Around the League 15: Only 28 More FA Shopping Days to Next Season!

[Lempo]

 

[Ms Maggie]

Rocks, paper, scissors time.

 

[NotOpie]

IMO, somebody close to him has got to let him know that he's missing the forest for the trees. All this crap about the captaincy, radio promises, respect, comparisons to Matthews, Schedule B bonuses, c'mon man. It's noise. And more than that, it's not the type of stuff that you allow to affect you when you're happy where you are. I think the fact that Marner is bogged down in this morass is serious cause for concern for his future as a Leaf. This doesn't sound like a guy who's going to be happy playing his entire career in Toronto, especially when Auston Matthews isn't going anywhere.

There is no world in which Mitch Marner is an $11 million player at age 22. Be *happy* you don't have the entire weight of Leafs' fans expectations on your shoulders. Be happy to be part of a team with Matthews, Tavares, Nylander and everybody else.

Unfortunately, that should be his daddy....who is looking over at his golden goose and trying to squeeze some more of them 24 karat eggs out.

in retrospect, and maybe even at the time, you let nylander go last offseason when his demands were so clearly unreasonable. trade him to arizona and let him play meaningless games his entire career.

I said this on another board, the problem with the Nylander signing had less to do with the number alone....it was the number and the hold out all together. My guess is you could have gotten Nylander signed for that number in October.

 

[Lempo]

Oh... the first year cap hit will be killer, if they let Marner go unsigned into season like Nylander did.

 

[Cardiac Jerks]

Hopefully GMBC is taking notes. There’s going to be a big contract coming for Svech pretty dang soon and likely Necas after that.

I’d welcome that problem with Necas as it will mean he panned out.

 

[Lempo]

The captaincy pointer of Marner camp is a bit funny way of shooting into one's own foot. Yes, Marner was the captain in his victorious* OHL team in his Draft+1 season. But, Matthews was showing thinking out of box playing in Europe for his Draft season, and his D+1 he spent in NHL finishing second in scoring.

It's somewhat unfair to be compared to Matthews, but his camp insists on doing that themselves.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

The pick compensation depends on the pure AAV alone (until you go above 5 years). The team offre hostiling Marner wouldn't be getting their very high picks' worth, as the return would be 3 years of Marner with an offensive QO to help him into UFA.

I think it's because the 3 year deal would be structured something like 7.5, 10, 13.5 or 8,8,15(that I just made up) to give Marner an insane mil QO or UFA status at the termination of the deal. 2 1sts, 2nd and 3rd for 3 year deal with an option for a 4th at 13-15 mil salary cap hit is a steep price.
.

Yeah, I get all that. I was more poking fun at the notion across HF that “Dundon was cheap, Waddell was incompetent, Canes were a joke, and Aho wanted out” when Aho used the offer sheet as leverage, yet here Marner is trying to use that same leverage (unsuccessfully).

 

[Lempo]

Yeah, I get all that. I was more poking fun at the notion across HF that “Dundon was cheap, Waddell was incompetent, Canes were a joke, and Aho wanted out” when Aho used the offer sheet as leverage, yet here Marner is trying to use that same leverage (unsuccessfully).

Ah, you got a point there.

I had/have hard time comparing l'offre hostile d'Aho and this ex potentia offer sheet of Marner's or rather thinking of them at the same time at all, as Aho clearly used it to get promptly signed with his team to a what is a team-friendly contract, whereas Marner would have to be pretty open to the possibility that TML may not match an OS that was built to Marner's order.

Aho might have poisoned the well there by taking the procedure that seems to have been widely understood as a GM's tool, and using it to his own ends.

Dear god that was a magnificent move.

 

[MrazeksVengeance]

Dear god that was a magnificent move.

Dear GMs, my name is Sebastian Aho and welcome to NOW YOU KNOW HOW IT FEELS PERKELE.

 

[Lempo]

A bullet dodged: Torts gives up trying to pronounce Vehvilainen's name:

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

Torts making jokes ahead of this season being a joke for Columbus

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Man I don’t know about a 15 million QO. If he’d do a 8, 8, 12 million 3 year deal, I’d be all over Dubas for a trade. 3 even 4 years of Marner would be worth a trade. Our window would be wide open for the next 3-4 years.

From what I can tell, if he’d do 8,8,12 he’d probably be under contract with Toronto. All reports indicate that he wants AAV on par with Matthews and 3-6 years term.

Also, The cost to acquire him would probably be more than we’d want to part with.

While I’ve learned to never say never with GMBC, a move like that seems at odds with the value approach that they have taken so far.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

From what I can tell, if he’d do 8,8,12 he’d probably be under contract with Toronto. All reports indicate that he wants AAV on par with Matthews and 3-6 years term.

Also, The cost to acquire him would probably be more than we’d want to part with.

While I’ve learned to never say never with GMBC, a move like that seems at odds with the value approach that they have taken so far.

Im not sure what the AAV he is looking for with a 3 year deal. I know Marner’s team pitched one. I think Toronto wants an 7-8 year deal so that they don’t have to pay him a TON after a 3 year deal would be complete. I do agree he is looking for Matthews money with them. Im sure TD and Co could remind him that 11 million in Toronto is 9 million here (the AAV of the deal I proposed).
It isn’t happening but I’d would be all for saving Toronto from Marner.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Im not sure what the AAV he is looking for with a 3 year deal. I know Marner’s team pitched one. I think Toronto wants an 7-8 year deal so that they don’t have to pay him a TON after a 3 year deal would be complete. I do agree he is looking for Matthews money with them. Im sure TD and Co could remind him that 11 million in Toronto is 9 million here (the AAV of the deal I proposed).
It isn’t happening but I’d would be all for saving Toronto from Marner.

