Are the Flames a serious Cup threat?

[InfinityIggy]

Nope we are terrible, no contending for us.

 

[Ronnie Residue]

^ this post

Coming from the team that let it 8 goals against us.

Lol calm down anything can happen in one game, also scored 8 on Aaron Dell.

No need to get so defensive.

 

[Volica]

So in your eyes, the way the Flames are playing is unsustainable, even though they've actually been sustaining their level of play since the end of October, which amounts to over two months and nearly half a season?

Just curious, how long does a team need to play well before you stop dismissing them as simply "on a hot streak"?

The fun part is how badly the Flames underperformed last season because of goaltending and depth.
Amazing that when a GM fixes holes, people who don't follow a team are blown away or salty at success they didn't know was coming.

 

[Rubi]

I was refraining myself from coming back here to answer any posts, since I don't really care to debate on this matter, or whether I'm right or wrong. I stated my (un)educated opinion and it's up to the team to prove me right or wrong.

But the whole problem with the "Flames being a serious cup threat" is the fact the team is playing really hot right now and no one has any idea if it's sustainable or not. It's not uncommon for an unknown and unproven goalie to go on a hot streak with the whole team. 23 games played is an indication of really nothing. He's been good for a stretch but doesn't elevate the goalie situation from being a question mark come playoffs time. Same applies to this so called great or one of the best 2nd pairing in the league.

If everything's still the same after 82 games of regular season I will be happy to come back and raise my hand call myself out for having a bad prediction. But as of right now and based on recent past, I'm not going to change my mind no matter how many Flames' fan quotes me with 'facts'.

Bookmarked for the end of the season review.

 

[Jimbo57]

I mean, creating chances and dominating possession for one? Who are the bottom 6 of teams that are legit cup threats? Essentially the bottom 6 of Calgary consists of any mix of:

Sam Bennett, Michael Frolik, Austin Czarnik, James Neal, Mark Jankowski, Derek Ryan, Garnet Hathaway, Dillon Dube, Andrew Mangiapane.

You're talking about mostly guys on pace for 25-35 points; or guys that fill overly important roles for this team (Elite PKers, Physical players, etc).

IT's really, really funny that Flames fans have been super pumped about how good our overall depth is, and how well they've played this season, and your hot take is that they're sub par

i watch the flames a lot. 4 guys generate everything for them (actually JG is the offensive genius who turns the crank for 2 of the other guys too). the bottom 2 lines contribute very little. you could argue that the top line and the d core are amongst the best in the league but trying to paint the bottom 6 as a special group of players is a stretch to say the least. When the hammer comes down on JG in the playoffs (closer checking and more physical play) that top line will find it much more difficult to score, the difference in a series can be how the bottom 2 lines perform and the flames have nothing special there.

BTW - dube, mangiapane, hathaway, ryan,czarnik etc are not on pace for 35 points lol. Bennett is rather disappointing and Neal has been very disappointing.

 

[Club]

4 players in the top 20 for points. I think they are a legit contender. Players have really meshed well.

 

[Jugitsu]

So in your eyes, the way the Flames are playing is unsustainable, even though they've actually been sustaining their level of play since the end of October, which amounts to over two months and nearly half a season?

Just curious, how long does a team need to play well before you stop dismissing them as simply "on a hot streak"?

I didn't say that. I said we don't know whether it's sustainable or not. There's a whole second half of a season to go. Just only a couple of seasons ago Minnesota had a very strong start and an extremely hot streak right around this time. I believe it was 12 straight before they succumbed to Columbus for their 15th straight win. Wild was very hot until TDL and fell very flat in the playoffs. Columbus didn't go far either and I don't think they were that touted as a Cup threat at the end of the regular season even though they finished with respectable point totals.

