Speculation: Another year of this Bluc **** (The 2024-25 season thread)

[FSL KINGS]

Biggest F-ups the last ten years.

Passing on Conner, Barzal for Lucic. The Lucic fiasco was entertaining.

Blake, too many mistakes to list them all. Constantly rolling the dice on injured players that other teams steered clear of is up there.

Todd, just a waste of time.

Forbort over McNabb

MacD to expansion

Faust/Rosen

2019 draft

Toffoli for a 2nd & mini me

JAD

Burroughs

Got to stop before

Cal

Ok, it's not funny anymore.

 

[FSL KINGS]

Guess the point was, the widow probably wasn't closed for a decade after 2014 if there weren't so many terrible decisions made by management.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Guess the point was, the widow probably wasn't closed for a decade after 2014 if there weren't so many terrible decisions made by management.

Yes exactly

There's your window naturally slowly closing by virtue of your hall of famers slowly aging out--the lecavaliers, the lidstroms, the charas--and then there's slamming the window shut on your own dick through shitty decision making.

Then, beyond that, there's the rebuild/retool era--you can take your medicine and really tear down which is what some do, or you can retool. Kings committed to really neither and as such have ended up in no mans land for even longer. Any of the other teams that have rebuilt have come back in less than 5 years; any of the teams that retooled prolonged that fate but all of them ended up winning at least a round.

Kings had the smallest window of any cup champ of the last 20 years except Carolina AND have endured the longest without a playoff series win. This shouldn't be hand waved away as the 'cost of victory.' That's all I'm saying. Don't like the pardon.

 

[johnjm22]

Sure, and you can go back to the previous champions which were...Wings, prolonged success before now; Ducks, prolonged success before now; TBL AGAIN, and then Devils, prolonged success before now. Seeing a pattern? The only other team similar to the Kings dumping out was the only real exception, Carolina. "These teams are still in their window" isn't the counterargument you think it is, frankly that strengthens the idea of what a dumpster fire this has been.

My point was the Kings not only had a tiny window compared to all these other champs--they were dog water on BOTH sides of it. Most of these other franchises burned thru assets keeping a window going for 7+ years, Kings only got three; most got back to the 2nd round if not immediately, within a couple of years. We are going on a decade with two single playoff game wins.

Yes, we all know the 'cost of success', but that's not an excuse for this, and, frankly, THIS FRANCHISE is the exception. It's indefensible.

I don't think anything I said was particularly controversial, but people interpret it as a way of absolving current management so they inherently want to argue against it.

I think you're saying because LA's cup window was so short, the price shouldn't have been this heavy? I might agree or disagree, but it's beside the point. It doesn't mean what I said is untrue. There's multiple variables involved and the price of previous success is one of them.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

I don't think anything I said was particularly controversial, but people interpret it as a way of absolving current management so they inherently want to argue against it.

I think you're saying because LA's cup window was so short, the price shouldn't have been this heavy? I might agree or disagree, but it's beside the point. It doesn't mean what I said is untrue. There's multiple variables involved and the price of previous success is one of them.

Absolutely, I'm completely resistant to the idea because of that alone. It's not you, I just don't like anything that even trends towards absolving current management of that responsibility. It comes off as very "What was Blake supposed to do?"

And yes, I'd argue that having this small of a window shouldn't have caused such long term damage when franchises with much longer windows came out relatively unscathed. That's on management of assets. It could be a fun deep dive project for another time I guess, volume of assets in and out vs. time vs. objective.

 

[Statto]

The first major strategic issue was Danault and RV. Good players but the timing sucked.

Then the subsequent moves…. No point repeating them.

The signing of Kopitar was fine. The problem was building all subsequent strategy around him and Drew. If they didn’t want to be part of a proper rebuild they could have waived the NMC’s. Their cap hits and contracts didn’t cause any of the other mistakes. A young rebuilding team needs good vets and if they didn’t want to be part of a rebuild you find good vets to replace them. Easy… conceptually.

 

[Schmooley]

Absolutely, I'm completely resistant to the idea because of that alone. It's not you, I just don't like anything that even trends towards absolving current management of that responsibility. It comes off as very "What was Blake supposed to do?"

And yes, I'd argue that having this small of a window shouldn't have caused such long term damage when franchises with much longer windows came out relatively unscathed. That's on management of assets. It could be a fun deep dive project for another time I guess, volume of assets in and out vs. time vs. objective.

