Auston Matthews is now 0-7 in winner take all games in his career

[Fatass]

lol ok.... why has Matthews touched the cup or something? are there pics of him at the HHOF or something? is that suppose to be a big knock on Matthews?

what about Keith Tkachuk?
is this some big no no because he never won it himself?

It’s a weird thing. But there’s a reason why some great players can lead their clubs to the Cup and others can’t. Keith T couldn’t do it. Matt T did. Matthews?

 

[Arthur Morgan]

It’s a weird thing. But there’s a reason why some great players can lead their clubs to the Cup and others can’t. Keith T couldn’t do it. Matt T did. Matthews?

I dunno we will see. where would you rank Joe Thornton cause there's a great player that never won. I figure Matthews would get treatment like that. his placement is for sure effected by not winning. I just have a hard time ignoring more goals, points, and awards throughout a career.

you know fine Ill agree there's a chance that Eichel and Barkov could place above him

but lets say this is fantasy. would you ever draft Eichel or Barkov over Matthews?

 

[Fatass]

I dunno we will see. where would you rank Joe Thornton cause there's a great player that never won. I figure Matthews would get treatment like that. his placement is for sure effected by not winning. I just have a hard time ignoring more goals, points, and awards throughout a career.

you know fine Ill agree there's a chance that Eichel and Barkov could place above him

but lets say this is fantasy. would you ever draft Eichel or Barkov over Matthews?

Imo Matthews ranks in a tier above Thornton.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

Imo Matthews ranks in a tier above Thornton.

Id prob agree with that but just using him as an example because not winning 100% changed the way people viewed him. it effected his legacy and likely his overall ranking in most all time lists moving forward but he's 14th all time NHL in points and 7th all time in assists with a Hart and Art Ross, an incredibly good player.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

thats okay not everyone has to have to agree you will always fine those who disagree no matter what doesnt mean what im saying about how you would rank a players is wrong.

playoffs will 100% effect a players spot all time/legacy if they never win but only so much look at Dan Marino who is still ranked in the top 10 anyways even though he never won a Super Bowl not winning 100% effected his placement but he still earned a spot high up there anyways

winning a cup isnt a end all conversation if a player exceeds them in goals, points and awards. there's a reason why Towes likely wont rank above Barkov even if Barkov never wins again. he's a better player and Toews winning 3 cups isnt changing that.

What makes you wrong is your insistence that everyone who disagrees with you must have some sort of ulterior motive. Either they dislike Matthews, or hate the Leafs, or just "disagree no matter what". It's never that your argument is flawed, it's always the other persons fault for not agreeing with you. Did you ever consider that maybe so many people disagree because you're wrong?

As for Marino, if given the chance, would you want him on your team? What if your team already has Joe Montana? Or John Elway? Or Tom Brady? Is Marino still the only right choice then?

Having more regular season goals, points, and awards isn't a end all either. If that's what you prefer, that's great for you. I prefer guys who have actually put together impressive playoff runs, and don't need their fans to make excuses as to why they can't win.

 

[PaulD]

Tavares signing wouldnt have been much of an issue if it wasn't for covid putting the NHL into a flat cap for 4 years. the cap would have gone up and his cap percentage would have dropped.

you know with the cap going up as much as it is soon what hes making wont be all that crazy, there's talk of McDavid becoming the first 20m player, guys below him will likely be making 15+ before you know it. maybe even more.

Tavares still was a bad sign for Toronto

 

[Arthur Morgan]

What makes you wrong is your insistence that everyone who disagrees with you must have some sort of ulterior motive. Either they dislike Matthews, or hate the Leafs, or just "disagree no matter what". It's never that your argument is flawed, it's always the other persons fault for not agreeing with you. Did you ever consider that maybe so many people disagree because you're wrong?

As for Marino, if given the chance, would you want him on your team? What if your team already has Joe Montana? Or John Elway? Or Tom Brady? Is Marino still the only right choice then?

Having more regular season goals, points, and awards isn't a end all either. If that's what you prefer, that's great for you. I prefer guys who have actually put together impressive playoff runs, and don't need their fans to make excuses as to why they can't win.

I dont think that its only because they hate the leafs or dislike Matthews although there is plenty of people where thats the reason,

thats just how I would rank players of any sport. and I think that judging a player on playoff success when its a team sport alone is flawed too.

well I never said I would take Matthews over McDavid or MacKinnon, Marino would prob become a top choice once those guys are gone though.

well 3 out of 4 helps alot more than 1 out of 4. think however you like but playoff success is a combined team effort, I doubt Barkov or Eichel would make much of a difference in Toronto either if they swapped places with Matthews

Tavares still was a bad sign. Leafs didnt need another soft skilled forward that hadn't won anything. At 11.5 a year too boot. They needed D , and or a goalie alot more

I mean if he played the way he did in the first year the entire time it prob would have been rpetty good but yeah another C with Matthews and Kadri wasnt really needed, Dubas really isnt that good of a GM

but if covid never happened it would have been alot easier to add over the years

 

[PaulD]

I dont think that its only because they hate the leafs or dislike Matthews although there is plenty of people where thats the reason,

thats just how I would rank players of any sport. and I think that judging a player on playoff success when its a team sport alone is flawed too.

well I never said I would take Matthews over McDavid or MacKinnon, Marino would prob become a top choice once those guys are gone though.

well 3 out of 4 helps alot more than 1 out of 4. think however you like but playoff success is a combined team effort, I doubt Barkov or Eichel would make much of a difference in Toronto either if they swapped places with Matthews


I mean if he played the way he did in the first year the entire time it prob would have been rpetty good but yeah another C with Matthews and Kadri wasnt really needed, Dubas really isnt that good of a GM

but if covid never happened it would have been alot easier to add over the years

for all teams.

