Around the NHL 2024-25 regular season Part II - The holidays are upon us

[NJDfan86]

How not? Signing bonuses are taxed at the person’s living location and not state the team plays in, so I would imagine deferred compensation will be the same.

So if I go from a high income tax state to a no income tax state, my tax savings should be pretty large on a raw basis.

He gets upfront signing bonuses in his contract, this is deferred salary he earned by playing hockey in CA - while I do not believe they CURRENTLY have a way to prevent that (other than tolling the Ducks for his $$$), given the frequency these deferrals are propping up in CA contracts its likely the state will clarify that they will be taxed at CA's rate.

Just what the Rangers needed - to get slower and worse defensively!

 

[Devils731]

He gets upfront signing bonuses in his contract, this is deferred salary he earned by playing hockey in CA - while I do not believe they CURRENTLY have a way to prevent that (other than tolling the Ducks for his $$$), given the frequency these deferrals are propping up in CA contracts its likely the state will clarify that they will be taxed at CA's rate.

I’ll see if I can dig up some articles but i believe signing bonuses are taxed by where you live and not the state you play.

If you’re saying the state may fight this, I’m not sure, did any state fight and win this for signing bonuses? If not, then I don’t think the states think they can win that fight.

About half his hockey playing doesn’t take place in California, which may be where these cases become difficult to win.

 

[My3Sons]

Aren’t there other limitations on the taxes for athletes? Only half the games are played in the home state and some other jurisdictions have traveling athlete taxes and in the US aren’t state taxes deductible from your federal income taxes and these athletes spend months away from the state where they get paid for playing which may have some impact as well? Beyond that I’ve heard interviews with several NBA agents who have downplayed the impact of state taxes implying there are legal ways to minimize them. I’m guessing you set up an LLC in a no tax state and have your payments sent there?

Edit - this isn’t legal advice and I’m specifically saying it is a guess on my part. Please consult your local tax professional for all tax advice. I’m not a tax attorney.

 

[MasterofGrond]

It is certainly less of a big deal than people make it out to be. Half the games are taxed in other jurisdictions, which has a minimal difference based on who you play for. Signing bonuses are taxed in your state of residence, not where you play. In some places (Canada) there are legal tax dodges through complex financial instruments.

It's absolutely overblown in general as to why players sign where they do, and for the contracts they do.

 

[Devils731]

It is certainly less of a big deal than people make it out to be. Half the games are taxed in other jurisdictions, which has a minimal difference based on who you play for. Signing bonuses are taxed in your state of residence, not where you play. In some places (Canada) there are legal tax dodges through complex financial instruments.

It's absolutely overblown in general as to why players sign where they do, and for the contracts they do.

But also not nothing, getting all your money as a signing bonus in a no tax income state as opposed to game salary may allow you to keep 7-8% more of your money.

On $25 million, that may be $2 million extra dollars in your pocket.

 

[NJDfan86]

I’ll see if I can dig up some articles but i believe signing bonuses are taxed by where you live and not the state you play.

If you’re saying the state may fight this, I’m not sure, did any state fight and win this for signing bonuses? If not, then I don’t think the states think they can win that fight.

About half his hockey playing doesn’t take place in California, which may be where these cases become difficult to win.

Again, I am discussing this from a policy perspective - the flourish of these deals in the last 12 months by the Dodgers creates dilemma for the state, I expect that they will clarify that deferred compensation in a contract is taxable income earned from working in the state.

They aren't doing anything now, but how many millions in revenue to you expect them to pass up when they can collect it from millionaires?

 

[NJDfan86]

Rangers claimed Kaliyev lol

This is a worthwhile gamble for the Rangers and also seemingly a good bet to have a situation where the coach and player won’t like working together.

But maybe that’s what Kaliyev needs, we will see.

Just what the Rangers needed, to get slower and worse defensively!

 

[Devils731]

Again, I am discussing this from a policy perspective - the flourish of these deals in the last 12 months by the Dodgers creates dilemma for the state, I expect that they will clarify that deferred compensation in a contract is taxable income earned from working in the state.

They aren't doing anything now, but how many millions in revenue to you expect them to pass up when they can collect it from millionaires?

I don’t know, but they haven’t done it in the past so I’m not sure they think they have a path to succeed at it.

All I can do is look at the present.

My Roth IRA could have the rules changed and become taxable on withdrawal during my retirement but I don’t have any indication there is a change coming so I’m not currently begging the question.

 

[NJDfan86]

I don’t know, but they haven’t done it in the past so I’m not sure they think they have a path to succeed at it.

All I can do is look at the present.

My Roth IRA could have the rules changed and become taxable on withdrawal during my retirement but I don’t have any indication there is a change coming so I’m not currently begging the question.

I think the Dodgers handing out over $1B in deferred compensation in the state of CA in the last 12 months sparking changes or clarifications is a little more than just speculative.

