JackSlater
Registered User
- Apr 27, 2010
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I originally wrote this out in an email to a friend I discuss sports with, but I will include it here as a thread since I already wrote it out. Below is the email with one exception.
For more than half of NHL history NHL awards were dominated exclusively by Canadian players (Brimsek excluded). The reason is pretty obvious - almost the whole league was Canadian. This began to change in the mid 1980s with Langway winning Norris trophies, and significantly changed by the 1990s when Hart, Art Ross, and Norris trophies went to non-Canadians several times. This is an attempt to look at what a non-international league may look like in terms of awards, mainly to give a sort of rough idea for comparison with the past. I took the Canadian who did best in award voting or highest in scoring and gave them the award. Basically to squint at it and see something sort of similar to NHL awards before the 1980s.
I am not saying that this is how NHL awards would have turned out if the league was only-Canadian. There are several reasons for this. Voters would vote differently in some cases if a big favourite was suddenly not available to vote for, some players may have been less successful without a non-Canadian teammate or two, and most significantly a Canadian only league would look drastically different by 2024 than the actually NHL looks.
Note 1 - I considered any Canadian trained player to be available, regardless of what national team they played for or even their citizenship. This is because the NHL of the past was not explicitly Canadian only, but a player who trained outside of Canada had little realistic change in terms of development. This means that Mikita, Brett Hull, and Quinn Hughes all keep their trophies. Mark Howe does not get the 1984 Norris despite his stint playing for Canada.
Note 2 - I only looked at the Hart, Art Ross, and Norris trophies. The Vezina is too messy historically for me with several decades as the Jennings in disguise and uncertainty that the first all star team winner is equivalent to the modern Vezina winner. I'm not that interested in the Richard when I can look at the Art Ross and Lindsay voting records are not always available.
Hart Trophy
A few thoughts:
Art Ross Trophy
A few thoughts:
Norris Trophy
A few thoughts:
I think that how closely this compares to award results for pre-international NHL, in terms of a level playing field, is debatable. Most would agree that awards are generally harder today than at most points in history, and trends also change in terms of how voters vote.
Anyway, thoughts? Surprises? Errors?
For more than half of NHL history NHL awards were dominated exclusively by Canadian players (Brimsek excluded). The reason is pretty obvious - almost the whole league was Canadian. This began to change in the mid 1980s with Langway winning Norris trophies, and significantly changed by the 1990s when Hart, Art Ross, and Norris trophies went to non-Canadians several times. This is an attempt to look at what a non-international league may look like in terms of awards, mainly to give a sort of rough idea for comparison with the past. I took the Canadian who did best in award voting or highest in scoring and gave them the award. Basically to squint at it and see something sort of similar to NHL awards before the 1980s.
I am not saying that this is how NHL awards would have turned out if the league was only-Canadian. There are several reasons for this. Voters would vote differently in some cases if a big favourite was suddenly not available to vote for, some players may have been less successful without a non-Canadian teammate or two, and most significantly a Canadian only league would look drastically different by 2024 than the actually NHL looks.
Note 1 - I considered any Canadian trained player to be available, regardless of what national team they played for or even their citizenship. This is because the NHL of the past was not explicitly Canadian only, but a player who trained outside of Canada had little realistic change in terms of development. This means that Mikita, Brett Hull, and Quinn Hughes all keep their trophies. Mark Howe does not get the 1984 Norris despite his stint playing for Canada.
Note 2 - I only looked at the Hart, Art Ross, and Norris trophies. The Vezina is too messy historically for me with several decades as the Jennings in disguise and uncertainty that the first all star team winner is equivalent to the modern Vezina winner. I'm not that interested in the Richard when I can look at the Art Ross and Lindsay voting records are not always available.
Hart Trophy
| Year | Actual Winner | New Winner |
| 1994 | Fedorov | Gilmour |
| 1997 | Hasek | Kariya |
| 1998 | Hasek | Brodeur |
| 1999 | Jagr | Joseph |
| 2003 | Forsberg | Brodeur |
| 2008 | Ovechkin | Iginla |
| 2009 | Ovechkin | Mason |
| 2010 | H. Sedin | Crosby |
| 2012 | Malkin | Stamkos |
| 2013 | Ovechkin | Crosby |
| 2016 | Kane | Crosby |
| 2019 | Kucherov | Crosby |
| 2020 | Draisaitl | MacKinnon |
| 2022 | Matthews | McDavid |
A few thoughts:
- Feels like there is no chance those goalie Harts would happen, even though you get the odd weird one like Theodore.
- Brodeur getting two surprises me regardless. Overall it looks sort of like how Rayner and Rollins got Harts over a span of 5 seasons.
- Gilmour, Brodeur 98, Joseph, and Mason were all fourth place finishers in reality. Not shocking that these are some of the most suspect new "winners".
- Crosby is the big winner here. *(added from email but you're welcome daver)
Art Ross Trophy
| Year | Actual Winner | New Winner |
| 1995 | Jagr | Lindros |
| 1998 | Jagr | Gretzky |
| 1999 | Jagr | Kariya |
| 2000 | Jagr | Recchi |
| 2001 | Jagr | Sakic |
| 2003 | Forsberg | Thornton |
| 2008 | Ovechkin | Iginla |
| 2009 | Malkin | Crosby |
| 2010 | H. Sedin | Crosby |
| 2011 | D. Sedin | St. Louis |
| 2012 | Malkin | Stamkos |
| 2016 | Kane | Benn |
| 2019 | Kucherov | McDavid |
| 2020 | Draisaitl | McDavid |
| 2024 | Kucherov | MacKinnon |
A few thoughts:
- Had a laugh that Gretzky picks up yet "another" Art Ross.
- St. Louis, three time Art Ross "winner".
- Benn laughing historically with his second "win".
- These results feel less wonky than the Hart ones
Norris Trophy
| Year | Actual Winner | New Winner |
| 1983 | Langway | Bourque |
| 1984 | Langway | Coffey |
| 1989 | Chelios | Coffey |
| 1992 | Leetch | Bourque |
| 1993 | Chelios | Bourque |
| 1996 | Chelios | Bourque |
| 1997 | Leetch | Stevens |
| 2001 | Lidstrom | Bourque |
| 2002 | Lidstrom | Blake |
| 2003 | Lidstrom | MacInnis |
| 2006 | Lidstrom | Niedermayer |
| 2007 | Lidstrom | Niedermayer |
| 2008 | Lidstrom | Phaneuf |
| 2009 | Chara | Green |
| 2011 | Lidstrom | Weber |
| 2012 | Karlsson | Weber |
| 2015 | Karlsson | Doughty |
| 2018 | Hedman | Doughty |
| 2020 | Josi | Pietrangelo |
| 2021 | Fox | Makar |
| 2023 | Karlsson | Makar |
A few thoughts:
- Bourque with 10 Norris trophies is f***ed.
- Media would be all over Niedermayer's knob even more with 3 Norris trophies.
- I was surprised about Stevens in 1997. He was fourth in actual voting.
- Phaneuf and Green back to back. Woof.
- Doughty with three and basically par with Pilote feels right.
I think that how closely this compares to award results for pre-international NHL, in terms of a level playing field, is debatable. Most would agree that awards are generally harder today than at most points in history, and trends also change in terms of how voters vote.
Anyway, thoughts? Surprises? Errors?
