OT: Association Football Thread III (All Soccer Talk Here!)

[bl02]

Spain best team in the world not even close
And this is coming from an Italian fan

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

We marvel at NHL prospects when they shred the WJC's as a double under ager.

Yamal played and cooked in this tournament (at the international pro level) while being 16 in every game except today's.

Will never cease to amaze me. Some people are just born to do certain things.

 

[nyrmetros]

Copa America fiasco....

 

[BroadwayStorm]

They stole Copa America from the Colombians. That was the most one sided and disgusting ref job I have ever seen, Colombia was denied a clear penalty that should have been a second yellow and a red for MacAllister. But I am not shocked as this tourny was always rigged in Argentinas favor.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

We marvel at NHL prospects when they shred the WJC's as a double under ager.

Yamal played and cooked in this tournament (at the international pro level) while being 16 in every game except today's.

Will never cease to amaze me. Some people are just born to do certain things.

Agreed, but in soccer youth is even more of an asset. There are so many hotshot players who are washed up by 27 in that sport , especially if they’re Brazilian

 

[Machinehead]

Agreed, but in soccer youth is even more of an asset. There are so many hotshot players who are washed up by 27 in that sport , especially if they’re Brazilian

Messi is like 60 tho.

I'm so tired of him.

 

[inranger94]

Agreed, but in soccer youth is even more of an asset. There are so many hotshot players who are washed up by 27 in that sport , especially if they’re Brazilian

They play like for 12 months without many breaks especially if you’re on a national team. In hockey they get at least some break.

 

[nyrmetros]

MLS Leagues Cup?

 

[sabremike]

MLS Leagues Cup?

Emirates Cup > Leagues Cup

Garber and his gang of fat and greedy pigs can go kick rocks.

 

[Ben Grimm]

Messi is like 60 tho. I'm so tired of him.

His 37th bday was a month ago.

 

[romba]

So is USMNT going to get a legit coach? I remember when they got Klinnsman all the talk was how they FINALLY went after a real coach from Europe, who knows solid tactics and will develop our guys into studs overseas. Still waiting.

Separate point, every US soccer fan who is hardcore enough to follow the sport overseas complains how US kids have to pay to play and in Europe they don't and this is why our soccer program can't take the next step. This is true, but as far as I know, all our sports are pay to play. My son is playing 10U competitive travel ice hockey and it's a small fortune. Competitive baseball, while cheaper than ice hockey, ain't free either. But somehow we produce world class athletes in other sports that are pay to play, but manage to only produce soccer players who be backups at best on the top world teams. Statistically, we have a ton of kids playing soccer at the youth level, enough that we should theoretically produce at least one or two world classers every decade or so.
I think the larger issue is the lack of pickup soccer games for the youth in the US. Even kids who love soccer seem to prefer playing football, basketball and baseball with their friends when just hanging out. Plenty of kids love soccer in the US and play it in some form of organized fashion, but when it comes to playing sports with buddies, for whatever reason, it's almost always basketball, football, and baseball. Every coming of age story for every world class athlete, regardless of the sport, begins with them talking about how they eat, breathed, and slept around the sport. Finished school? Played 2 hours. Ate dinner and did homework? Played until it was dark. Went to sleep and dreamed about playing. Played before school. Weekends? Played 6+ hours a day. This is how true talents are developed and I just don't see that changing anytime soon here in the US.

/rant

 

[jniklast]

So is USMNT going to get a legit coach? I remember when they got Klinnsman all the talk was how they FINALLY went after a real coach from Europe, who knows solid tactics and will develop our guys into studs overseas. Still waiting.

Separate point, every US soccer fan who is hardcore enough to follow the sport overseas complains how US kids have to pay to play and in Europe they don't and this is why our soccer program can't take the next step. This is true, but as far as I know, all our sports are pay to play. My son is playing 10U competitive travel ice hockey and it's a small fortune. Competitive baseball, while cheaper than ice hockey, ain't free either. But somehow we produce world class athletes in other sports that are pay to play, but manage to only produce soccer players who be backups at best on the top world teams. Statistically, we have a ton of kids playing soccer at the youth level, enough that we should theoretically produce at least one or two world classers every decade or so.
I think the larger issue is the lack of pickup soccer games for the youth in the US. Even kids who love soccer seem to prefer playing football, basketball and baseball with their friends when just hanging out. Plenty of kids love soccer in the US and play it in some form of organized fashion, but when it comes to playing sports with buddies, for whatever reason, it's almost always basketball, football, and baseball. Every coming of age story for every world class athlete, regardless of the sport, begins with them talking about how they eat, breathed, and slept around the sport. Finished school? Played 2 hours. Ate dinner and did homework? Played until it was dark. Went to sleep and dreamed about playing. Played before school. Weekends? Played 6+ hours a day. This is how true talents are developed and I just don't see that changing anytime soon here in the US.