A big thing that caused it close so fast was a lot of guys leaving at around the same time. The natural progression for teams is to lose some guys like Nolan, Mitchell and Williams after a cup win for cap reasons or personal reasons. They had some guys age out like Gaborik and Scuderi. Then they had some unfortunate situations with Richards Voynov and Stoll. Thats a lot of strong players to lose in a short time for nothing in return. And on top of that instead of getting Barzal in a strong draft they got Lucic who had just become a slug.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

A big thing that caused it close so fast was a lot of guys leaving at around the same time. The natural progression for teams is to lose some guys like Nolan, Mitchell and Williams after a cup win for cap reasons or personal reasons. They had some guys age out like Gaborik and Scuderi. Then they had some unfortunate situations with Richards Voynov and Stoll. Thats a lot of strong players to lose in a short time for nothing in return. And on top of that instead of getting Barzal in a strong draft they got Lucic who had just become a slug.

I agree, their supporting cast was older than the typical champs.

So fine, rebuild. Should be easy to get a few lotto picks and sling your remaining elite assets for 1sts and 2nds.

Still no excuse for dragging it out 10 years with no purpose. We're competing! No, now we're rebuilding. No, now we're competing again!

I'm okay with you failing a vision as long as you have one. This isn't a failure of a vision; this is a failure to HAVE a vision.

 

[johnjm22]

Things people don't like hearing:

1) Luck plays a big part in determining franchises success. There's 32 teams now, thus it's unlikely you'll ever see the Kings win a cup again in your lifetime.

2) Not everything wrong with the Kings is current management's fault.

3) Part of the reason for LA's short cup window is that Kopitar, while great, isn't elite. His defense was always somewhat overrated, and placing so much emphasis on it was a mistake.

Also, we're alone in the universe. There is no god. There is no point to any of this and we're all wasting our time.

Happy holidays.

 

[FSL KINGS]

On the subject of mistakes.

Josh Anderson @ 50% retained for Moore
(Equation can be balanced later)

Moore has been struggling in the neutral zone with the King's new breakout. Anderson's size should help that.

Dach: he's coming back from an ACL, MCL injury. MTL is trying to play him as the 2C. They're starting to think he isn't going to be a 2C if, when he recovers from his injury.

Depending on cost, Dach may be a good reclamation project for the wing in the top 9. Maybe something around Kaliyev.

Swap Moore for a top 9 player with size & physicality & grab a reclamation project that's better than Lee, Thomas & more likely to get ice time over Kaliyev. Buffalo is another team that could fit a trade like this, but may be too expensive.

Edit: Been trying to figure out who the King's will target, but left out a major piece. Who is the French equivalent of Josh Anderson?

 

[bland]

Things people don't like hearing:

1) Luck plays a big part in determining franchises success. There's 32 teams now, thus it's unlikely you'll ever see the Kings win a cup again in your lifetime.

2) Not everything wrong with the Kings is current management's fault.

3) Part of the reason for LA's short cup window is that Kopitar, while great, isn't elite. His defense was always somewhat overrated, and placing so much emphasis on it was a mistake.

Also, we're alone in the universe. There is no god. There is no point to any of this and we're all wasting our time.

Happy holidays.

Only thing I would add:

The Kings are FINALLY doing the right thing this year - whether forced or not - and are actually moving forward at the moment. The doom and gloom appears to have ended, and this has been the most enjoyable season for this fan in the last 10.

Could they screw it all up by dealing Turcotte, Laferriere and Spence for veteran help? Of course, but it seems far less likely now than at any point in the last three years.

 

[BigKing]

Part of the reason for the lack of success over the past 10 years is precisely because of the success that preceded it.

Winning cups usually requires selling out. When the cup window closes you often get a long winter.

Pittsburgh hasn't won a series since 2018 and probably won't win one again this decade. Chicago might get one before the 2030's but it ain't looking too good.

It's not here yet, but Winter is coming for Tampa Bay as well.

Even the period between 1993-1994 to 2004 saw one playoff series win.

Without going through a list of seasons to check up on the 70s and 80s, the ten seasons since the Cup--and currently in the 11th--has to be up there for all-time worst ten year stretches in Kings history, which says a lot. Probably a better regular season winning percentage than 2002 - 2011 and there were only three playoff appearances to the five since 2014, but there were a lot more expectations on some of the teams since 2014, especially the '15 and '16 squads.

