Proposal: Anaheim and Montréal

[RationalExpectations]

"Comtois has had one good season since he was drafted 5 years ago" could really not be a more disingenuous choice of phrasing. The truth is in fact quite the opposite, Comtois is having his first bad season since being drafted.

Draft+1 - Breakout offensive year in the QMJHL registering 45 G 41 A in 54 games, also six points in seven WJC. Couldn't really have asked or expected a better 18 year old season.

D+2 - Earns a trial look in the Ducks lineup to start the year as a 19 year old and manages to put up 7 points in 10 games. Sent back down to the Q where he posts even more dominant numbers than the year prior, also captains Canada at the WJC. Overall, another excellent season to round out his junior career.

D+3 - Very good season split between the AHL and NHL as a 20 year old first year pro.

D+4 - Leads the Ducks in scoring with 33 points in 55 games, which would just under a 50 point pace for a full season. All but four of his points at 5on5 I might add.

D+5 - This year

The two are the same age and may be having similar struggles at the moment but Comtois has shown so much more at the NHL level, both in terms of total production and peak performance. Calling last year his only good season in five years, could not have been more of a false statement. For a player drafted late 2nd round, just how good would he have needed to be to as a prospect in order to have met your standards for having a "good season" ?

Obviously meant one good NHL season. D+1/D+2 I agree with your statement that he was good with the Q. D+3 I disagree regarding very good season, the numbers are good, not very good (I admit I am not following the Gulls closely though). D+4 is the year I mentioned as good indeed. This year is bad we agree on that right ?

I am not sure why you bring up the fact he was a mid/late 2nd ? This was 5 years ago, nobody cares right now. We care about what he is today in his D+5 and that's not what people expected two years ago or at the end of last year. Maybe he becomes a great Top 6 forward for the ducks, maybe not.

By the way I did not say Comtois has a lower value than Poehling at all (he does not to be clear), I just said he does not have the value of a quasi late 1st (33 OA) + Poehling (whom I have no idea how to value but that MTL will value more than the acquirer given their awful C depth)

 

[Number 57]

One is going through a sophomore slump and likely just needs an offseason to clear his head, or at worst, a shakeup trade to a team willing to take him on as a reclamation project. The other is a guy who barely cracked the NHL due to injuries and a lack of team depth. Only one of these two players has much of a chance of being a top six option going forward. Potential top line forward, vs a probable 3rd line forward. There needs to be significant pieces added to even it up.

Both are trending to be 3rd liners. At least Poehling is a center. The Habs arent adding an early 2nd to that trade

 

[WhatTheDuck]

So a young player had an outlier season, pacing for 49 points and then revert back to his normal self and he’s supposed to keep his worth? I personally would be very hesitant to even give what is basically going to be a first round pick in our second, let alone add to get Comtois

If there are two pieces of data in a set, how can you declare one the outlier? Comtois paced for 49 points in his first season as a full time NHLer at age 21/22. To call that an outlier now that he's struggling in year two, is just flat out misuse of the term.

Based on the way Comtois developed and performed in the first three years post draft, last year's performance was hardly any sort of surprise but rather an expected step forward from a very good young prospect. If anything, this year is very much the outlier compared to the way Comtois had been coming along the four years prior.

 

[ManofSteel55]

Both are trending to be 3rd liners. At least Poehling is a center. The Habs arent adding an early 2nd to that trade

One of them has shown the ability to be more than a 3rd liner.

 

[ManofSteel55]

Both the same age, one had an outlier season and went back to his normal self and is now a regular guest in the press box. The other one battled injuries for two years and is now healthy and showing he is at the very least a solid 3rd line center with possibilities to be a very good top 6 two way center if he continue to progress.

See how easy it is to write a narrative when you want to put player A on a pedestal and make player B look bad.

I have no vested interest here at all. Not a fan of either team particularly. Hell, the Ducks are in my teams division and I have far more ill will towards them than the Habs. I don't know either guy personally. I have absolutely no reason to put one player on a pedestal and make the other look bad, so I'm not sure why you would assume that ridiculousness is my goal here. Comtois just looks to have far more offensive skill and upside to me, so let's not read too much into it.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

Obviously meant one good NHL season. D+1/D+2 I agree with your statement that he was good with the Q. D+3 I disagree regarding very good season, the numbers are good, not very good (I admit I am not following the Gulls closely though). D+4 is the year I mentioned as good indeed. This year is bad we agree on that right ?

