Confirmed with Link: Avs GM Chris MacFarland to Preds as President of Hockey Operations

[Porter Stoutheart]

It's interesting to me that all the Blake defenders are highlighting why everything is actually not that bad or just bad luck and no one is making the positive case for him. Outside of having "experience" what part of his tenure in LA should make us excited that he's coming here? When did he really nail a trade or make a great draft pick?

From what I see, his drafting in the early first round ranged from huge misses to pretty good, but for every single one of them he'd have been better off taking the player picked immediately. His late 1st rounders all were busts. He hit on a few guys in later rounds (Faber, Spence, and Laferriere) but he traded 2 out of 3 of those guys. His big trades while maybe reasonable at the time all ended up with him being the loser. I guess two 2nds for Arvidsson was pretty good but that's really about it.

I would definitely be a lot more negative about the Blake signing if he was THE GUY we picked. That he's just kind of a support-voice for CMac softens that blow a lot. He was a great NHL player, and has been a long-time NHL exec, so I guess in that sense, if you want to interface with the "old boys network" in the NHL, and your GM guy (CMac) is considered a bit of a nerdy outsider, maybe Blake brings value to the table?

Anyway, it definitely is a lot less worrisome if he's just one voice at the table instead of The Guy, so I am pretty close to neutral on that hire? He doesn't have a great reputation, which is a bit of a worry, but he also doesn't have the final voice here, so...

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

Trying reading the whole post next time and not just the part you wanted to see. Brunette coach teams stink and are bottom of the barrel until after Christmas, every single year. It takes a good run in the 2nd half for him to get up that high.

If you are after a top pick you ride him til December and fire him, before he hits his normal hot streak pattern.

This still does not remotely read to me as any kind of justification for retaining a Bad Coach, sorry.

 

[Predsanddead24]

I would definitely be a lot more negative about the Blake signing if he was THE GUY we picked. That he's just kind of a support-voice for CMac softens that blow a lot. He was a great NHL player, and has been a long-time NHL exec, so I guess in that sense, if you want to interface with the "old boys network" in the NHL, and your GM guy (CMac) is considered a bit of a nerdy outsider, maybe Blake brings value to the table?

Anyway, it definitely is a lot less worrisome if he's just one voice at the table instead of The Guy, so I am pretty close to neutral on that hire? He doesn't have a great reputation, which is a bit of a worry, but he also doesn't have the final voice here, so...

Which is fair enough and why (despite some assertions otherwise) I'm not freaking out about the hire. But it's also the first move that CMac has made so I do think it's worth pointing out that it's not the most inspiring pick given that Blake's resume has a lot of the things (old boys network, won't commit to a rebuild, poor drafting/development) that I've been hoping we'd move away from.

 

[Armourboy]

This still does not remotely read to me as any kind of justification for retaining a Bad Coach, sorry.

Like I said what do you want? In no world do you hire a good coach and this team ends up with a high draft pick.

You either have talent bad enough to drag the coach down, or you have a bad enough coach to drag the talent down. Any other scenario and you are bubble team picking 10-16 every season.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

Like I said what do you want? In no world do you hire a good coach and this team ends up with a high draft pick.

You either have talent bad enough to drag the coach down, or you have a bad enough coach to drag the talent down. Any other scenario and you are bubble team picking 10-16 every season.

I hire a good coach. First and foremost. The draft order can go f*** itself.

But I don't actually believe this team is THAT good, it's old, the guys who stepped up with exorbitant icetime last season WILL falter and fall back. We are going to be BAD BAD BAD even with a "good coach".

And then, that "good coach" is also "good" specifically BECAUSE he plays our younger players more. So it all lines up. Fire Brunette, get a "good coach", we'll still suck, still get a good draft pick, it's The Way.

 

[herzausstein]

In some ways, I dont want to hire a perceived good coach only for this teams construction to sour me on him before we turn things around. But also, I've seen what Bruno does with the youth and that drives me up the walls bananas.

But if we hire a good coach and strip away a vet or two like Stamkos and Marchessault, make a trade for some up and coming you (like MacTavish), then filter in our youth my expectations will be low enough that as long as he plays the young players, ill consider it a success.

Still think we start with Bruno though

 

[triggrman]

HOw close are we to the floor?

 

[NSH615]

HOw close are we to the floor?

Based on what Puckpedia is showing, looks like the Preds are about $121k under the floor.

Current Cap Hit: $76,779,555
Floor: $76.90M

Current Cap Space: $27,220,445

 

[nine_inch_fang]

I would definitely be a lot more negative about the Blake signing if he was THE GUY we picked. That he's just kind of a support-voice for CMac softens that blow a lot. He was a great NHL player, and has been a long-time NHL exec, so I guess in that sense, if you want to interface with the "old boys network" in the NHL, and your GM guy (CMac) is considered a bit of a nerdy outsider, maybe Blake brings value to the table?

