Confirmed with Link: Avs trade de Haan, Parsinnen, a 2nd and a 4th to NYR for Lindgren (50% retained), Vesey, prospect Hank Kempf

[Perratrooper]

I get why a lot of people are worked up with regards to asset management and I do think we paid a steep price, but I would also argue we’re in a significant sellers market. From the games I’ve watched this year, none of the top dogs have looked consistently like juggernauts. To me if I’m a bubble team I’m actually okay with taking a stab on a playoff dream.

I don’t love the Vesey fit, but I’ll certainly give him and Lindgren the benefit of a couple games in an Avs jersey before making a judgment on the trade.

 

[Avs_19]

While there is some risk to Lindgren’s game, between his on-ice decline and durability (thanks to his playing style), the Avalanche should be able to maximize him better. He likely won’t be overextended in Colorado in terms of workload. And the team doesn’t have to worry about the long-term because he is a pending UFA. At 50 percent retention, he should be an upgrade over de Haan and can step up and play more minutes if needed.

Rangers grade: B+
Avalanche grade: B

Lindgren is the best player in this deal, albeit on an expiring deal. He’s an excellent skater and competitor who makes life difficult for opponents. He is mediocre with the puck, though, and average-sized, so even while his play style is highly likable, his impact on games isn’t always the highest. He can be very useful in the playoffs, though, and makes the Avalanche better.

Avalanche grade: B+
Rangers grade: B-

 

[Freaky Styley]

I was hoping for Jones before even Rants was traded, even more so afterwards.

The Avs didn't whiff on this. They simply were out bided on, as the Avs don't have a single piece that would equate to Knight. And honestly, I don't even think the Avs have any combination of pieces that would equate Knight.

Disagree. We were clearly talking for months and there until the final hour, hence the timing of the Lindgren deal. We clearly had an offer they were strongly considering. All I'm arguing is that if you're going to overpay slightly for Lindgren, just overpay for Jones instead.

 

[CobraAcesS]

Shrimpman is getting roasted in the comments. Shayna's analysis seems to be the one supported.

The comments are better than the article lol.

 

[Perratrooper]

He averaged 19:56 for the Rangers this year, good for third on their team and what would be fourth on our team in average defense ice time per game.

If he allows Toews/Makar to bring their ice time down from 25-26min a game to the 22-24 I think that would be a major positive.

I would also imagine that if he fits in okay we could sign him as a solidifying bottom pair presence who can be asked to play second pair minutes with injuries. If he can help play calm minutes and allow for our younger offensive defenseman in our pipeline play to a higher level I think it would be a huge benefit.

 

[AvBuff]

Big picture - CMac completely overhauled the goalie position for next to nothing and may very well have fleeced Carolina in the Mikko/Necas deal. Not sure how many more magical deals people can expect from Avs management. My God - people were upset that we had to throw in Kovalenko to get Blackwood.

By all accounts, the Avs needed a "mean/salty" defenseman for the playoff run. So does everyone else. The market is small and expensive for those types and teams are not going to give those guys away. You're gonna have to overpay. Lindgren is a clear upgrade over deHaan - and if it took a 2nd to make the swap happen, so be it.

I'm pretty excited to see what Lindgren can do when he's not defending the other teams top line and doesn't have a GM creating soap operas and drama. Let's see the man play.

 

[shadow1]

Ok, seriously what fkn value does that have if it evaluates Drouin like that?

Literally no one has anything to complain about with Drouin outside of health. Not defensively, not offensively, not contract wise, and that is even while fkn stapled to Mitts..

Seriously what the f***?

That time card was from his last year in Montreal/when Colorado signed him.

But generally, as far as I know, the TOI portion is a huge part of the equation.

Meaning in the case of Lindgren, he was playing 2nd pairing minutes and was providid provided (EDIT: was super sleepy and forgot English) 0% WAR compared to other players getting those minutes. That doesn't sound great, but it's not the same as being a total 0% WAR player.