I am not sure why you bring up the fact he was a mid/late 2nd ? This was 5 years ago, nobody cares right now. We care about what he is today in his D+5 and that's not what people expected two years ago or at the end of last year. Maybe he becomes a great Top 6 forward for the ducks, maybe not.

By the way I did not say Comtois has a lower value than Poehling at all (he does not to be clear), I just said he does not have the value of a quasi late 1st (33 OA) + Poehling (whom I have no idea how to value but that MTL will value more than the acquirer given their awful C depth)

Like I said, very disingenuous phrasing to say he's only had one good year out of five since being drafted, when he's in fact had four good seasons and just one bad, overall performing well beyond reasonable expectations for his draft position. It wouldn't have been a reasonable expectation for him to be putting up good NHL season in the first three of those five seasons. His development had been quite excellent right up until this year, which is only his second NHL season. We're not talking about a 26 year old who has one good NHL year out of five.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

Like I said, very disingenuous phrasing to say he's only had one good year out of five since being drafted, when he's in fact had four good seasons and just one bad, overall performing well beyond reasonable expectations for his draft position. It wouldn't have been a reasonable expectation for him to be putting up good NHL season in the first three of those five seasons. His development had been quite excellent right up until this year, which is only his second NHL season. We're not talking about a 26 year old who has one good NHL year out of five.

Ya but how do you buy low if you phrase it like that…. It’s better to try to bring him down to poehlings lvl and hope people just agree

 

[Baksfamous112]

If there are two pieces of data in a set, how can you declare one the outlier? Comtois paced for 49 points in his first season as a full time NHLer at age 21/22. To call that an outlier now that he's struggling in year two, is just flat out misuse of the term.

Based on the way Comtois developed and performed in the first three years post draft, last year's performance was hardly any sort of surprise but rather an expected step forward from a very good young prospect. If anything, this year is very much the outlier compared to the way Comtois had been coming along the four years prior.

His first NHL season he paced for 31 points. His second NHL season he paced for 49 points. His third? He’s at a 21 points pace. What you seem to fail to acknowledge is a player development is not linear. It doesn’t always go up because they are young. The fact that he’s playing this bad this year makes me believe last year was not what one can expect from Comtois in the future and I certainly would be very, very reluctant to give two 2nd round pick (one being a very high one) and another young NHL asset for him as the poster I was responding to mentioned.

I have no vested interest here at all. Not a fan of either team particularly. Hell, the Ducks are in my teams division and I have far more ill will towards them than the Habs. I don't know either guy personally. I have absolutely no reason to put one player on a pedestal and make the other look bad, so I'm not sure why you would assume that ridiculousness is my goal here. Comtois just looks to have far more offensive skill and upside to me, so let's not read too much into it.

No, you don’t but that also tells me you know practically nothing about the players involved and probably see them a couple of times a year when they play the Oilers. You seem to base your opinion on the players reputation you read from this board, which is totally unbiased, right?

 

[WhatTheDuck]

His first NHL season he paced for 31 points. His second NHL season he paced for 49 points. His third? He’s at a 21 points pace. What you seem to fail to acknowledge is a player development is not linear. It doesn’t always go up because they are young. The fact that he’s playing this bad this year makes me believe last year was not what one can expect from Comtois in the future and I certainly would be very, very reluctant to give two 2nd round pick (one being a very high one) and another young NHL asset for him as the poster I was responding to mentioned.



No, you don’t but that also tells me you know practically nothing about the players involved and probably see them a couple of times a year when they play the Oilers. You seem to base your opinion on the players reputation you read from this board, which is totally unbiased, right?

He paced for 31 points in his "first season" which was only a 29 game stint as a 20 year old rookie. This year has played 35 games wrapped around a hand surgery.

So to summarize, you think we should judge him based on the 64 games you've chosen, and write off the 55 games from last year as an outlier.

Someone with an understanding of player development would be less dismissive of nearly half the sample we have on this player.

 

[Doc5]

One of them has shown the ability to be more than a 3rd liner.

lol Poehling is played as a fourth liner with 4th line minutes, what more do you expect? Compare their numbers in the AHL when both were placed in more offensive roles.


