that means good goaltending is a bedrock of the team).

The Oilers don't have that, sub .900 goaltending for the year ... I'd say the team is more or less where they should be, the people who want more really just want McDavid to carry them to results they don't deserve.

 

[brentashton]

Yes, I knew you weren't blaming him--no problem.

I guess the point I'm making is that looking ahead to the off-season (no matter what happens in the next few months) the only forwards I would bring back are Mc-D, Drai, Hyman and Savoie. Podz (bottom six only) and Perry are o.k. for short term deals near league minimum.....but beyond that everybody else is one of--overpaid, too old, unmotivated or couldn't put the puck in the ocean. You couldn't trade some of them if your life depended on it.

My list would be much the same. That’s kinda sad this far into a team’s Cup window isn’t it.

 

[Soundwave]

Not seeing a whole lot of fight back lately.

Last year was an outlier. This is who the team really is. The team that got swept by the Jets and lost to the worst playoff hockey team ever.

You wouldn't see shit from other teams if they were given this kind of goaltending. Winnipeg isn't shit with Skinner as their starter.

We saw full well what Colorado was doing earlier in the year ... sitting in 8th-10th place before their management went and got upgrades for them.

The Oilers are the only team where the management is so stubborn, they will never fix the problem. A lot of teams wouldn't even make the playoffs if they had to put up with this shit year after year, it would break most teams.

Look at how much Vancouver has fallen off since Demko went kaput from last year to this year.

 

[K1984]

Actually teams do go through 15-20 game lulls. Vegas did it last year and had a similiar-ish kind of lull.

The teams that tend to not do that are either riding a coaching bump or are very well built (yes, that means good goaltending is a bedrock of the team).

The Oilers don't have that, sub .900 goaltending for the year ... I'd say the team is more or less where they should be, the people who want more really just want McDavid to carry them to results they don't deserve.

Vegas' entire roster was injured during their "lull" last year. Not comparable.

Don't need McDavid to carry the team. Just need him to stop running around like a chicken with his head cut off in his own end, stop with the blind passes leading to easy turnovers, and shoot the puck once in a while. Ditto for the rest of the group largely doing the same dumb shit.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

You wouldn't see shit from other teams if they were given this kind of goaltending. Winnipeg isn't shit with Skinner as their starter.

We saw full well what Colorado was doing earlier in the year ... sitting in 8th-10th place before their management went and got upgrades for them.

The Oilers are the only team where the management is so stubborn, they will never fix the problem. A lot of teams wouldn't even make the playoffs if they had to put up with this shit year after year, it would break most teams.

Look at how much Vancouver has fallen off since Demko went kaput from last year to this year.

Vancouver was always going to regress. That's just how these things work.

Colorado didn't even need good goaltending to win the Stanley Cup. And even when their goalie gets pumped (as he did the other night against the Leafs) they came right back and asserted their will and offense.

You're telling me this team couldn't score three against the f***ing Buffalo Sabres?

 

[Oilslick941611]

Yeah because every team down 0-3 fights back to make it 3-3. The Panthers would have quit if the situation was reversed.

This team fights back from a management enforced handicap moreso than any other contender in the league.

You show me the contender in this league with below average-average at best goaltending. Where are all these amazing "never quit" teams? They don't exist. Where was Colorado earlier this season when their goaltending was bad? Sitting outside of the playoffs even for stretches of time.

Colorado was still scoring goals before Blackwood came in. On a quick glance of results, they scored more than 3 goals in a game 11 times before dec 9. They clearly didnt give up.

I’m not talking about results and winning the games when the goalie sinks the game like skinner has, im talking about the team not acting like a bunch of kids because they are down. Adversity, good teams keep competing no matter the score. Great players never stop pushing. If goaltending is causing our guys to give up, get them the f*** off the team. You dont win with players like that. Flat out.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

Vancouver was always going to regress. That's just how these things work.

Colorado didn't even need good goaltending to win the Stanley Cup. And even when their goalie gets pumped (as he did the other night against the Leafs) they came right back and asserted their will and offense.

You're telling me this team couldn't score three against the f***ing Buffalo Sabres?

when Darnell freaking Nurse scores and Bouchard scores a unicorn PP goal, that should be an automatic W

 

[K1984]

Colorado was still scoring goals before Blackwood came in. On a quick glance of results, they scored more than 3 goals in a game 11 times before dec 9. They clearly didnt give up.

