Around the NHL Thread - Found the Missing #16

[Lunatik]

Proof Seravalli never actually watched the Flames

 

[Bryanbryoil]

@Bryanbryoil

As long as there is no trolling intent or flaming, people can post wherever they want. If anyone takes issue with my moderating they are free to file a complaint.

 

[crackdown44]

30+ scouts at the Montreal-Buffalo game tonight. Two from the Flames apparently

 

[DCDM]

30+ scouts at the Montreal-Buffalo game tonight. Two from the Flames apparently

Something something Paul Byron???????????

 

[crackdown44]

Something something Paul Byron???????????

They suspect ristolainen for everybody since he’s on the market

I think a guy like Armia would be a low key cheap add for us

 

[Lunatik]

As long as there is no trolling intent or flaming, people can post wherever they want. If anyone takes issue with my moderating they are free to file a complaint.

I can attest to this. I've posted on HFoil without incident.

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

Neal sucks.

 

[Anglesmith]

Why shouldn't Neal get PP time there? According to TSN too Neal only got something like 16 minutes total PP time in Calgary with Gaudreau and Monahan.

Why sign a guy for 5 years if that's going to be your usage of him?

They signed him for 5 years assuming a certain level of play, didn't see that level of play, and adjusted quickly in order to win games. That's really all there is to it. It didn't matter to the Flames who was doing the scoring, as their goal was to score as much as possible as a team. They weren't willing to compromise the team in order to pump on individual's stats. A PP going 5-for-30 with Neal scoring three of them was seen as worse than a PP going 9-for-30 without Neal scoring any.

Seravalli is jumping the gun big-time in writing his article, as we need to see whether this was just a bad night for the Isles, or if these goals are going to keep going in for Neal long-term. Unless he is playing a distinctly different game than in Calgary, he won't be able to be in the offensive zone enough to keep scoring.

Also, you made a claim and were shown to be incorrect. Don't immediately move the goalposts without first addressing that.

 

[Mobiandi]

I think he lacked accountability, and blamed all of his struggles on the team, without ever once acknowledging that he was bringing nothing to the team while on the ice.

There were multiple times throughout tue season where Neal took responsibility for his play in interviews. This is literally from the first article I found:

James and I had discussions during the year, we had a long discussion (Monday), and I would say James is very accountable,” said Flames general manager Brad Treliving. “Listen, when we signed James last year, I don’t think it takes a rocket scientist to sit up here and say this is not exactly how we projected things to go. James didn’t sign here to be a scratch in Game 5 of the first round.

Gilbertson: Flames’ Neal vows to be better after disappointing first season with Flames

Everyone here knows that Treliving often uses a lot of words to say nothing of substance and talks funny when it comes to discussing specific rumours. But I've never suspected him to lie about a team or person's character traits, like when it was called into question after the Ducks sweep.

And honestly, it's not like Lucic was going anywhere if we decided to give Neal another shot this season. He wasn't going to magically put it together and return to his Bruins form this season. I think it goes much deeper than the possibility of getting another Brouwer where something was said in the summer.

We're seeing right now that there's a noticeable hole in our top 6 RW now that Frolik's aged. Neal rebounding in the top 6 could have fixed that. Like if the Kadri trade went through and moved Backlund down to #3C (even if I didn't like the trade) or trying Lindholm out.

 

[Anglesmith]

There were multiple times throughout tue season where Neal took responsibility for his play in interviews. This is literally from the first article I found:


Gilbertson: Flames’ Neal vows to be better after disappointing first season with Flames

Everyone here knows that Treliving often uses a lot of words to say nothing of substance and talks funny when it comes to discussing specific rumours. But I've never suspected him to lie about a team or person's character traits, like when it was called into question after the Ducks sweep.

And honestly, it's not like Lucic was going anywhere if we decided to give Neal another shot this season. He wasn't going to magically put it together and return to his Bruins form this season. I think it goes much deeper than the possibility of getting another Brouwer where something was said in the summer.

We're seeing right now that there's a noticeable hole in our top 6 RW now that Frolik's aged. Neal rebounding in the top 6 could have fixed that. Like if the Kadri trade went through and moved Backlund down to #3C (even if I didn't like the trade) or trying Lindholm out.

I was referring more to what Neal himself has said to the media. Everything I've heard about the guy seems to indicate that he is a good dude, yes, and I'm sure that in conversations with Treliving, he presents the best version of himself. That said, in every interview where he could express accountability, he typically tosses in an excuse or two as well. And since he was traded, he cranked that to max. In that article you posted there, while talking about wanting to be better, he throws in the fact that he "didn't have time to train" in the summer because of all the success he'd had. That's such an eye-rolling thing to hear as a fan.

Putting together the body of evidence, what appears clear is that Neal mailed it in the prior off-season, complained the entire season about not being given an extended stay on a line he was dragging down, and then had the management do damage control until they finally rid themselves of him.

Since the trade, we've heard that things were extremely tense in the room, and this was a player that the Flames could essentially not afford to bring back into the locker-room. The fact that they were willing to take on a contract that Flames brass obviously realized was bad, and take on a player who is clearly capable of no more than grit and a bottom-six role, lends major credence to that. This trade doesn't happen if conversations were as positive as they were alleging. The Flames absolutely know that they can go out and get a heavy bottom-sixer for cheap. They specifically made the move that got rid of Neal.