I'm not saying this year's Flames is the same thing or that there a lot of similarities between these teams. But a lot of things can happen between now and the playoffs. And the playoffs are a completely different beast altogether but that's beside the point at this moment.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

I mean, creating chances and dominating possession for one? Who are the bottom 6 of teams that are legit cup threats? Essentially the bottom 6 of Calgary consists of any mix of:

Sam Bennett, Michael Frolik, Austin Czarnik, James Neal, Mark Jankowski, Derek Ryan, Garnet Hathaway, Dillon Dube, Andrew Mangiapane.

You're talking about mostly guys on pace for 25-35 points; or guys that fill overly important roles for this team (Elite PKers, Physical players, etc).

IT's really, really funny that Flames fans have been super pumped about how good our overall depth is, and how well they've played this season, and your hot take is that they're sub par

I wouldn't call the Flames depth subpar but only two of Frolik, Jankowski, and Bennett count in this situation because one of them is in the top six on any given night and underperforming for that bar. I also don't agree with the creating chances and dominating possession parts of that on the whole of it at least when you also throw in what they give up on the other end. It's better than in years past and playoff quality but I don't know if it'll match up come playoff time beyond the first round. I think they're more than good enough to win against a first round team where they're at in the standings currently.

 

[crackdown44]

I'd rather face the Sharks than the Ducks.

I’d rather cross over and play a Tampa/Toronto combined super team than the ducks

 

[Volica]

i watch the flames a lot. 4 guys generate everything for them (actually JG is the offensive genius who turns the crank for 2 of the other guys too). the bottom 2 lines contribute very little. you could argue that the top line and the d core are amongst the best in the league but trying to paint the bottom 6 as a special group of players is a stretch to say the least. When the hammer comes down on JG in the playoffs (closer checking and more physical play) that top line will find it much more difficult to score, the difference in a series can be how the bottom 2 lines perform and the flames have nothing special there.

BTW - dube, mangiapane, hathaway, ryan etc are not on pace for 35 points lol. Bennett is rather disappointing and Neal has been very disappointing.

The bottom 6 is better than league average by a wide margin.
BTW, because your reading comp seems to be under league average; the exact wording was: You're talking about mostly guys on pace for 25-35 points; or guys that fill overly important roles for this team (Elite PKers, Physical players, etc).

Ryan is on pace for 28, which is between 25-35. Also a guy who kills penalties, wins draws and plays late game 5v6 minutes.
Frolik is on pace for about 30, which is between 25-35. Also a guy who kills penalties and is among the elite wing defenders in the league.
Jankowski is on pace for 33, which is between 25-35. Also a guy who is among the elite penalty killers in the league (more SHG forward than PPG allowed).
Bennett is on pace for 27, which is between 25-35. Also a guy who plays a physical game, which Calgary lacks and brings a team toughness.
Hathaway: Fantastic PKer, brings a lot of team toughness and energy; also chips in with goals, the guy's pacing 10 goals this year . One of the best 4th line wings, likely in the NHL being completely honest. Paid like the 4th liner, plays above what a regular plug 4th liner gives you.
Neal: Disappointing season so far, for sure. But you're talking about a guy who generates chances out the wazoo and is shooting 7% under his career average. That'd be the difference between his current 4 goal campaign and an on-pace 20 goal campaign.
Dube/Mangi: Prolific junior scorers in their rookie campaigns.

If you compare that to last years top teams, that stacks up almost identically or superior. Like, stack up beside last years' Jets, Preds; hell, stack'em up against last years' cup winners, it's the same model. Some decent scoring, 25-35 points and a lot of role players.

 

[Anglesmith]

I'm still in "just make it to the playoffs" mode as a fan. No need to think beyond that.

 

[Anisimovs AK]

This team is very impressive. They seem to be a team that can win through speed, skill, and toughness which is very valuable in the playoffs.

Once they get that goaltending situation fully figured out they can definitely be a force in the West for years to come.

 

[qwerty]

The Flames are absolutely contenders right now lead by the best quintet in the league. It took this team about a month to figure it out with all the new changes to personnel/systems/lines.

