Auston Matthews is now 0-7 in winner take all games in his career

[miscs75]

His hairline travels back with every loss

 

[VeteranPresence]

yet when their careers are over Eichel will still be ranked behind Matthews.

No one ranks Marcel Dionne above Bryan Trottier, sorry.

you wouldn't even draft Eichel over Matthews in fantasy leagues. Im sorry if you dislike it but Matthews is the more elite talent no matter the playoff numbers.

Elite regular season talent, sure. But there is more to hockey than that. Matthews now has a proven history as a loser and only winning will shake it.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

No one ranks Marcel Dionne above Bryan Trottier, sorry.



Elite regular season talent, sure. But there is more to hockey than that. Matthews now has a proven history as a loser and only winning will shake it.

so Barkov and Eichel are better than McDavid then where does McDavid place if he never wins?

Matthews will likely have more goals, points and awards. likely more awards than both Eichel and Barkov combined. winning 1 cup wont help Barkov and Eichel the way you think and hope it will.

only 2 years ago Eichel was a locker room cancer and a guy that cant win,

your argument is based off team stats. no single player wins the cup alone, when its all said and done McDavid will likely be in the top 5 even if he never wins a cup. higher if he breaks 2k points

 

[DarrylshutzSydor]

No one ranks Marcel Dionne above Bryan Trottier, sorry.



Elite regular season talent, sure. But there is more to hockey than that. Matthews now has a proven history as a loser and only winning will shake it.

Similar to Dylan Larkin

 

[VeteranPresence]

so Barkov and Eichel are better than McDavid then where does McDavid place if he never wins?

Matthews will likely have more goals, points and awards. likely more awards than both Eichel and Barkov combined. winning 1 cup wont help Barkov and Eichel the way you think and hope it will.

only 2 years ago Eichel was a locker room cancer and a guy that cant win,

your argument is based off team stats. no single player wins the cup alone, when its all said and done McDavid will likely be in the top 5 even if he never wins a cup. higher if he breaks 2k points

0 Cups, 0 SCF appearances, 0 Conn Smythes, 0 goals in do or die games > any colorful excuses. That's that.

 

[onmygameboi]

He probably could've done better to force the pass to the point instead of allowing a pass to the slot, but it's hard to make that read in a split second. Assuming Fox doesn't go for a lap for whatever reason, his positioning was ok-ish. Ideally you want him to get a stick in the passing lane or at least in someway obstruct a clean pass to McDavid, but that's not his assignment. Just a hard adjustment to make in a split second.

If Hughes does challenge Marner there, Marner still might be able to get it to McDavid, but more likely he goes to the point man who gets to walk in freely. At that point McDavid probably slides off towards the right face off circle and still has a grade A scoring opportunity, the pass would be coming from the defender skating down.

Overall I don't blame Hughes on that, Fox for whatever reason leaves his side of the net and his man. Matthews leaves the slot to challenge Marner.

1) Matthews loses the face off
2) Fox goes to the left side, leaving Marner open
3) Matthews leaves the front of the net, to challenge Marner on the boards
4) Goal

Thank you for explaining.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

0 Cups, 0 SCF appearances, 0 Conn Smythes, 0 goals in do or die games > any colorful excuses. That's that.

which only matters so much. 1 Cup or 1 Conn Smythe doesn't trump a career with more goals, points and overall awards. you sound like a LeBron fan trying to argue that he's the greatest

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

Hockey is funny.

Matthews was one 90%-likelihood-goal (and a miraculous Binnington save) away from being the #1 hero of the Four Nations' championship game (with 1 OT goal and 2 assists on three USA goals)... and instead that 10% likelihood save was made and so Matthews is the biggest bum ever.

Yeah but he's always one goal away to be the hero , that's exactly why he's a zero , never does it lol

 

[Arthur Morgan]

Yeah but he's always one goal away to be the hero , that's exactly why he's a zero , never does it lol

I dunno why people are even ripping on him anyways, I feel it has to do with the team he plays for, other players on USA did squat and no one talks about that. no matter the outcome USA/CAN win this thread for Matthews or Marner was popping up

 

[NVious]

and yet he will still place behind Matthews when its all said it done, your one of the odd ones that would.

Barkov has a better argument than Eichel does. its funny how opinions change on a player so quickly, when Eichel was in Buffalo things were much different on him. truth is Vegas have had better overall teams.

