Around the League Thread | Ixnay on Zerplanyay

[Reverend Mayhem]

Meanwhile a guy who helped cover up a sexual assault gets his ass re-hired immediately after his suspension is done. Unreal.

I was an idealist when I was a child. Nothing in this world surprises me anymore.

 

[EpochLink]

Still blows my mind that Gillis, after taking over a team that missed the playoffs, was black listed from the league after 2 president's trophies, 5 division titles, playoffs in 5 of 6 years, and a run to game 7 of the finals.

All because he's a bit prickly to deal with on the media side, and probably demanded a lot from ownership in order to get results/run the ship his way.

Meanwhile a guy who helped cover up a sexual assault gets his ass re-hired immediately after his suspension is done. Unreal.

If Stan Bowman didn’t have his daddies nepotism he would be running a Church’s Chicken in Burnaby.

 

[StreetHawk]

Just in this market, guys like Botchford and Jeff Patterson were/are actual 'reporters' who are trying to find information and stories for their consumers and not just putting on Canucks-approved stuff. Tony Gallagher was a reporter.

But they're fewer and farther in between and so many more guys just track toward being IMacs and Dhaliwals.

Rick Westhead puts out only a limited quantity of stories each year because it takes so much time to fact find and confirm details for accuracy. In this social media, instant access age, that's hard to do unless you are backed by a major media company like he is with TSN.

 

[M2Beezy]

Gross. That's the kind of combo @M2Beezy would experiment with.

Ketchup should be outlawed

 

[valkynax]

Many Oilers fans outraged by this as well.

Hiring a piece of shit makes the organization look morally bankrupt. If they think this is the best move, then they lose any and all rights to bitch about the well-deserved hatred from the entire NHL fanbase.

 

[VanillaCoke]

peaked at scf gm seven loss, then hired bowman, f em just sit back and watch the inevitable decline.

 

[Bojack Horvatman]

Ketchup should be outlawed

The only thing I have ketchup on anymore is hot dogs. I dont put it on fries or burgers anymore. I just find it so sweet and it overpowers everything. I now douse my burgers in hot sauce.

 

[Reverend Mayhem]

Gonna be a trip to see a Kovalenko in an Avs jersey this year possibly...

 

[Mr. Canucklehead]

Many Oilers fans outraged by this as well.

Hiring a piece of shit makes the organization look morally bankrupt. If they think this is the best move, then they lose any and all rights to bitch about the well-deserved hatred from the entire NHL fanbase.

Yeah, this isn't a "let's dunk on the Oilers for hiring a bad GM, haha" moment.

This is a "JFC, these people shouldn't be anywhere near the game of hockey, its a bad moment for the sport, and even their own god damned fans know it" moment.

 

[Jyrki]

Bowman rode Dale Tallon's team then when it was time to reload he bungled badly, very badly. Between the '10 and '15 runs, the core and even most of the good supporting cast were Tallon guys... an old Brad Richards was the best of Bowman's bunch for the Cup runs - even Hossa was still a Tallon signing. Then when he finally landed a big fish in Panarin, he ended up trading him for Saad... which he had traded years earlier for Anisimov. The guy played with house money for years and the moment he didn't have a stacked deck the franchise took a nosedive.

That's just considering all the upwards failures that should've made it hard for Bowman to return to an NHL front office. I'm sure there were plenty of candidates who didn't also participate in a sexual assault coverup of one of their own players.

Which goes to show just how far you can get by being part of the Old Boys' Club. The Gillis parallels are spot on, one was tossed to the curb the moment he trended downwards and the other is only held back by the rules from being employed by an organization performing on ice. You even got to feel for Jeff Jackson who I think made some great moves with limited options to make the Oilers an actual contender and landed some good targets to run it back, but now he has to make way for a crime-abetting bozo who only gets brought in when the table is set for him.

 

[Hit the post]

The only thing I have ketchup on anymore is hot dogs.

 

[geebster]

So many Oilers fans taking the side of "Bowman didn't do anything that bad". I don't like a few of em but I never thought some of those posters would defend allowing sexual abuse. Some lines shouldn't be crossed even if you have to call out your own side. If your morals bend to justify whatever your team or side does, you don't have morals.

 

[StreetHawk]

Bowman rode Dale Tallon's team then when it was time to reload he bungled badly, very badly. Between the '10 and '15 runs, the core and even most of the good supporting cast were Tallon guys... an old Brad Richards was the best of Bowman's bunch for the Cup runs - even Hossa was still a Tallon signing. Then when he finally landed a big fish in Panarin, he ended up trading him for Saad... which he had traded years earlier for Anisimov. The guy played with house money for years and the moment he didn't have a stacked deck the franchise took a nosedive.