I’m not talking about results and winning the games when the goalie sinks the game like skinner has, im talking about the team not acting like a bunch of kids because they are down. Adversity, good teams keep competing no matter the score. Great players never stop pushing. If goaltending is causing our guys to give up, get them the f*** off the team. You dont win with players like that. Flat out.

Since January 16 (the Avalanche comeback game, which was the demarcation line for the season going south), the only games that you could say we lost solely because of the goalie was the game against the Capitals (although there were finishing issues there too), and the Leafs. The rest, even the wins, have been full of incredible f***ing stupidity by almost everyone up front.

 

[Oilslick941611]

Vegas' entire roster was injured during their "lull" last year. Not comparable.

Don't need McDavid to carry the team. Just need him to stop running around like a chicken with his head cut off in his own end, stop with the blind passes leading to easy turnovers, and shoot the puck once in a while. Ditto for the rest of the group largely doing the same dumb shit.

Vegas actually had a 15 game lull this year as well, we caught up and passed them in the standings, Vegas sucked for 2 months from December until recently.

 

[Soundwave]

Colorado was still scoring goals before Blackwood came in. On a quick glance of results, they scored more than 3 goals in a game 11 times before dec 9. They clearly didnt give up.

I’m not talking about results and winning the games when the goalie sinks the game like skinner has, im talking about the team not acting like a bunch of kids because they are down. Adversity, good teams keep competing no matter the score. Great players never stop pushing. If goaltending is causing our guys to give up, get them the f*** off the team. You dont win with players like that. Flat out.

Yeah the same Colorado team that lost to Seattle (the worst team to make the playoffs in probably a decade) in round 1? The same one that's won 1 whopping playoff round total since 2022? That Colorado team?

The same Colorado team that was sitting in 9th-10th place earlier this year before their management bailed them out and got Blackwood for .915 goaltending?

That one?

Seems like they're not so special when they don't have a shit ton of help from their management group.

McDavid/Draisaitl have gotten better results than MacK/Makar/Rantanen-Necas when they have about normalized rosters (that 2022 loaded Avs team notwithstanding) for several years and we're the "quitters" ... yeah ok.

You show me another team that puts up with this level of goaltending and this level of shit management *constantly* and has great success. Show me, ok? Show me ONE TEAM that does it every year.

 

[Oilslick941611]

Vancouver was always going to regress. That's just how these things work.

Colorado didn't even need good goaltending to win the Stanley Cup. And even when their goalie gets pumped (as he did the other night against the Leafs) they came right back and asserted their will and offense.

You're telling me this team couldn't score three against the f***ing Buffalo Sabres?

The Avs didn’t even get blown out that often with their bad goaltending, i checked their results for a previous post. The team never gave up like our soft players do.

 

[North]

I'll call that out when I see it. Haven't seen a lot of it lately.

After the shitty start, they did start playing better, goalies didn’t.

 

[K1984]

Yeah the same Colorado team that lost to Seattle (the worst team to make the playoffs in probably a decade) in round 1? The same one that's won 1 whopping playoff round total since 2022? That Colorado team?

The same Colorado team that was sitting in 9th-10th place earlier this year before their management bailed them out and got Blackwood for .915 goaltending?

That one?

Seems like they're not so special when they don't have a shit ton of help from their management group.

McDavid/Draisaitl have gotten better results than MacK/Makar/Rantanen-Necas when they have about normalized rosters (that 2022 loaded Avs team notwithstanding) for several years and we're the "quitters" ... yeah ok.

You show me another team that puts up with this level of goaltending and this level of shit management *constantly* and has great success. Show me, ok? Show me ONE TEAM that does it every year.

Avalanche still scored goals when they couldn't get saves. We can't.

After the shitty start, they did start playing better, goalies didn’t.

Goalies were fine for 2+ months along with the team. Then both sides of it decided to crater at pretty much the exact same time.

 

[Oilslick941611]

Yeah the same Colorado team that lost to Seattle (the worst team to make the playoffs in probably a decade) in round 1? The same one that's won 1 whopping playoff round total since 2022? That Colorado team?

The same Colorado team that was sitting in 9th-10th place earlier this year before their management bailed them out and got Blackwood for .915 goaltending?

That one?

Seems like they're not so special when they don't have a shit ton of help from their management group.