/rant

The worldwide talent pool of soccer is vastly bigger than baseball or ice-hockey and even basketball. So I don't think it's really comparable. Producing world class talent is just much harder when it's really all the world playing a sport.

 

[Synergy27]

The worldwide talent pool of soccer is vastly bigger than baseball or ice-hockey and even basketball. So I don't think it's really comparable. Producing world class talent is just much harder when it's really all the world playing a sport.

This is an interesting thought, but it still doesn’t explain how much smaller talent pools consistently turn out superstars. Argentina and Spain have like 1/8 of our population.

 

[inranger94]

Soccer is like a religion in those top countries. It’s by far a number one sports in those countries. In US, it’s a different story. So many other ones to choose from

I don’t see many kids playing on streets here

 

[jniklast]

Soccer is like a religion in those top countries. It’s by far a number one sports in those countries. In US, it’s a different story. So many other ones to choose from

I don’t see many kids playing on streets here

Yeah, in those countries, most of the talented athletes will try to make it as a soccer player, while in the US most will try to make it to the NFL.
And then that pay-to-play further shallows the pool. In the big soccer nations, pretty much every kid can play in a club, no matter how much their parents make. It's even that soccer is seen as "the way out" of poverty for many kids and as such so many play it.
I think a general problem is just the way American professional sports are set up. In Europe and elsewhere the professional clubs try to develop their own talent. And that goes down to the lower leagues. In the end there are clubs in every bigger town (or even some in small villages) that look for talent in their region and are often even ready to pay for expenses. That way the most talented kids get the best training from an early age. And for pretty much free.

 

[romba]

The worldwide talent pool of soccer is vastly bigger than baseball or ice-hockey and even basketball. So I don't think it's really comparable. Producing world class talent is just much harder when it's really all the world playing a sport.

True but...

...it still doesn’t explain how much smaller talent pools consistently turn out superstars. Argentina and Spain have like 1/8 of our population.

^^^This. Our population is way larger than the individual populations of nearly all of the top tier countries. I think it comes back to the general culture.

Yeah, in those countries, most of the talented athletes will try to make it as a soccer player, while in the US most will try to make it to the NFL.
And then that pay-to-play further shallows the pool. In the big soccer nations, pretty much every kid can play in a club, no matter how much their parents make. It's even that soccer is seen as "the way out" of poverty for many kids and as such so many play it.
I think a general problem is just the way American professional sports are set up. In Europe and elsewhere the professional clubs try to develop their own talent. And that goes down to the lower leagues. In the end there are clubs in every bigger town (or even some in small villages) that look for talent in their region and are often even ready to pay for expenses. That way the most talented kids get the best training from an early age. And for pretty much free.

This is also a large part of it. If you find and nurture a soccer talent in the big soccer countries, do the clubs get to keep them for x number of professional years before they can hit the transfer pool? That's a huge incentive to find and grow top talents. I know the MLS academies are trying something similar here but I doubt it's even close to the sophistication of European clubs.

Again, the pay to play thing though is a moot point because all sports are pay to play in the US. No one is dropping soccer because they have to pay when the cost for baseball or football is similar. Scholarship-wise there are definitely way more opportunities for baseball, football, basketball and even hockey but H.S./College level is already too late to try to catch and grow the best talent.

 

[jniklast]

True but...

^^^This. Our population is way larger than the individual populations of nearly all of the top tier countries. I think it comes back to the general culture.

This is also a large part of it. If you find and nurture a soccer talent in the big soccer countries, do the clubs get to keep them for x number of professional years before they can hit the transfer pool? That's a huge incentive to find and grow top talents. I know the MLS academies are trying something similar here but I doubt it's even close to the sophistication of European clubs.

If you develop a talent, you will have it under contract and can sell them whenever you want. Of course the player has to agree as well, but usually, if it makes sense for both sides, that should not be a problem. So every club has an incentive to develop talented players, either to play for them or to make make money.

Again, the pay to play thing though is a moot point because all sports are pay to play in the US. No one is dropping soccer because they have to pay when the cost for baseball or football is similar. Scholarship-wise there are definitely way more opportunities for baseball, football, basketball and even hockey but H.S./College level is already too late to try to catch and grow the best talent.

No one might drop soccer because of the other sports, but how many drop it (or don't even start) because they can't afford it? That's a lot of potential talent not being used at all. And it might be true for the other sports as well, but again, it's easier to produce world class talent in a sport that is only popular in a handful of nations.

 

[nyrmetros]

USMNT at all levels is so frustrating.

 

[nyr2k2]

Way to go, Ladies.

 

[nyrmetros]

World Soccer Shop. Com has 35% off USA jerseys.

 

[Synergy27]

Poch to coach team USA? Wow. Talk about an upgrade.

 

[JCProdigy]

Poch to coach team USA? Wow. Talk about an upgrade.

Coaching the USMNT is going to be like a mix of his previous positions.

The mix of talent as that of Southampton/Tottenham...
...and the dysfunction of Chelsea.

 

[nyrmetros]

Huge win by Denver over Club America!