Are the Canucks trying to replicate the 2019 St Louis Blues Gigantic Dcore that won the Cup? Can it be successful in todays Hockey.

[Soundwave]

2019 is 'today's NHL' and it was successful for the Canucks last year.

They're far from the only team doing this although possibly the most extreme at this point. The pendulum on tiny defenders went one way in the 2010s and is going the opposite way in the 2020s as teams focus on limiting shot quality and protecting high-danger areas of the ice.

Eh, kinda, sorta.

Scoring is significantly higher than 2019, the game is faster.

 

[K1984]

I beg to differ but sure.

Like i said i reserve judgement on Forbort/Desharnais but you wont be able to convince me that the top 2 pairings which includes a Norris winner arent any good considering like i mentioned, the Canucks finished tied for 3rd with Bruins in least goals given up last season.

Hughes-Hronek
Soucy-Myers

Two of those guys aren't over 6 feet. The others are mediocre.

So if your thesis is "look we're the Blues because we happen to have defensemen that are tall!" then you would be out to lunch, because the tall defensemen on the Blues were actually good, the tall defensemen on the Nucks are not.

 

[MS]

Eh, kinda, sorta.

Scoring is significantly higher than 2019, the game is faster.

Two things can be happening at once.

 

[RiverbottomChuck]

I wouldn’t be penciling Forbort into any lineup trying to win the cup.

 

[D0ctorCool]

I would call it a solid moneyball-type strategy to best mask a bad D-core.

 

[UrbanImpact]

I wouldn’t be penciling Forbort into any lineup trying to win the cup.

He's a prime candidate for the Canucks to try and upgrade on....Much like the Canucks did last year when they traded for Zadorov mid-season. Thats where another Puck Moving Dman might come in. However im very intrigued with Forborts ability to be physical and his penalty killing numbers have been excellent. Maybe Bruin fans can shed more light

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

It seems that the Canucks want a massive massive Dcore. Much like the 2019 St Louis D-Core that ground and pounded their way to a cup.

2019: Blues D

Alex Pietrangelo: 6'3- 215lbs
Colton Parayko: 6'6 - 230lbs
Jay Bouwmeester: 6'4- 205lbs
Joel Edmundson: 6'5 220 lbs
Carl Gunnarson- 6'2- 200lbs
*Vince Dunn- 6'0- 200 lbs

2024/25 Canucks Dcore

Tyler Myers: 6'8 225lbs
Carson Soucy: 6'5 210lbs
V Desharnais: 6'6 220lbs
D Forbort: 6'4 210 lbs
N Juulsen 6'2 205lbs
Hronek 6'0 190 lbs
Q Hughes 5'10 180lbs

Do you think this ground and pound system can be successfull? even in the regular season? If i recall , the 2018/19 St Louis Blues struggled at the first part of that year and it wasnt until the 2nd half and playoffs ( when reffs tend to swallow the whistle) that their Dcore became more successful.

Can this blue print be successful the way the game is played in 2024 which is with speed and more speed. Is there enough puck movers? An option would be to separate Hughes and Hronek and pair each of them with a Giant.

Of note, the past playoffs, the Canucks iced a pretty similar D Core. They had Zadorov and Ian Cole as part of the core before they had to replace them with Desharnais and Forbort.

This D Core "bully" system "Held down" Mcdavid to 9 pts in 7 games and held him pointless in 2 of the 7 playoff games including game 7.

One thing is certain, much like the 2019 Blues Team, i dont think anybody will be excited to play the Canucks because win or lose, the opponent will not be coming out of that series healthy, much like the Oilers did not come out healthy vs the Canucks in the 2nd round this season.

We all know it a copy cat league but im trully curious if this is a plausible path to the Cup in today's hockey.

The 2 best defenders the Canucks have, who play the most minutes, were non-factors against the Oilers in the playoffs (Hughes, Hronek)
so the answer is no

 

[TheNumber4]

OP literally cannot stop thinking about the Oilers

Lol

Wtf is this thread. Big D has been a thing for awhile. It’s not exclusive to the Blues or the Nucks.

 

[GirardSpinorama]

I cant say too much about Forbort or Deharnais yet because i havent been able to watch them closely, but mobility is a non issue for Soucy, Juulsen and Myers.

As for puck skills, again i want to re-iterate that Zadorov and Cole are the ones that primarily got replaced from last season in which the Canucks finished 6th in Goals for and 4th best Goals Against. How much more Puck skills is Zadorov/Cole going to have over Desharnais/Forbort. Zadorov despite a hot playoffs, only had 20 pts in the regular season last year.