The hole at RW has been a thing with this team since Iginla was traded. Our 2015 run had Hudler at 1RW and .... someone... at 2RW above David Jones. I don't really remember who that was, to be honest. Maybe Joe Colborne.

They tried to address it twice through free agency by getting guys past their primes. It simply hasn't worked. Neal rebounding in the top 6 could have fixed that, but unless he's done a complete 180 as a player, it isn't going to happen outside of a lucky night here and there. It is much more likely to be addressed via a big trade (aka Lindholm) or from within (aka Mangiapane). If Mangiapane plays like he did Tuesday night, our top six will be fine. On the other hand, if every team plays the Oilers like the Islanders did Tuesday night, we'll be annoyed even if we're winning too.

 

[DFF]

Neal can't generate his own offense and on the flames only Johnny is great at creating offense for others. Neal can't play with Johnny so he is useless.

Also anybody notice, rnh is shooting blank right now with Neal on his line? Lmao..

 

[Volica]

30+ scouts at the Montreal-Buffalo game tonight. Two from the Flames apparently

Calgary doesn't play Buffalo until the end of next month, or Montreal until December; this won't be team scouting.
Couple Pro scouts probably.

Sabres could use a good hand like Brodie on the backend... but man, I don't really see much from either team that really moves the needle all that much, being honest.

 

[InfinityIggy]

Calgary doesn't play Buffalo until the end of next month, or Montreal until December; this won't be team scouting.
Couple Pro scouts probably.

Sabres could use a good hand like Brodie on the backend... but man, I don't really see much from either team that really moves the needle all that much, being honest.

Teams are looking at Risto, I would wager.

 

[Volica]

Teams are looking at Risto, I would wager.

He doesn't really fit our team though, right?

 

[InfinityIggy]

He doesn't really fit our team though, right?

No, I would agree he doesn't. Maybe we are looking at Paul Byron

 

[crackdown44]

Calgary doesn't play Buffalo until the end of next month, or Montreal until December; this won't be team scouting.
Couple Pro scouts probably.

Sabres could use a good hand like Brodie on the backend... but man, I don't really see much from either team that really moves the needle all that much, being honest.

They’re currently running Ristolainen-Miller-Jokiharju down the right side with Bogosian and Montour both out injured

I mean Brodie is better than most of those guys but it wouldn’t help their logjam situation at all. Also their biggest need is probably 2nd line C/RW much like ours so I can’t really see a fit

 

[Calculon]

Eh, if anything (and it's probably nothing), I'd guess they're still looking at moving Frolik. He's already back on the fourth line and that was the source of a lot of the trouble with him (or rather his agent) last year. Him or Jankowski, who's playing like a young guy who's having trouble getting over the fact that the team essentially traded him over the summer. Could see the Canadiens interested in him.

And the Flames can't move a defencemen without another coming back. The depth just isn't there.

 

[Fig]

They’re currently running Ristolainen-Miller-Jokiharju down the right side with Bogosian and Montour both out injured

I mean Brodie is better than most of those guys but it wouldn’t help their logjam situation at all. Also their biggest need is probably 2nd line C/RW much like ours so I can’t really see a fit

Brodie + Frolik + X for Risto

....

I don't completely get why Treliving would want to do this though. It's really shaky and with a few logical leaps it kinda makes sense, but straight up, doesn't make sense to me.

 

[crackdown44]

Why are the ducks good again. Make it stop

 

[Turning Mangiapanese]

Why are the ducks good again. Make it stop

Would be kind of amusing to see Eakins lead them to the playoffs and win the Jack Adams though.

 

[McFlyingV]

Neal can't generate his own offense and on the flames only Johnny is great at creating offense for others. Neal can't play with Johnny so he is useless.

Also anybody notice, rnh is shooting blank right now with Neal on his line? Lmao..

Doesn't really have much to do with Neal. RNH has hit 3 posts and just hasn't had the bounces. Neal certainly isn't worse than any of the line mates RNH had last year at 5v5.

 

[DFF]

Doesn't really have much to do with Neal. RNH has hit 3 posts and just hasn't had the bounces. Neal certainly isn't worse than any of the line mates RNH had last year at 5v5.

Point is Neal needs superstars to be really successful, McDavid, Malkin etc

Flames only have one and he cant work with him. That's why it doesnt work. Average or below average guys like RNH, Backlund, Jankowski...etc are nt going to help him much.

 

[McFlyingV]

Point is Neal needs superstars to be really successful, McDavid, Malkin etc

Flames only have one and he cant work with him. That's why it doesnt work. Average or below average guys like RNH, Backlund, Jankowski...etc are nt going to help him much.

I don't disagree, albeit I think RNH is a step above Backlund offensively to the point where Neal should be able to put up decent second line production with an added bump from being on the PP with McDrai.

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

Neal will cool off, inevitably. He will get bumped down because he’s a liability and then he will pout and quit on his team. If Neal is so good, why does he bounce around from team to team every couple of seasons? It’s because his attitude is terrible and his teammates don’t like him.

 

[Dack]

Dougie Hamilton looks primed for a huge season. I can't believe Carolina was playing Faulk over him prior to this season lol.

Against NYI 4 shots 1 5v5 goal 1 5v5 primary assist. 92% score adjusted xgf% and finished +3. 7 points and 3 goals in 5 games.