Anyway, it definitely is a lot less worrisome if he's just one voice at the table instead of The Guy, so I am pretty close to neutral on that hire? He doesn't have a great reputation, which is a bit of a worry, but he also doesn't have the final voice here, so...

Yeah, the "not the decision maker" is the key part here. Not exactly inspired by the hire but clearly these two know each other and have discussed a lot of hockey if Blake was already being considered for a position in Colorado. What this hire isn't is "Perding things up after 24 hours" or "a bad look".

I also agree with your explanation of why keeping Brunette is a horrible decision that would be VERY disappointing. He IS the decision maker for the bench and he's shown he isn't capable of coaching a young developing team. He is capable of ruining prospects though.

 

[herzausstein]

Based on what Puckpedia is showing, looks like the Preds are about $121k under the floor.

Current Cap Hit: $76,779,555
Floor: $76.90M

Current Cap Space: $27,220,445

And thats a 22 man roster. Throw in another rookie and we are there.

 

[glenngineer]

Some people learn from their failures, others have gradual success, some inherit a great situation.

Learning from failures - Trotz winning a Cup in DC. Maurice winning two Cups in Florida. Bill Belichick in NE.

Gradual Success - Jimmy Johnson started out 1-15 and within a couple of years had back to back championships. Bednar taking the worst team and making it a Cup winner with the help of his management team.

Inherit a great situation - Using Maurice here as well.

Blake is a Stanley Cup champ who played with an edge, never a bad thing to have around in your org. He's made mistakes in LA - will it continue here or will he and CMac form a good team to evaluate where the team currently is and what they need to do to make it to the top of the mountain? No one knows but if Haslam felt CMac was the right guy for the job and CMac feels Blake is a good fit alongside him, who am I to question it?

As far as Bruno goes, you either keep him around in hopes he helps the team tank into a top 3 pick without destroying every single youngster we have on this roster or you get rid of him, bring in a coach who can develop the kids, add to those kids via trade and the draft and do it over time and hopefully in 3-4 years, you have something again. Keeping Brunette around another year is just more of the same and beyond stupid. I don't think it's worth ruining a pretty decent pipeline of kids to try and get a top 3 pick. Develop the kids properly, see what you have and if they aren't up to the challenge, you end up with a top 3 pick and hopefully the kids can still grow without losing their confidence by being under AB and then having to learn a new system once you hire a new coach.

Much like Trotz got rid of Duchene for him feeling he was toxic, we need to do the same with Brunette.

 

[nine_inch_fang]

Some people learn from their failures, others have gradual success, some inherit a great situation.

Learning from failures - Trotz winning a Cup in DC. Maurice winning two Cups in Florida. Bill Belichick in NE.

Gradual Success - Jimmy Johnson started out 1-15 and within a couple of years had back to back championships. Bednar taking the worst team and making it a Cup winner with the help of his management team.

Inherit a great situation - Using Maurice here as well.

Blake is a Stanley Cup champ who played with an edge, never a bad thing to have around in your org. He's made mistakes in LA - will it continue here or will he and CMac form a good team to evaluate where the team currently is and what they need to do to make it to the top of the mountain? No one knows but if Haslam felt CMac was the right guy for the job and CMac feels Blake is a good fit alongside him, who am I to question it?

As far as Bruno goes, you either keep him around in hopes he helps the team tank into a top 3 pick without destroying every single youngster we have on this roster or you get rid of him, bring in a coach who can develop the kids, add to those kids via trade and the draft and do it over time and hopefully in 3-4 years, you have something again. Keeping Brunette around another year is just more of the same and beyond stupid. I don't think it's worth ruining a pretty decent pipeline of kids to try and get a top 3 pick. Develop the kids properly, see what you have and if they aren't up to the challenge, you end up with a top 3 pick and hopefully the kids can still grow without losing their confidence by being under AB and then having to learn a new system once you hire a new coach.

Much like Trotz got rid of Duchene for him feeling he was toxic, we need to do the same with Brunette.

Can't learn from your mistakes of you can't admit you've made any.

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

Colorado AHL team eliminated tonight, game 7 of western conference finals. Wonder if that frees up Macdonald (agm who oversees AHL team) or anyone else from Avs to join us.

 

[Legionnaire11]

Colorado AHL team eliminated tonight, game 7 of western conference finals. Wonder if that frees up Macdonald (agm who oversees AHL team) or anyone else from Avs to join us.

Didn't even think of that, Mark Letestu might be a coaching target as well.

 

[HockeyFan111]

Wait, do you mean when Poile acquired Johansen from Columbus? Sure, that was celebrated, and to be fair still worked out as a net plus IMO for the Preds. Even though RyJo faded abysmally near the end and had to be liquidated with retention. Maybe that'll be PLD one day or not, who knows?