You may not have vested interest in any club but you clearly lack knowledge with regards to one club.

 

[CWP]

Honestly, I would be willing to deal Calgary’s first and a contract for Comtois and a later round pick (like a 4th-5th).

But I imagine it would be idiotic for Anaheim to take that deal...

 

[jfhabs]

One is going through a sophomore slump and likely just needs an offseason to clear his head, or at worst, a shakeup trade to a team willing to take him on as a reclamation project. The other is a guy who barely cracked the NHL due to injuries and a lack of team depth. Only one of these two players has much of a chance of being a top six option going forward. Potential top line forward, vs a probable 3rd line forward. There needs to be significant pieces added to even it up.

Comtois doesnt have top line potential. I'd say 2nd line winger VS 3rd line center as a more appropriate potential comparaison.

 

[LuckyDucky]

This MTL pick is basically a late first (33-35 OA). Comtois has had one good season since he was drafted 5 years ago. I don't think he holds that much value. I think MTL does not do it because of the risk associated. I think ANA does not do it hoping Comtois performs similarly to what he did last year in the future.

By the way I am not saying Poehling has great value either. He has been also quite disappointing since being drafted.

How many good seasons has Poehling had?

 

[RationalExpectations]

How many good seasons has Poehling had?

None why ? Again look at the message I don t see him as being the problem in the trade for MTL.

 

[TBF1972]

Ya but how do you buy low if you phrase it like that…. It’s better to try to bring him down to poehlings lvl and hope people just agree

the number of people in this thread trying to win a fantasy trade, which will never happen anyway, by using dishonest arguments is telling. lack of hockey knowledge kills any meaningfull discussions.

 

[Natey]

Not a chance as a Montreal fan.

 

[Habs Halifax]

I value both Poehling and Comtois but I pass on this trade. Personally, I don't see much future difference between these two on the ice and the Habs are not trading our early 2nd rounder in order to sweeten this deal.

Habs have one of the deepest grade B/B+ prospects in the NHL at the moment. We need to focus on trying to add some Grade A prospects and trading an early 2nd is not happening

 

[ManofSteel55]

No, you don’t but that also tells me you know practically nothing about the players involved and probably see them a couple of times a year when they play the Oilers. You seem to base your opinion on the players reputation you read from this board, which is totally unbiased, right?

No, that isn't right actually. I watch hockey with other teams involved. I follow prospects. I base my opinion of the players based on what I see of them when I watch them play. Do I watch every game? No, but neither does anyone else.

And for what its worth, I could use your exact argument to show why you have no idea what Comtois is all about and asert that you are nothing more than a homer with a crush on Poehling, but personal attacks don't get us very far and only lead to arguments rather than intelligent discourse. Try better.

 

[danyhabsfan]

I wouldnt trade our 2nd rounder (33rd-35th pick) for Comtois and I wouldn't trade Poehling for a 2023 3rd round (75th pick approx)
(they have no 3rd rounder this year BTW)

 

[Gliff]

No reason for the Ducks to make this trade. Comtois has shown he can be a top 6 forward, Poehling has not.
I would rather take a shot on Comtois just having a rebound year then move up from the 3rd round to the 2nd.

And it seems like noone wants to make this trade.

 

[DaPhazz]

meh, better keep the 2nd

 

[McJedi]

Habs trade
Ryan Poehling
2nd round pick

Anaheim trade
Max Comtois
3rd round pick

Maybe just make it this. 2nd round pick for Comtois.

 

[Nico Cauzuki]

pass from this habs fan always thought Comtois was overrated since hes Q days

 

[HuGort]

Habs trade
Ryan Poehling
2nd round pick

Anaheim trade
Max Comtois
3rd round pick

I would rather have a center than winger. I think Comtois doesn't play center. lol no sure.

Wingers not that hard to get. Waiver wire like a Pitlick or free agent like a Toffoli or Hoffman

 

[lwvs84]

Ducks already have Zegras and Lundestrom down the middle and should have McTavish soon, all of them are/should be better players than Poehling. Ducks need Comtois to get back to doing what he did last season. Between the surgery, Covid, and being lost in the shuffle, he just hasn't been able to get in the rhythm this season. Ducks are better off holding on to him and letting him get back in shape next season. He's been producing more recently, which is a good sign.