McDavid/Draisaitl have gotten better results than MacK/Makar/Rantanen-Necas when they have about normalized rosters (that 2022 loaded Avs team notwithstanding) for several years and we're the "quitters" ... yeah ok.

You show me another team that puts up with this level of goaltending *constantly* and has great success. Show me, ok? Show me ONE TEAM that does it every year.

Again, im not talking about winning, im talking about not giving up and getting sulky. It appears you are trying to twist my words.

It’s a 32 team league, great and amazing teams are not winning every year. Competing is what matters and Colorado doesnt stop competing through adversity, they dont hang their head and give up after a bad goal. Keep pushing though. You arent arguing in good faith here.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

Yeah the same Colorado team that lost to Seattle (the worst team to make the playoffs in probably a decade) in round 1? The same one that's won 1 whopping playoff round total since 2022? That Colorado team?

The same Colorado team that was sitting in 9th-10th place earlier this year before their management bailed them out and got Blackwood for .915 goaltending?

That one?

Seems like they're not so special when they don't have a shit ton of help from their management group.

McDavid/Draisaitl have gotten better results than MacK/Makar/Rantanen-Necas when they have about normalized rosters (that 2022 loaded Avs team notwithstanding) for several years and we're the "quitters" ... yeah ok.

You show me another team that puts up with this level of goaltending and this level of shit management *constantly* and has great success. Show me, ok? Show me ONE TEAM that does it every year.

Georgiev had a .918 save% in 2022-23

they lost to the Kraken because they only scored 1 goal in Game 7...and in every one of their losses they only managed to score 2 goals or less

 

[Soundwave]

Avalanche still scored goals when they couldn't get saves. We can't.



Goalies were fine for 2+ months along with the team. Then both sides of it decided to crater at pretty much the exact same time.

See my post about Colorado ... it's bullshit to compare the two as the same. When did Colorado's management spend all summer signing 3 over-the-hill 30 something forwards that don't fit the roster ($10 million spent), then got two of their better young player offer sheeted because they were stupid, then did nothing to move any of those overpaid veteran players, then did nothing to help the goaltending?

Colorado was playing horse shit run n' gun no defense hockey in the first 20-25 games and were sitting in 9th or 10th place at times.

You can go rehire Jay Woodcroft if that's what you'd want again.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

Again, im not talking about winning, im talking about not giving up and getting sulky. It appears you are trying to twist my words.

It’s a 32 team league, great and amazing teams are not winning every year. Competing is what matters and Colorado doesnt stop competing through adversity, they dont hang their head and give up after a bad goal. Keep pushing though. You arent arguing in good faith here.

frankly, I don't see a team that's "given up"....they play stupid, loose hockey...but they haven't given up

 

[K1984]

See my post about Colorado ... it's bullshit to compare the two as the same. When did Colorado's management spend all summer signing 3 over-the-hill 30 something forwards that don't fit the roster ($10 million spent), then got two of their better young player offer sheeted because they were stupid, then did nothing to move any of those overpaid veteran players, then did nothing to help the goaltending?

Colorado was playing horse shit run n' gun no defense hockey in the first 20-25 games and were sitting in 9th or 10th place at times.

You can go rehire Jay Woodcroft if that's what you'd want again.

Then you should stop.

 

[Soundwave]

Georgiev had a .918 save% in 2022-23

they lost to the Kraken because they only scored 1 goal in Game 7...and in every one of their losses they only managed to score 2 goals or less

Yeah so they've had to put up with bad goaltending and somewhat wishy washy management for what? Maybe 12 months.

Oh BOO HOO. Poor BABIES! That must've been soooooo hard for them, meanwhile in Edmonton that's every year, all the time, non stop. MacK/Makar could only win 1 whopping playoff round with similar roster builds to what Connor and Leon deal with *all the time* here.

Their management goes out and helps them out massively this year, our management refuses to fix any of the roster flaws that have been major problems for years.

 

[Oilslick941611]

frankly, I don't see a team that's "given up"....they play stupid, loose hockey...but they haven't given up

I know, im arguing against someone who thinks it’s okay for the team to give up because of bad goals. I’m saying it’s not and that if the team has these types of players it doesnt matter if we get good goaltending, we aren’t winning anything and to get these types of players off the team.

I’m arguing that the issues the team is having are bigger than just the goalies giving up bad goals, but some people only think the issues the goalie.

Ill probably be called another skinner bootlicker though for thinking that though.