Matthews has 150+ more goals than Eichel,
100+ goals more than Barkov and around 70 less points with 150+ less games played
also with less time in the league he has more awards than both Eichel and Barkov combined.

Im sorry but they arent better than Matthews and when its all said and done they will likely both finish behind Matthews.

winning 1 cup doesnt exceed less goals, points and awards

While Matthews is clearly the most talented of the 3, his big game (along with generally poor playoff play) failures at his cost make the other guys more appealing.

In terms of season play it's Matthews all day every day, but in terms of saving 3-3.5 million while taking proven winners vs a guy who has failed spectacularly like Auston, why would anyone take him in the playoffs?

It's a bad time to make this point because his line was the only line that did anything and they easily could've won it in OT, but the point as a whole stands due to AM's cost/failures.

 

[benfranklin]

That leaving the slot move in OT was something.

 

[NVious]

I dunno why people are even ripping on him anyways, I feel it has to do with the team he plays for, other players on USA did squat and no one talks about that. no matter the outcome USA/CAN win this thread for Matthews or Marner was popping up

He's 0-7 in big games, that's atrocious for a guy as talented as him. It's not fair to do it now because he was great in this past game, but 0-6 and 0 goals isn't exactly much better either.

 

[VeteranPresence]

which only matters so much. 1 Cup or 1 Conn Smythe doesn't trump a career with more goals, points and overall awards. you sound like a LeBron fan trying to argue that he's the greatest

Again, 0 Cups, 0 SCF appearances, 0 Conn Smythes, 0 goals in do or die games > any colorful excuses. I know that burns to hear, but this is all that needs to be said until Matthews actually shows up sometime and wins something of significance.

You can keep trying to wax poetic about career value or other stars in other sports (???) but this is pretty simple stuff.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

While Matthews is clearly the most talented of the 3, his big game (along with generally poor playoff play) failures at his cost make the other guys more appealing.

In terms of season play it's Matthews all day every day, but in terms of saving 3-3.5 million while taking proven winners vs a guy who has failed spectacularly like Auston, why would anyone take him in the playoffs?

It's a bad time to make this point because his line was the only line that did anything and they easily could've won it in OT, but the point as a whole stands due to AM's cost/failures.

all I said was 10/10 would want him on their team and some how Eichel and Barkov got brought into it

you could argue it was a USA failure, where was Eichel to save the day if he's so much better? this game was incredibly close and could have gone either way. they lost as a team and Matthews wasn't the only guy on the ice, plays happen very quickly what is he superman? suppose to stop every pass? why didnt anyone else on the team step up and redirect or block McDavid's shot? shit happens its hockey could have been a USA win all the same

 

[Fatass]

Eichel and Barkov arent in the same Tier as Matthews man how exactly are they above or in the same tier so far behind in almost every category. Barkov is slightly ahead in points but with 150+ more games played. you have zero argument to place them above. that one cup doesnt exceed every category

is Toews better than McDavid and MacKinnon because he won 3 cups? no they arent. is Barkov and Eichel better than McDavid or Drai because they won a cup? No they arent and the same goes arguing against Matthews.

Towes was great. But he doesn’t start in the same tier as McKinnon and McDavid.
Matthews starts in the Eichel and McDavid tier. He’s clearly not in the next tier up with McKinnon and McDavid.

 

[koyvoo]

Joe Thornton had two sides to his legacy. He’s seen as one of the greatest playmakers the game has ever seen, a guy who has won Art Ross and Hart trophy, one of the highest point producers of all time, and a guy who played completely below his statism’s abiowhen the games actually mattered and one of the biggest losers in NHL history. None of that is untrue.

But, Matthews time will come. He’s got a lot of career left in him, and he consistently elevates his effort and production in the biggest moments, so it’s only a matter of time.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

Again, 0 Cups, 0 SCF appearances, 0 Conn Smythes, 0 goals in do or die games > any colorful excuses. I know that burns to hear, but this is all that needs to be said until Matthews actually shows up sometime and wins something of significance.

You can keep trying to wax poetic about career value or other stars in other sports (???) but this is pretty simple stuff.

well we will see whos ranked higher when their careers are finished other than that you can say all you like but reality is Matthews is the more elite talent.

80% of the teams they have taken on have gone to the cup final as well. not like the path has always been as easy as some of the other teams. but all of that doesnt matter its a team sport in the end they are judged by everything not just playoff success.

if a player ranks higher in every category other than winning a cup or conn smythe than he's likely to rank higher.