 

[CobraAcesS]

That time card was from his last year in Montreal/when Colorado signed him.

But generally, as far as I know, the TOI portion is a huge part of the equation.

Meaning in the case of Lindgren, he was playing 2nd pairing minutes and was providid 0% WAR compared to other players getting those minutes. That doesn't sound great, but it's not the same as being a total 0% WAR player.

I've seen some comments saying at times he was getting 25 minutes even this year.

Definitely miss cast.









Please god Bednar do not fall in love with this guy and start doing the same shit..

 

[Jasenr]

Disagree. We were clearly talking for months and there until the final hour, hence the timing of the Lindgren deal. We clearly had an offer they were strongly considering. All I'm arguing is that if you're going to overpay slightly for Lindgren, just overpay for Jones instead.

Avs didnt have the pieces for that deal, did they? You need to make the team better with the deal and not worse.

Maybe Bedards wanted a goalie and Avs didnt have one to give. Case closed..

And havent read through the last 10 pages to see if there was a deal in place like you suggested...

 

[S E P H]

The Rangers didn't give up up value for CHD. Avs did for Lindgren who is also one of the worst defensemen in the league THIS year. He was also one of the worst defensemen in the league last year.



You could have done better than Lindgren the last few weeks by picking up a player for free.

I'm not trying to dunk on the Avs here (I have no reason to) but you'll see for yourself soon enough. He's beyond cooked.

He might seriously suck and not fit in our system (which is the biggest issue I have and a legit concern of yours), but there are two things I didn't like about your original post.

1. Saying Lindgren is worse than Georgiev. Nah fam, no way is this possible. Georgiev let in a goal the first five minutes of almost every single game he started this season and last. Avs were top 5 in comebacks both of these seasons, not because we are truly an awful defensive club, but because we ALWAYS played from behind with him in net. His play this season pretty much will end his NHL career, except if he signs with a team like the Penguins who would want him to tank for McKenna.

2. No way is Lindgren worse than de Haan, like no way is that possible. De Haan was worse than Greg Zanon when the Avs signed him, and then had to let him go, he was that brutal and one of the worst defenders I've ever seen play. CdH wasn't because more of his minutes were covered by Makar and Toews playing half a game.

 

[Colorado Avalanche]

But we do have to raise question, who is better than Lindgren and available? We know Jones was but he didn't want to come here, so who would you target? Just brutal trade deadline I think. Not many options I feel like. You could say maybe Karlsson but is he type of defenseman we need?

I would also add the trade wasn't the greatest but if the price was this high for Lindgren, then the market must be brutal.

 

[CobraAcesS]

He might seriously suck and not fit in our system (which is the biggest issue I have and a legit concern of yours), but there are two things I didn't like about your original post.

1. Saying Lindgren is worse than Georgiev. Nah fam, no way is this possible. Georgiev let in a goal the first five minutes of almost every single game he started this season and last. Avs were top 5 in comebacks both of these seasons, not because we are truly an awful defensive club, but because we ALWAYS played from behind with him in net. His play this season pretty much will end his NHL career, except if he signs with a team like the Penguins who would want him to tank for McKenna.

2. No way is Lindgren worse than de Haan, like no way is that possible. De Haan was worse than Greg Zanon when the Avs signed him, and then had to let him go, he was that brutal and one of the worst defenders I've ever seen play. CdH wasn't because more of his minutes were covered by Makar and Toews playing half a game.

You know.. It's ok to say CDH was the worst defenseman we've used since Makar was drafted or something.

Why do you all feel the need to make me read THAT fkn name? WHY?

 

[Ceremony]

Shrimpman is getting roasted in the comments. Shayna's analysis seems to be the one supported.

The comments are better than the article lol.