But sure, only eight teams a year win one playoff series. Winning two home playoff games out of 12 is an abomination though.

 

[KINGS17]

It doesn't have to ruin you for a decade. The biggest mistake made was re-signing Kopitar, there was absolutely zero chance of any immediate success and his presence was going to guarantee that the fall was never going to be far enough to bounce back in a reasonable amount of time.

Every decision made since then was to try and maximize the return on a mistake. Ten years on and the best they can still hope for is prolonged mediocrity.

The cost of a solid, lengthy Cup ran CAN be mitigated, but when you are looking at going from a period of great success into a period of either lengthy, steady decline or an immediate drop off, you aren't going to see many management teams risk their necks to bring a more sudden end to the good will built via success. But it doesn't mean that it can't be done, it just isn't done.

This one was so obvious.

 

[johnjm22]

Only thing I would add:

The Kings are FINALLY doing the right thing this year - whether forced or not - and are actually moving forward at the moment. The doom and gloom appears to have ended, and this has been the most enjoyable season for this fan in the last 10.

Could they screw it all up by dealing Turcotte, Laferriere and Spence for veteran help? Of course, but it seems far less likely now than at any point in the last three years.

I agree, but the current "build" has been undercut by mistakes made in previous years (mainly Fiala & Dubois trades) thus the roster's upside is limited.

By the time our young players are hitting their prime, our vets will be too old (we're already starting to see it). Bluc has built a bridge to nowhere.

One good thing about this franchise is that they've been able to hit on some picks outside the top 10. It could be a lot worse. Sometimes I look at other teams' drafting and I'm thankful for what our scouts have been able to do.

 

[johnjm22]

Even the period between 1993-1994 to 2004 saw one playoff series win.

Without going through a list of seasons to check up on the 70s and 80s, the ten seasons since the Cup--and currently in the 11th--has to be up there for all-time worst ten year stretches in Kings history, which says a lot. Probably a better regular season winning percentage than 2002 - 2011 and there were only three playoff appearances to the five since 2014, but there were a lot more expectations on some of the teams since 2014, especially the '15 and '16 squads.

There were less teams back in those days. It's not a comparable situation.

In 10 seasons since the 2014 cup win, LA has made the playoffs 5 times. LA hasn't been terrible, just mid.

 

[Jumptheshark]

Biggest F-ups the last ten years.

Passing on Conner, Barzal for Lucic. The Lucic fiasco was entertaining.

Blake, too many mistakes to list them all. Constantly rolling the dice on injured players that other teams steered clear of is up there.

Todd, just a waste of time.

Forbort over McNabb

MacD to expansion

Faust/Rosen

2019 draft

Toffoli for a 2nd & mini me

JAD

Burroughs

Got to stop before

Cal

Ok, it's not funny anymore.

Talk to Bruins fans about the 2015 Draft. They had the three picks prior to the what would have been the kings pick.

Jakub Zboril
Jake DeBrusk

Zachary Senyshyn

Players still on the board that went in the next 10 picks?

Mathew Barzal
Kyle Connor
Thomas Chabot
Joel Eriksson Ek
Brock Boeser
Travis Konecny
Jack Roslovic

A buddy is a bruins fan and we were in a bar when TSN or Sportsnet talked about how deep that draft was. He tossed his pint at the TV. We got tossed and he had to by a new TV

 

[SaltyElkHunter]

I agree, their supporting cast was older than the typical champs.

So fine, rebuild. Should be easy to get a few lotto picks and sling your remaining elite assets for 1sts and 2nds.

Still no excuse for dragging it out 10 years with no purpose. We're competing! No, now we're rebuilding. No, now we're competing again!

I'm okay with you failing a vision as long as you have one. This isn't a failure of a vision; this is a failure to HAVE a vision.

I would argue it’s that it’s one hairbrain idea after and other without a shred of consistency or discipline to stay the course.

 

[Kudelski37]

The first major strategic issue was Danault and RV. Good players but the timing sucked.

I'd argue that hiring TMac was the first strategic issue. He was a known vet favoring coach that wouldn't have been hired if Blake wanted to focus on developing young players. Bringing in Danault and RV was the symptom of the disease that had already taken hold.

 

[Surf Nutz]

The last 10 years for the Kings (2015-2024+):

• Zero Stanley Cups
• Zero playoff series wins

I'm not sure any fan could do worse than that, but ok.