I’m not so sure about the 11 vs 9 statement. From what I read, Bonuses are treated differently so depends on structure as players have ways to lessen the impact via bonuses. Plus each game is taxed in the jurisdiction it’s played in, so taxes only applies to half the games. On top of that, Marner’s endorsement opportunity and ancillary income in Toronto far surpasses anything here. No doubt cost of living and taxes are less here, but it’s not easy to get a full picture.

Lastly, this is more about ego than actual dollars from what’s being reported so I’m not sure Marner cares about “take home pay”.

 

[Lempo]

But who will save us from Marner? He will have a chip on his shoulder with Matthews wherever he plays after this, not least because media will kling on to the perceived rivalry.

Carolina as a not-hawkey-mecca already would put Marner to the backtrack compared to Matthews in the league-wide public perception, and it's not like we too don't have a super-talented media darling 1C of our own for competition for the top dog spot.

I fear for the tears on the tiers happening here, if Marner would next expect respect with Aho substituting Matthews on Marner's quest to be seen as the best and better than rest.

 

[Lempo]

On top of that, Marner’s endorsement opportunity and ancillary income in Toronto far surpasses anything here.

That... may have taken a dip lately.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

That... may have taken a dip lately.

Nah. Maybe short term. If Fans have shown anything, it's that they forgive and forget quickly. There were gobs of people that told me they were done with the NHL during the lockout, yet when push came to shove, they forgot all about it.

I know people that told me they were done with the NFL a couple years ago due to all the kneeling during the anthem stuff, yet that is forgotten and they follow the NFL just as much.

I don't disagree that tax wise and financially, $11M in Toronto is not the same as $11M in Carolina, but I don't think Marner's camp is focused on "take home pay". I agree 100% with your post before the one I quoted.

 

[Lempo]

Nah. Maybe short term. If Fans have shown anything, it's that they forgive and forget quickly. There were gobs of people that told me they were done with the NHL during the lockout, yet when push came to shove, they forgot all about it.

I know people that told me they were done with the NFL a couple years ago due to all the kneeling during the anthem stuff, yet that is forgotten and they follow the NFL just as much.

I don't disagree that tax wise and financially, $11M in Toronto is not the same as $11M in Carolina, but I don't think Marner's camp is focused on "take home pay". I agree 100% with your post before the one I quoted.

I was thinking more in the line that the endorsement deals are decided more or less by some individual corporation bigwigs or a board of them. There may not be a prolonged fan reaction to speak of, but it's a different issue if at least in short term the corporates don't want to have themselves and their product associated to Marner.

The damage is not done yet, I think, but it's critical times I think. Nylander may have used up all the patience for contract holdouts, and Marner is going for 150 percent in his ask compared to Nylander.

The affinity for underdogs may even twist things so people chose to see Dubas' "we get them signed!" pledge as a good Toronto boy move that he was expected to do in his position, and that these young ingrates chose to use it to take The Maple Leafs to the cleaners, and compare their actions to pajama boy John Tavares, who shenanigised against an American franchise in his burning love for Toronto, not in cooperation with one (seeking an offersheet) against Toronto.

 

[Lempo]

(i must emphasize: it was a very classy kitchen where I did my studies on psychology)

 

[robbieberns]

Even if Torterella is just having fun, not knowing how to, or not caring enough to try and pronounce foreign names is such an ugly look. Maybe it’s just a strong pet peeve of mine, but giving up or refusing to pronounce someone’s name is just such an asshole move.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

I was thinking more in the line that the endorsement deals are decided more or less by some individual corporation bigwigs or a board of them. There may not be a prolonged fan reaction to speak of, but it's a different issue if at least in short term the corporates don't want to have themselves and their product associated to Marner.

Yeah, that could be true short term, but bigwigs and boards will eventually yield to what the fans think when making decisions, because after all, that's who they are targeting with their advertising. If fans love Marner when all this is over, the endorsements will eventually be there even if there is a short term hit. Marner is a Toronto boy that the city loves right now and plays the game the way Toronto fans want the game played.

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

It’s weird that the billion dollar franchise seems to be coming out as the good guy here. The reported dollar amounts on the 3, 7, and 8 year deals are more than reasonable, to the point where most would say Marner won the negotiations if he signed any of them.

Surprised at the lack of PR so far. Usually there’s some attempt at spin from the team, and usually the team doesn’t quite have the level of facts on their side that Toronto does right now. Wonder if that changes soon and the battle gets taken more public.

 

[NotOpie]

On top of that, Marner’s endorsement opportunity and ancillary income in Toronto far surpasses anything here.

It probably depends on how long it drags out. There's still a little "selfish Willie" thing going on, but I agree, the consumer has a short memory.

Now if Marner were down here we could see if we could stage a fight between Matthews and Marner in a Bojangles parking lot. That would be epic.

 

[SlavinAway]

Now if Marner were down here we could see if we could stage a fight between Matthews and Marner in a Bojangles parking lot. That would be epic.

I've got $10 on Matthews.

 

[Penaltykiller17]

Is anybody else tired of the attention Toronto gets? While I think it's a horrible situation for both Marner and Toronto, the hockey media pays way too much attention to a team that can't win a playoff series.