But ever since, this team has actually been one of, if not the very best teams in the league. Top 3 team in points, elite team in both goal and shot differential, top 10 in special teams, top 5 in faceoff% and etc. If you look at this team with just David Rittich in goal, their performance is heightened even more as he's more than held his end of the bargained compared to Mike Smith who statistically, has been one of the worst starters in the league this season.

At this very moment, I would say they have as good a chance as any other contending team in the West to reach the Stanley Cup finals. But if there's one thing that this team needs to shore up, it's their secondary scoring. There's a lot of reliance on a few players to win them games. It's not the worst in the league, but in the playoffs, secondary scoring is very important and until this is shored up, I don't think the Flames can beat out a team like the Lightning to win it all. They could also stand to build at least one heavy line for the playoffs. But the good thing is, this is more easy to remedy than say, finding a superstar scorer, a top pairing defenseman or a #1 goaltender.

 

[CraigsList]

Lol calm down anything can happen in one game, also scored 8 on Aaron Dell.

No need to get so defensive.

I’m not. That poster is just getting ridiculous on his takes.

Cheers. We’ll see you 2-7-19

 

[Tkachuky]

We’re not contenders.

There is however a chance Rittich turns into a full time starter. He looks solid and the sample size increases every week. Great movement and positioning. And he’s weird in a good way. So there’s that.

 

[blankall]

Better than the top 5 in the league goaltending they are getting from Rittich? Like top three? Weird take considering they are second in the league in goals for and differential.

I hope that Rittich works out just as much as any Flames fan. However, there is a difference between having a top 5 goaltender and having an unproven goaltender who is putting up good numbers in a small sample size. If Rittich can establish himself as a true #1 goaltender, then yes, the Flames will do some damage in the playoffs.

 

[Hunter368]

Cup contender? Yes, consider them a top 10 team with a chance like other top 10 teams.

Serious cup contender threat? No, not this year.

 

[Jimbo57]

The bottom 6 is better than league average by a wide margin.
BTW, because your reading comp seems to be under league average; the exact wording was: You're talking about mostly guys on pace for 25-35 points; or guys that fill overly important roles for this team (Elite PKers, Physical players, etc).

Ryan is on pace for 28, which is between 25-35. Also a guy who kills penalties, wins draws and plays late game 5v6 minutes.
Frolik is on pace for about 30, which is between 25-35. Also a guy who kills penalties and is among the elite wing defenders in the league.
Jankowski is on pace for 33, which is between 25-35. Also a guy who is among the elite penalty killers in the league (more SHG forward than PPG allowed).
Bennett is on pace for 27, which is between 25-35. Also a guy who plays a physical game, which Calgary lacks and brings a team toughness.
Hathaway: Fantastic PKer, brings a lot of team toughness and energy; also chips in with goals, the guy's pacing 10 goals this year . One of the best 4th line wings, likely in the NHL being completely honest. Paid like the 4th liner, plays above what a regular plug 4th liner gives you.
Neal: Disappointing season so far, for sure. But you're talking about a guy who generates chances out the wazoo and is shooting 7% under his career average. That'd be the difference between his current 4 goal campaign and an on-pace 20 goal campaign.
Dube/Mangi: Prolific junior scorers in their rookie campaigns.

If you compare that to last years top teams, that stacks up almost identically or superior. Like, stack up beside last years' Jets, Preds; hell, stack'em up against last years' cup winners, it's the same model. Some decent scoring, 25-35 points and a lot of role players.

gimme a break, Hathaway "one of the best 4th line wings". He is a plug, the same type of plug 30 other teams have. then you bring up the fact that Dube and Mangiapane were "prolific" scorers in Junior. So what?

Frolik in the doughouse for a reason. Bennett is garbage for a 4th overall pick, he might crack 10 goals this year. Neal is killing your cap and will be one of the worst UFA signings by time its all said and done. You talk the big talk about these guys "awesome penalty killers" and really "physical" as if other teams dont have the exact same style of players.