Look up the Sabres , they are out of a place called Buffalo.

 

[Surf Nutz]

Only thing I would add:

The Kings are FINALLY doing the right thing this year - whether forced or not - and are actually moving forward at the moment. The doom and gloom appears to have ended, and this has been the most enjoyable season for this fan in the last 10.

Could they screw it all up by dealing Turcotte, Laferriere and Spence for veteran help? Of course, but it seems far less likely now than at any point in the last three years.

Taking Edmonton to 7 games without even having Doubtme was surprising and exciting 3 seasons ago for the amnesiac brigayde.

This one was so obvious.

Completely untrue to this point in history.

 

[Axl Rhoadz]

I'd argue that hiring TMac was the first strategic issue. He was a known vet favoring coach that wouldn't have been hired if Blake wanted to focus on developing young players. Bringing in Danault and RV was the symptom of the disease that had already taken hold.

I’d like to know what NHL head coach DOESNT ‘favor’ vets….

I’d also like to know what young players TM didn’t play….such a lame narrative.

 

[chris kontos]

Things people don't like hearing:

1) Luck plays a big part in determining franchises success. There's 32 teams now, thus it's unlikely you'll ever see the Kings win a cup again in your lifetime.

2) Not everything wrong with the Kings is current management's fault.

3) Part of the reason for LA's short cup window is that Kopitar, while great, isn't elite. His defense was always somewhat overrated, and placing so much emphasis on it was a mistake.

Also, we're alone in the universe. There is no god. There is no point to any of this and we're all wasting our time.

Happy holidays.

You forgot to add its the end of the world
And
Were all dying every minute.
But seriously it was rather sobering some time ago when it hit that i will never see another kings stanley cup. Imo its black and white that if a championship is out of reach its just common sense to bury yourself in a tank for as long as it takes to gather enough cost control premium young players to compete- that is IF a championship is the goal. Which i dont think is the goal of the present mgmt.

 

[Axl Rhoadz]

You forgot to add its the end of the world
And
Were all dying every minute.
But seriously it was rather sobering some time ago when it hit that i will never see another kings stanley cup. Imo its black and white that if a championship is out of reach its just common sense to bury yourself in a tank for as long as it takes to gather enough cost control premium young players to compete- that is IF a championship is the goal. Which i dont think is the goal of the present mgmt.

 

[Peter James Bond III]

TMac Red Wings coach. Saves money.

Looking into the long awaited homestand...Oilers Saturday, Flyers Sunday.

Why was Danault out last game of trip?
Will Moore be ready? He was never placed on IR
Will Arty be recalled? He's played 4 games with Reign and only 1 assist. But a GW shootout goal.
Will they go with 11/7, if all of the above 3 can play? I say send Lee back now. Has not looked so good. Helenius has looked ok, but should have buried that chance last game. (or game before, can't recall)

Trade freeze ended. Lots of chatter and several teams looking to make changes.
NYR rumors they are going to look very different by deadline.
Kreider scratched. Lots of fans saying Zibanejad is dialing it in...or playing lackluster.
Mtl sucking. Although Laine scoring a lot of goals. Looks like Savard may go to a team looking for D veteran
Sabres. Lots of rumors. Cozens, possibly Byram.
Detroit. Some rumors they may be willing to deal Larkin...but I bet that's on hold, with Todd
coming in and assessing things and making his mark. I do wonder if TMac would be interested
in any King players?
The whole JT Miller, Pettersson fued. I see one of them going, probably Miller back to the NYR?

I see the Kings not involved, until closer to the deadline and see how things are with Doughty
and seeing if Arty can play and if he's a factor. On the other hand, I could see a minor deal if any team wants Arty. 1 assist in 4 AHL games, will not bring a lot of interest. Possibly if the Kings have a target in mind, they may do something soon, as several of the better players / options will be long gone before the deadline. When Drew returns, will the Kings move a D? Or just waive England, who may already have played his last game as a King, without Drew back even.

Is Doughty even skating? I thought at the time of his surgery, the timeline was around now for his return. He seems to heal slow...his broken wrist bothered him over 1 year and was not fully healed.

On another note...congrads to Carter George! Great performance. If he wins gold and is a big factor in that...GMs may be looking to fleece Blake for George, for a 33 yr old 20 goal scorer for George and a #1 or #2. Barf.

 

[Surf Nutz]