Tallon was the GM when they were terrible. Same with Patrick in Pitt getting all of those high picks. In TB, It was Feester, Lawton during the time they got Stamkos and Hedman. In Col, Sherman from 2009-2014.

Only Lombardi was the GM of LA to draft DD, when they were terrible who was still GM when they won their Cups. GM during the bad years unlikely to still be around when the club turns it around.

 

[EpochLink]

So many Oilers fans taking the side of "Bowman didn't do anything that bad". I don't like a few of em but I never thought some of those posters would defend allowing sexual abuse. Some lines shouldn't be crossed even if you have to call out your own side. If your morals bend to justify whatever your team or side does, you don't have morals.

There are Oilers fans who are upset with this, the ones defending this hire as ass water.

 

[Bubbles]

Still blows my mind that Gillis, after taking over a team that missed the playoffs, was black listed from the league after 2 president's trophies, 5 division titles, playoffs in 5 of 6 years, and a run to game 7 of the finals.

All because he's a bit prickly to deal with on the media side, and probably demanded a lot from ownership in order to get results/run the ship his way.

Meanwhile a guy who helped cover up a sexual assault gets his ass re-hired immediately after his suspension is done. Unreal.

For a minute there, @EpochLink, I thought we would have to go down the Gillis argument once again on this forum. I'm getting old and tired, I just don't have the energy lol.

 

[Jyrki]

Tallon was the GM when they were terrible. Same with Patrick in Pitt getting all of those high picks. In TB, It was Feester, Lawton during the time they got Stamkos and Hedman. In Col, Sherman from 2009-2014.

Only Lombardi was the GM of LA to draft DD, when they were terrible who was still GM when they won their Cups. GM during the bad years unlikely to still be around when the club turns it around.

Wasn't just the high picks that Tallon brought on board, though. Keith, Crawford, Hjalmarsson, Bolland, Bickell, Byfuglien, Kruger and Niemi were all later picks who came up within the organization. Sharp, Ladd and Versteeg came through value-added trades. Then big fish signings like Brian Campbell and Hossa as well. Laying it out like this, the Hawks actually had pretty insane organization depth notwithstanding them drafting Toews/Kane/Seabrook high.

 

[MarkusNaslund19]

I think it's good that society has caught up to actually giving a shit about abuse and trauma so I'm glad that there is public accountability finally for this stuff.

On the other hand, we don't know how involved he was with that situation directly, and a lot of people are (and were) completely unprepared, ignorant, and clueless when it comes to how to handle something so grotesque and exploitative.
Add the toxic masculinity aspects of 'how could this happen to a man?' (which is completely ignorant and hurtful, and is lessening as a perspective, but still present) adds further to the cloudiness.

If he was directly involved in the reference letter for Aldrich, while having full knowledge of his transgressions, then I'm not sure how one can redeem themselves from that.

On the other hand, we don't know how he has been spending his time and energy in the past several years. A lot of these hockey guys (players and execs) are incredibly good at one thing and completely stunted intellectually and emotionally in a variety of ways.
IF he has actually, earnestly learned humbly and taken full accountability for his actions, including reaching out for forgiveness to Beach, etc etc. Then I'm not one who thinks he needs to be punished in perpetuity AS LONG AS there is genuine reflection and improvement, not ticking a box to make yourself employable.

I just think it's really easy to moralize from afar while forgetting that these are people and that there needs to be a space for improvement and forgiveness when the improvement is humble, vulnerable, and authentic.

Now, do any of these factors exist? I'm not sure. I may not be aware of a variety of details that are publicly accessible as I choose not to closely follow a topic that touches close to some of my work.

And without knowing Bowman personally or professionally I can't speculate on whether he IS worthy of a second chance. But I do think that in a vacuum, someone CAN be worthy of a second chance even after wreaking havoc through horrendous ignorance.
-
That said, this looks terrible on the Oilers. They live in such a shithole that the only way to get 'high value' employees seems to be to buy off their own HR. Perry, Kane, now Bowman. There's a pretty ugly pattern here that makes them look terrible and exceedingly easy to root against.

 

[StreetHawk]

Wasn't just the high picks that Tallon brought on board, though. Keith, Crawford, Hjalmarsson, Bolland, Bickell, Byfuglien, Kruger and Niemi were all later picks who came up within the organization. Sharp, Ladd and Versteeg came through value-added trades. Then big fish signings like Brian Campbell and Hossa as well. Laying it out like this, the Hawks actually had pretty insane organization depth notwithstanding them drafting Toews/Kane/Seabrook high.