Nah I was making a point. I thought getting ryjo was a necessary move by the preds. Thought the contract was always on the high side but you have to sign him. Same could be said for Blake when he acquired pld. La was lookin for a top line center and while the return and the contract was a little high getting a almost 70 point center, kinda like johansen was, was a necessary move. Nobody could of predicted pld only getting 40 points the season after

 

[Armourboy]

Nah I was making a point. I thought getting ryjo was a necessary move by the preds. Thought the contract was always on the high side but you have to sign him. Same could be said for Blake when he acquired pld. La was lookin for a top line center and while the return and the contract was a little high getting a almost 70 point center, kinda like johansen was, was a necessary move. Nobody could of predicted pld only getting 40 points the season after

Problem is his best seasons were point totals in the low 60's and in the cap world we were in at that time the contract was just silly. He's making the same money as Forsberg who has had a mid 80's and a mid 90's point season. Had his contract been closer to 6.5m it would have made sense.

Most of the reason Poile could justify 8 for RyJo is that he at least had gotten us to a SCF. PLD didn't even have that. Frankly most of us never were happy with the 8 on RyJo either, it's just that Poile didn't sell him off the next season so people kind of mellowed on it.

 

[Predsanddead24]

I also just don’t find the “nobody could’ve predicted it” defense for bad moves all that compelling. As a GM your job is to make the determination of how a player is going to fit into your team if you make a trade or signing. The reason you’re in charge and getting paid the big bucks is to be able to make those decisions correctly. Obviously no one will be 100% right but you should be right more often than your wrong and the fact is Blake whiffed on his two biggest trades in LA and would’ve been better off taking the player drafted immediately after for his four highest draft picks.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

I also just don’t find the “nobody could’ve predicted it” defense for bad moves all that compelling. As a GM your job is to make the determination of how a player is going to fit into your team if you make a trade or signing. The reason you’re in charge and getting paid the big bucks is to be able to make those decisions correctly. Obviously no one will be 100% right but you should be right more often than your wrong and the fact is Blake whiffed on his two biggest trades in LA and would’ve been better off taking the player drafted immediately after for his four highest draft picks.

"Nobody could have predicted it" whiffs also depend heavily on just what you gave up on those moves?

Like, PLD was kinda "hot trash fire" at the time, so when LA traded for him, Vilardi was pretty mediocre (to that point), Iafallo and Kupari are just depth guys at best (Iafallo overpaid, Kupari busted), it might as well have been Vilardi for PLD? It wasn't like LA paid through the nose for PLD. Then when he had a bad 1st year, they dumped his new contract pretty successfully to WAS?

TBH, I would have been "for" going after PLD at that pricetag too, if we had the same pieces to offer? He sucked in LA after the trade, but has been better in Washington. Most people still don't like the player, but to me, if you're going to mess up a trade... the PLD ones weren't the worst loss?

 

[weeze]

Why not go after Bruce Cassidy. Looks like he was a good coach and is currently not working.

 

[triggrman]

Can't learn from your mistakes of you can't admit you've made any.

If you learn from it, it's a lesson not a mistake.

 

[Flgatorguy87]

Why not go after Bruce Cassidy. Looks like he was a good coach and is currently not working.

I thought Vegas controlled this? He'd surely be hired by now if that wasn't the case.

 

[PredsV82]

Well make up your mind, do you want to suck and get a good draft pick or get a competent coach.? There is too much talent on the team with a good coach for this team to be very bad.

I dont want to tank, and never have. Im not sure why you think I did. I want a competent coach who will teach our younger players how to be winners. If that means we dont suck enough for a high pick , so be it

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

I thought Vegas controlled this? He'd surely be hired by now if that wasn't the case.

Vegas has nixed letting him interview so far... but I think it was all-Pacific teams that asked (Edmonton, Vancouver, LA)... soooo.... we don't necessarily know atm if they would nix a team outside the division...

Anyway, that said, I also would think Cassidy himself sees himself as a "going for the Cup" level of coach, and probably wants to coach a contender as opposed to a rebuilding team like ours?

 

[Scoresberg]

Cassidy is a very nuanced, detail-oriented coach for a contending team. I think we need a younger coach, someone like Carle or even Jussi Ahokas (Mem Cup champ) OR an ass-kicker like Berube who will set the bar high for the group. Yeah, he bottomed out in Toronto but that team is a lost cause with or without Berube.

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

Cassidy is a very nuanced, detail-oriented coach for a contending team. I think we need a younger coach, someone like Carle or even Jussi Ahokas (Mem Cup champ) OR an ass-kicker like Berube who will set the bar high for the group. Yeah, he bottomed out in Toronto but that team is a lost cause with or without Berube.

Ashokas doesn’t get enough attention. He is helluva coach. Expect he will be in nhl sooner than later.