Theres a difference between Juulson mobile and JayBo, who was a freak of nature combination of big and mobile.

 

[Spawn]

I mean, it is pretty evident the difference. The Blues best dmen were those monsters. The Canucks monsters listed are mostly bottom of the lineup dmen. Their best guys are their smallest

Yep.

Pietrangelo, JayBo and Parayko were all 25+ minute a night dmen complete packages. You don’t want anyone on the Canucks blue line that is over 6’0 playing any more than 16-17 minutes a night.

If the Canucks are trying to replicate what the Blues did to win a cup with their blue line they are doing a terrible job of it.

Even though Hughes and Hronek were horrible in the playoffs, that is a solid top pair. The rest of those guys are the definition of bottom pair D-men at this point in their respective careers.

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

Yep.

Pietrangelo, JayBo and Parayko were all 25+ minute a night dmen complete packages. You don’t want anyone on the Canucks blue line that is over 6’0 playing any more than 16-17 minutes a night.

If the Canucks are trying to replicate what the Blues did to win a cup with their blue line they are doing a terrible job of it.

Even though Hughes and Hronek were horrible in the playoffs, that is a solid top pair. The rest of those guys are the definition of bottom pair D-men at this point in their respective careers.

Hughes was not horrible in the playoffs lol

 

[NeverForget06]

Hughes was not horrible in the playoffs lol

Didn't do much in the Edmonton series - didn't score a single goal the whole playoffs?

 

[Billy Kvcmu]

Didn't do much in the Edmonton series - didn't score a single goal the whole playoffs?

Yeah because that’s all it matters for a D man

He wasnt great like in regular season but he was also the only D that drived the play

 

[NOTENOUGHRYJOTHINGS]

I beg to differ but sure.

Like i said i reserve judgement on Forbort/Desharnais but you wont be able to convince me that the top 2 pairings which includes a Norris winner arent any good considering like i mentioned, the Canucks finished tied for 3rd with Bruins in least goals given up last season.

Hughes-Hronek
Soucy-Myers

Soucy Myers Forbort Desharnais are all very tall and heavy.

And their combined cap hit is pretty low.

 

[RiverbottomChuck]

He's a prime candidate for the Canucks to try and upgrade on....Much like the Canucks did last year when they traded for Zadorov mid-season. Thats where another Puck Moving Dman might come in. However im very intrigued with Forborts ability to be physical and his penalty killing numbers have been excellent. Maybe Bruin fans can shed more light

He is not physical at all. He blocks pucks all day though, that’s about it. Definitely would be the first upgrade candidate on that list.

 

[AnInjuredJasonZucker]

If they are, shouldn't they be trying to get better large defensemen than the ones that got knocked out in the 2nd round?

 

[Sheikyerbouti]

He wasnt great like in regular season but he was also the only D that drived the play

Exactly, which makes these comparisons to the Blues Dmen silly

 

[MVP of West Hollywd]

The comp doesn't really work when the best one is the smallest

 

[Garbageyuk]

“Ground and pound system”? Are their D going to double-leg takedown opposing players to the ice and beat them up? You making a point to use that term twice is the funniest part

 

[The Panther]

Height is typically overrated in hockey. The puck doesn't move through the air.

 

[HabzSauce]

Jeez I didn't realize the blues were that big

Wow that is a massive back end

 

[Three On Zero]

St Louis had tall skilled defenceman
Vancouver has…….tall defenceman

Thread is about as silly as the Edmonton has the best depth thread

 

[BenningHurtsMySoul]

all those big bodies...
View attachment 891891

You're an announcer with a long stick from time to time

 

[Three On Zero]

Jeez I didn't realize the blues were that big

Wow that is a massive back end

What is “Things you can’t say to your wife”.

 

[Canuck Luck]

A d-core that size holding an injured McDavid to 9 points in 7 games isn’t exactly good…

And the d-core got worse.

Nobody is frightened of the Canucks defence like you’re making it out to be.

you'd have a point if McDavid didnt average 11.76 points per 7 games in the playoffs and scored even more against every other team he faced

LA: 12 points in 5 games
DAL: 11 points in 6 games
FLA: 11 points in 7 games

9 points in 7 games is the worst series he had and well below what the Stanley Cup Champions Florida managed to do.