 

[SheldonJPlankton]

To be fair to Matthews it's been since 1967 when the Leafs last played a SC final game. A franchise doesn't fail for 55 plus years without much of the issues being dysfunctions of the franchise.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

for all teams.

oh yeah I know, Leafs obviously isnt the only team effected, just saying if the cap were to rise 3m every year like it was pretty much expected they likely could have made some moves over the years alot easier?

I dunno obviously Tavares wasnt a good signing and the results prove that. but it could have maybe been better if not for covid. too bad we will never know,

big move from Dubas most would have done but in the end it was wrong for the team Id be just as happy running Matthews/Kadri and spend the 11m else where. its crazy Tavares was offered more else where too (rumor I believe)

To be fair to Matthews it's been since 1967 when the Leafs last played a SC final game. A franchise doesn't fail for 55 plus years without much of the issues being dysfunctions of the franchise.

if your going to rip them you might as well do it right, they also have never won 3 series in a single playoff run

its pretty sad how long its been but not many Canadian teams are doing much better at this point. we are all equally pathetic at this point. some have yet to win a cup and its been 30+ years since a Canadian team has won. welcome to the club of being pathetic

 

[SheldonJPlankton]

if your going to rip them you might as well do it right, they also have never won 3 series in a single playoff run

its pretty sad how long its been but not many Canadian teams are doing much better at this point. we are all equally pathetic at this point. some have yet to win a cup and its been 30+ years since a Canadian team has won. welcome to the club of being pathetic

A SC final appearance is a measure of some success...as is a President's Trophy.

It's simply not true that all teams are equally pathetic.

 

[PaulD]

oh yeah I know, Leafs obviously isnt the only team effected, just saying if the cap were to rise 3m every year like it was pretty much expected they likely could have made some moves over the years alot easier?

I dunno obviously Tavares wasnt a good signing and the results prove that. but it could have maybe been better if not for covid. too bad we will never know,

big move from Dubas most would have done but in the end it was wrong for the team Id be just as happy running Matthews/Kadri and spend the 11m else where. its crazy Tavares was offered more else where too (rumor I believe)


if your going to rip them you might as well do it right, they also have never won 3 series in a single playoff run

its pretty sad how long its been but not many Canadian teams are doing much better at this point. we are all equally pathetic at this point. some have yet to win a cup and its been 30+ years since a Canadian team has won. welcome to the club of being pathetic

equally pathetic? I'm sure Leaf fans like to say so.

A SC final appearance is a measure of some success...as is a President's Trophy.

It's simply not true that all teams are equally pathetic.

leaf fan denial. runs deep

 

[Arthur Morgan]

A SC final appearance is a measure of some success...as is a President's Trophy.

It's simply not true that all teams are equally pathetic.

if your not first your last.

equally pathetic? I'm sure Leaf fans like to say so.


leaf fan denial. runs deep

how long has it been since a Canadian team won again? f***in Gretzky was still playing in the NHL last time. its not great if its not pathetic after this much time then what is it? good prob shouldnt be the answer

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

I dont think that its only because they hate the leafs or dislike Matthews although there is plenty of people where thats the reason,

thats just how I would rank players of any sport. and I think that judging a player on playoff success when its a team sport alone is flawed too.

well I never said I would take Matthews over McDavid or MacKinnon, Marino would prob become a top choice once those guys are gone though.

well 3 out of 4 helps alot more than 1 out of 4. think however you like but playoff success is a combined team effort, I doubt Barkov or Eichel would make much of a difference in Toronto either if they swapped places with Matthews

Sure, there's a few people like that, but there's even more people who don't care about the Leafs. Why would most people care about a team that hasn't won anything since expansion?

I do agree that judging a player based on playoff success alone is flawed. But that's not what happening with Matthews. He's being judged based on the fact that he's 0.87 PPG in the playoffs over his career, behind guys like Scheifele and Zibanejad. For a guy that can put up big regular season numbers and win awards like Matthews, that's simply unacceptable.

Again, I agree that once all the guys who proved that they could win were off the board, someone like Marino would be a top choice. But even among his peer who didn't win, in that second tier, I'd probably take Jim Kelly over Marino.

And I doubt that your opinion about how they might have done matters, but whatever helps you sleep at night.

 

[Chips]

This is dumb. Matthews had 2 assists in the final. He's played well. If the rest of the Americans played like him usa might've won.

And I LOVE shitting on Matthews if it's legitimate criticism.

He looks like Ron Jeremy’s illegitimate son, and should shave his mustache.

 

[Plural]

One SC win with strong playoffs and this will all be forgotten. Yes, he's had bad elimination games so far, but it's still a team game.