Calgary has a great top line, great d. Will the goaltending hold up? Their bottom 6 is absolutely nothing special.

Its ok if not everybody thinks that your team is the best in the universe. LOL. no need to start the insults. I know that your team has only progressed beyond the first round 2 times since 1989 (thats like in 30 years you know) but you need to temper your enthusiasm a bit here...

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

Not at all. Midnight will strike soon.

 

[Royale With Cheese]

Nope.......the Preds and Jets are basically the only serious threats from the West...the Flames are pretenders that will not last....

Ya, I don't think so. They've beaten my Jets twice. They're as good a bet as either the Preds or Jets in the west.

 

[Tkachuky]

gimme a break, Hathaway "one of the best 4th line wings". He is a plug, the same type of plug 30 other teams have. then you bring up the fact that Dube and Mangiapane were "prolific" scorers in Junior. So what?

Frolik in the doughouse for a reason. Bennett is garbage for a 4th overall pick, he might crack 10 goals this year. Neal is killing your cap and will be one of the worst UFA signings by time its all said and done. You talk the big talk about these guys "awesome penalty killers" and really "physical" as if other teams dont have the exact same style of players.

Calgary has a great top line, great d. Will the goaltending hold up? Their bottom 6 is absolutely nothing special.

Its ok if not everybody thinks that your team is the best in the universe. LOL. no need to start the insults. I know that your team has only progressed beyond the first round 2 times since 1989 (thats like in 30 years you know) but you need to temper your enthusiasm a bit here...

Decent second line eh? Let’s leave that out though. Not like the second line is more important than Shitting on the Flames bottom 6.

The Flames bottom 6 has a couple of great PK players btw.

 

[Volica]

gimme a break, Hathaway "one of the best 4th line wings". He is a plug, the same type of plug 30 other teams have. then you bring up the fact that Dube and Mangiapane were "prolific" scorers in Junior. So what?

Frolik in the doughouse for a reason. Bennett is garbage for a 4th overall pick, he might crack 10 goals this year. Neal is killing your cap and will be one of the worst UFA signings by time its all said and done. You talk the big talk about these guys "awesome penalty killers" and really "physical" as if other teams dont have the exact same style of players.

Calgary has a great top line, great d. Will the goaltending hold up? Their bottom 6 is absolutely nothing special.

Its ok if not everybody thinks that your team is the best in the universe. LOL. no need to start the insults. I know that your team has only progressed beyond the first round 2 times since 1989 (thats like in 30 years you know) but you need to temper your enthusiasm a bit here...

You're just showing how much you actually know about the team. So, I'm pretty done chatting with you.
Your point was the bottom 6 was garbage. When in reality, it's part of Calgary's strong suit. You were wrong, and now you're drawing at strings with overly emotional answers. Hell, I look at your Canucks, and essentially you're using roleplayers Calgary uses on the 4th line as second liners.

I don't think Calgary's a Tampa Bay level team, but I do think they're one of the top 5 teams so far this year, which does make them a contender come playoff time. Anyone who leads their division/conference is a contender. Hell, Caps were a contender for a decade before they won a damn thing.

 

[JasonRoseEh]

No they're not.

 

[Volica]

Cup contender? Yes, consider them a top 10 team with a chance like other top 10 teams.

Serious cup contender threat? No, not this year.

I mentioned my cup contender status was essentially any top team that makes the playoffs... that being said, the NHL is the hardest league to peg 'contenders'. How many people saw Vegas/Caps as the finals from last year? Caps were past their 'contender' status and everyone thought Vegas was going to meet a hard reality come playoff time

This league is a tricky one to peg.

 

[Duffalufagus]

I hope that Rittich works out just as much as any Flames fan. However, there is a difference between having a top 5 goaltender and having an unproven goaltender who is putting up good numbers in a small sample size. If Rittich can establish himself as a true #1 goaltender, then yes, the Flames will do some damage in the playoffs.

You said they need “better” goaltending.