 

[My3Sons]

Again, I am discussing this from a policy perspective - the flourish of these deals in the last 12 months by the Dodgers creates dilemma for the state, I expect that they will clarify that deferred compensation in a contract is taxable income earned from working in the state.

They aren't doing anything now, but how many millions in revenue to you expect them to pass up when they can collect it from millionaires?

That's going to be tough to enforce. He hasn't gotten the money yet and there is no guarantee he will (as a practical matter I know he will but in theory the league could fold) so they can't tax him now. Well they could but I'm skeptical that would hold up in court. So once he retires he moves away. I don't see a non-california jurisdiction extraditing him back to California if they try to tax him in later years after he retires. Would be an interesting case actually. I know in community property there are rules about money earned predivorce that isn't paid until after the petition is filed but I can't recall the details right now or if that would apply in a taxing environment if California wanted to argue the money was earned when he signed the deal or at least played it out in California as opposed to when the money is paid after he retires.

 

[Desert Devil]

Good news for us here in Phoenix. At least it’s a start lol

 

[My3Sons]

Good news for us here in Phoenix. At least it’s a start lol

So who will own the team and will they fix whatever problems the Coyotes suffered from? I know the league has a soft spot for Arizona but I presume they will want a setup that will work this time.

 

[NJDfan86]

That's going to be tough to enforce. He hasn't gotten the money yet and there is no guarantee he will (as a practical matter I know he will but in theory the league could fold) so they can't tax him now. Well they could but I'm skeptical that would hold up in court. So once he retires he moves away. I don't see a non-california jurisdiction extraditing him back to California if they try to tax him in later years after he retires. Would be an interesting case actually. I know in community property there are rules about money earned predivorce that isn't paid until after the petition is filed but I can't recall the details right now or if that would apply in a taxing environment if California wanted to argue the money was earned when he signed the deal or at least played it out in California as opposed to when the money is paid after he retires.

#notlegaladvice - for sure I don’t think there is any recourse now.

It’s certainly an interesting situation- won’t go deeper since its rearing more into politics than I wish to on a forum.

 

[Desert Devil]

So who will own the team and will they fix whatever problems the Coyotes suffered from? I know the league has a soft spot for Arizona but I presume they will want a setup that will work this time.

Not positive but hopefully they get their shit together and figure it out. It makes the most sense it would be the Ishbia’s. They own the Suns and the Mercury. Both play at the Footprint Center in downtown Phoenix. They apparently wanted nothing to do with the Coyotes but I’m pretty sure they mentioned something about being interested in a new team. Footprint Center is old but it has been renovated. Maybe they could figure out a new arena deal for the both of them to share. Hopefully they can make something work together.

 

[TheBeerNerd]

So did Rempe get demoted to Hartford with the Kaliyev claim?

 

[My3Sons]

So did Rempe get demoted to Hartford with the Kaliyev claim?

Isn't he still suspended?

 

[TheBeerNerd]

Isn't he still suspended?

He's eligible to come back against us.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

He's eligible to come back against us.

no, once he gets sent down, his NHL suspension pauses. Whenever he is called back up, he then needs to sit one more game.

 

[TheUnseenHand]

no, once he gets sent down, his NHL suspension pauses. Whenever he is called back up, he then needs to sit one more game.

I mean, if they bring him back up before the game today he would still be eligible to play against us.

 

[Devils731]

Kreider apparently has had a bad back for weeks and his scratch against the Devils wasn’t all that healthy.

Also relevant to the Rempe talk.

 

[TheBeerNerd]

Oh. Hell. No.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

well I guess MacDermid plays on Thursday

 

[Saugus]

Rempe doesn’t scare me that much. I don’t want to see him take a run at one of our players, but he is unlikely to be a major factor in the game while sitting in the box longer than his actual TOI. That is, if he doesn’t get tossed immediately due to goonery again.

The bigger news is that Kreider is injured. Should make it much easier for us to trounce the Rangers again.

Personally, I’m hoping we beat them so bad that Drury makes another panic trade and unloads more of their promising players, rather than the guys who are actually the problem.

 

[TheBeerNerd]

Rempe doesn’t scare me that much.

Why not? It's damn near a guarantee that he's going to physically harm one of our players, probably through being a dirtbag on the boards because that's his only tactic. All he needs is five minutes TOI to do it, too. That breakdown of his games someone tweeted after his last suspension is damning- 22 games played, thrown out of four of them, has been suspended for more games on the NHL level than he's played. He's not even a good fighter or hitter. Blatantly injuring the opposing team is all he does and that's the only reason he gets any amount of time. We all know it.

Tom Wilson broke Jimmy Dolan's brain so hard that he thinks that the only option is to get headhunters. At least Trouba understood that the league tends to look the other way on open-ice hits. Rempe can't even do that, because he's a stupid thug.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

yeah no shit lol