 

[NVious]

all I said was 10/10 would want him on their team and some how Eichel and Barkov got brought into it

you could argue it was a USA failure, where was Eichel to save the day if he's so much better? this game was incredibly close and could have gone either way. they lost as a team and Matthews wasn't the only guy on the ice, plays happen very quickly what is he superman? suppose to stop every pass? why didnt anyone else on the team step up and redirect or block McDavid's shot? shit happens its hockey could have been a USA win all the same

Because we live in a salary cap world, I'd want prime Thornton or any other playoff failure on my team too, just not if he's THE guy and we play in a salary cap world.

I agree it's not fair to do it this game, but Matthews made his bed with his past performances. Whereas you see other top guys carrying their teams to victory or at least coming up clutch, Matthews is nearly a decade into his career and he has one second round game win.

 

[Fatass]

all I said was 10/10 would want him on their team and some how Eichel and Barkov got brought into it

you could argue it was a USA failure, where was Eichel to save the day if he's so much better? this game was incredibly close and could have gone either way. they lost as a team and Matthews wasn't the only guy on the ice, plays happen very quickly what is he superman? suppose to stop every pass? why didnt anyone else on the team step up and redirect or block McDavid's shot? shit happens its hockey could have been a USA win all the same

There’s a big difference between want and can afford. It’s a capped league. Matthews, at his cap, isn’t going to be desired by clubs with already high cost, great centres/players. Teams need to fill out their rosters. Toronto is the perfect example of making that mistake.

 

[Master P]

Do or die game in Boston.

Lets not act surprised.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

which only matters so much. 1 Cup or 1 Conn Smythe doesn't trump a career with more goals, points and overall awards. you sound like a LeBron fan trying to argue that he's the greatest

A career with more regular season goals, points and awards, that doesn't translate into success in the playoffs. You'd think everyone pretending to be a GM around here would want a guy who can win the Richard trophy instead of the Cup.

 

[Tie Domi Esquire]

He finished the tournament with the same amount of goals and 1 more assist than Jordan Binnington.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

Towes was great. But he doesn’t start in the same tier as McKinnon and McDavid.
Matthews starts in the Eichel and McDavid tier. He’s clearly not in the next tier up with McKinnon and McDavid.

Id say Matthews is a tier below McDavid and MacKinnon but in the same tier as Drai,

I think Id rank them something like this

we can argue all day long but we're just going to be going in circles. I think playoff success matters alot but its not a end all conversation. there's more to consider

McDavid
MacKinnon

Drai
Matthews

Eichel
Barkov
Aho

Hischier
Scheifele
Hughes

Larkin
Suzuki

A career with more regular season goals, points and awards, that doesn't translate into success in the playoffs. You'd think everyone pretending to be a GM around here would want a guy who can win the Richard trophy instead of the Cup.

things change quickly. this could be a Leafs problem more than a Matthews issue. what if after this contract Matthews signs somewhere else and wins a cup later in his career? he still has plenty of time left in his career. I dont think he will ever win in Toronto but that doesnt mean he's not a great player

look how everyone viewed Eichel through his time in Buffalo.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

There’s a big difference between want and can afford. It’s a capped league. Matthews, at his cap, isn’t going to be desired by clubs with already high cost, great centres/players. Teams need to fill out their rosters. Toronto is the perfect example of making that mistake.

I guess we will see with how teams manage this extra cap space moving forward with limited players available to sign. every team is going to have alot of cap space. there's speculation that McDavid might become the first player to make 20m a season.

covid didnt help Toronto and their cap issues. the cap never went up through that time. every year the cap rises the % these playerrs sign for lowers. it stayed the same pretty much their entire contracts.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

Because we live in a salary cap world, I'd want prime Thornton or any other playoff failure on my team too, just not if he's THE guy and we play in a salary cap world.

I agree it's not fair to do it this game, but Matthews made his bed with his past performances. Whereas you see other top guys carrying their teams to victory or at least coming up clutch, Matthews is nearly a decade into his career and he has one second round game win.

almost missed this one so many notifications popping lol

with the cap going up as much as it will be you really shouldnt over think that anyways. sure some teams cap strapped cant fit him because of cap issues but if there were no issues and you could just add him 10/10 would 100% I mean if u really wanna break it down team by team its just not possible

lets just say you get Matthews and you send over what you need to make it work. forget about value and if Toronto would accept it. would you add Matthews?