Certainly. To have team capable of going on runs for multiple years, you need more than your top picks to make it. LA, used Simmons, later firsts, Schenn to get Carter/Richards. Voynov, Martinez, King, Nolan, etc. TB with Point, Circelli, Ross, Vasi, etc.

That's why Van is kind of limited since they don't have much after round 1 of their own guys. Hogs and Demko from within.

 

[valkynax]

Yeah, this isn't a "let's dunk on the Oilers for hiring a bad GM, haha" moment.

This is a "JFC, these people shouldn't be anywhere near the game of hockey, its a bad moment for the sport, and even their own god damned fans know it" moment.

I think it's not unfair to say that this is beyond hockey. Beyond the banter and rivalry between us and Edmonton, we have people from both side saying it is a bad idea to hiring this vile human garbage.

And again, I am VERY happy to see so many Edmonton fans displaying their disgust at this decision, this makes me see the people beyond the hockey fans, people with moral integrity and sense of what's right and wrong.

F*** Bowman, f*** that fat douche Seravelli, and f*** all the people who support this.

 

[Mr. Canucklehead]

I think it's good that society has caught up to actually giving a shit about abuse and trauma so I'm glad that there is public accountability finally for this stuff.

On the other hand, we don't know how involved he was with that situation directly, and a lot of people are (and were) completely unprepared, ignorant, and clueless when it comes to how to handle something so grotesque and exploitative.
Add the toxic masculinity aspects of 'how could this happen to a man?' (which is completely ignorant and hurtful, and is lessening as a perspective, but still present) adds further to the cloudiness.

If he was directly involved in the reference letter for Aldrich, while having full knowledge of his transgressions, then I'm not sure how one can redeem themselves from that.

On the other hand, we don't know how he has been spending his time and energy in the past several years. A lot of these hockey guys (players and execs) are incredibly good at one thing and completely stunted intellectually and emotionally in a variety of ways.
IF he has actually, earnestly learned humbly and taken full accountability for his actions, including reaching out for forgiveness to Beach, etc etc. Then I'm not one who thinks he needs to be punished in perpetuity AS LONG AS there is genuine reflection and improvement, not ticking a box to make yourself employable.

I just think it's really easy to moralize from afar while forgetting that these are people and that there needs to be a space for improvement and forgiveness when the improvement is humble, vulnerable, and authentic.

Now, do any of these factors exist? I'm not sure. I may not be aware of a variety of details that are publicly accessible as I choose not to closely follow a topic that touches close to some of my work.

And without knowing Bowman personally or professionally I can't speculate on whether he IS worthy of a second chance. But I do think that in a vacuum, someone CAN be worthy of a second chance even after wreaking havoc through horrendous ignorance.
-
That said, this looks terrible on the Oilers. They live in such a shithole that the only way to get 'high value' employees seems to be to buy off their own HR. Perry, Kane, now Bowman. There's a pretty ugly pattern here that makes them look terrible and exceedingly easy to root against.

There is a fairly detailed report that outlines his involvement. To wit - it was reported, he (Bowman) knew it had occurred, and he failed to report / respond.

His silence / inaction allowed Aldrich to move on to other hunting grounds to continue preying on people - which he eventually did in the form of a minor at Notre Dame.

Bowman’s crime - and that of the others in the know - was indifference.

 

[valkynax]

Hey now that Bowman is there, where's the response from Gazdick and Whitney. I mean die hard dedicated Oilers fans such as those two, who branded themselves as the beacon of justice, would not wait long before showing their badge of morals in disowning this hiring, no?

 

[LordBacon]

The price of seeing your team winning a cup is worth selling your soul to the devil. We would all do horrible things to see it happen...

I personally would put ketchup on my scrambled eggs and drink Folgers coffee!

Hey mods are you guys gonna do anything about this??

 

[arttk]

Hey mods are you guys gonna do anything about this??

Ketchup on eggs is not allowed?!

 

[Hit the post]

Ketchup on eggs is not allowed?!

I say Mr C puts Ketchup on his steak.

 

[EpochLink]

Hey now that Bowman is there, where's the response from Gazdick and Whitney. I mean die hard dedicated Oilers fans such as those two, who branded themselves as the beacon of justice, would not wait long before showing their badge of morals in disowning this hiring, no?

You mean ass stank and pubic shrivel?