View attachment 985399

"bleeds to win" like when Kadri broke his face

Consider me unimpressed

 

[S E P H]

You’d think this fan base, especially, would have learned to reserve complete judgement of a trade until said player has at least played a game with us lol. But no, it’s a guaranteed loss for sure!

I think the biggest issue for most isn't trading for Lindgren, but that this killed Jones to Avs rumours. @NOTENOUGHRYJOTHINGS mentioned a good point yesterday, but Avs needed a defender to push Manson down, but Lindgren's play this season isn't the one to do that. Definitely has talent to play on that second pairing, but with the handiness issues, he's there to cover Malinski's mistakes.

E: I should mention that Girard has been bullied defensively quite a bit lately.

 

[niwotsblessing]

But we do have to raise question, who is better than Lindgren and available? We know Jones was but he didn't want to come here, so who would you target? Just brutal trade deadline I think. Not many options I feel like. You could say maybe Karlsson but is he type of defenseman we need?

I would also add the trade wasn't the greatest but if the price was this high for Lindgren, then the market must be brutal.

Lindgren is a LHD, also a factor in terms of who's available.

 

[MacKaRtin]

He averaged 19:56 for the Rangers this year, good for third on their team and what would be fourth on our team in average defense ice time per game.

If he allows Toews/Makar to bring their ice time down from 25-26min a game to the 22-24 I think that would be a major positive.

I don't think Lindgren reduces the top pair minutes. Jones probably would have (at least in the first couple years of that contract) as he's the kind of D that coaches feel comfortable leaning on

 

[Balthazar]

I don't think Lindgren reduces the top pair minutes.

I'm very curious to see what Bednar will want from him.

If he's trying to change him and forces him to skate with the puck like he did with Manson and all the guys we traded for then yeah, he won't play much.

 

[a mangy Meowth]

I'm very curious to see what Bednar will want from him.

If he's trying to change him and forces him to skate with the puck like he did with Manson and all the guys we traded for then yeah, he won't play much.

Lindgren is actually not a bad skater

 

[RoyIsALegend]

Lindgren is actually not a bad skater

Passing is an issue.

He can skate it out, but hitting Avs forwards with our breakout of 2 guys at center ice and 1 guy at the opposite blueline will be tough.

Bednar refuses to have a forward cycle low on the breakout, unless it’s a regroup where we pass back from the neutral zone and the D are at the faceoff circles. That’s the only time a forward cycles low.

 

[a mangy Meowth]

Passing is an issue.

He can skate it out, but hitting Avs forwards with our breakout of 2 guys at center ice and 1 guy at the opposite blueline will be tough.

Bednar refuses to have a forward cycle low on the breakout, unless it’s a regroup where we pass back from the neutral zone and the D are at the faceoff circles. That’s the only time a forward cycles low.

From what I've heard, it hasn't always been a problem for him.

Which makes me think it may be rangers related

 

[CobraAcesS]

Lindgren is actually not a bad skater

He's in the "good" category. Shrimpy was getting shit on in the comments of the Athletic for calling him "excellent" though.

 

[Tommy Shelby]

But we do have to raise question, who is better than Lindgren and available?

Dumoulin is the only one, we'll have to see his cost, I bet the Ducks get at least a 1st rounder for him

 

[a mangy Meowth]

He's in the "good" category. Shrimpy was getting shit on in the comments of the Athletic for calling him "excellent" though.

View attachment 985459

This is probably good enough to play in our system on a lower pairing IMO

 

[CobraAcesS]

Dumoulin is the only one, we'll have to see his cost, I bet the Ducks get at least a 1st rounder for him

My mind wants to spit out Provorov, but all indications are CBJ isn't selling.

Is Dumoulin better, or just less polarizing considering usage?

If he actually gets a 1st, my feelings that he'd generate a bit of a mini bidding war were correct, but woof.

 

[a mangy Meowth]

Is Dumoulin better, or just less polarizing considering usage?

Yeah, is he actually better? Especially for us. He's slower than Lindgren lol