Post-Game Talk: An official loss

[oobga]

Skinner so easily loses concentration. he's trying to communicate with an offical in 3 on 3 OT to get a stoppage. Officials often don't allow such stoppage in 3 on 3 as possession is such a bomb in this format. Its not as easy as milking a mask loose stoppage in regulation time. So instead of tracking the play properly Skinner just distracted, gets scored on seconds later losing his net. In OT.

Oilers are almost a cheat code in OT except they have Skinner in net.

Now I'm watching Askarov looking like a legend again compared to Fred Skinner.

Just shake the helmet off. So simple. It’s a safety issue. Any scramble around the net and your loose helmet could come off outside your control and end up with you being in serious danger. Easy solution. Shake it off and end the play yourself. No ref an argue with it if you do that. Mike Smith never let a loose helmet stay on his head for more than a second after he realized it was loose. Skinner needed to grow a brain in OT.

 

[Jumptheshark]

Well we get a point

 

[guymez]

They just don't have any pushback for when games get physical. Though I supose swapping Skinner for Kane should address most of those issues.

On that note, they really need to end the Jeff Skinner experiment. Skinner-Henrique just doesn't work: Too small and too slow. It also doesn't help that the 3rd line suddenly starts looking like world beaters when they go back to Henrique with Janmark and Brown...

It's fine to say Kapanen has stolen his spot as the "tweener" offensive option and call it a day.

Why have a young fast effective player like McLeod when you can have a 35+ player in Henrique.
I mean at least Henrique hits....am I right?

Agreed with your take on Kapanen. He has shown more in his short stint with the team than Skinner has shown all season.

Lastly...I havent read many posts in this PGT that has encapsulted the game as well as you did.
This team just doesnt handle these types of games very well. Thats especially true with this top 6.
Putting Skinner there makes that problem noticably worse.
Kanes presence is sorely missed.

That aside I think that Knoblauch was outcoached in this game, McDavid was virtuallly invisible at 5x5 and the Kings 3rd line led by Foegele dominated. They have a big physical team and the Oilers struggle to match that. Very sloppy defensive effort too.
They also didnt have an answer for Byfield who pretty much did what he wanted. The Oilers parted like the red sea and offered up open lanes to the net for Byfield too often.
Ridiculous to watch.

The Kings also outhit the Oilers 25-13 but being badly outhit in every single game doesnt seem to matter at all to Knoblauch.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Too bad nobody ever offersheeted Stu Skinner. Like anybody would.

Just detest this guy. Oilers still in a logjam nearly half way into season because our #1 is 13-11 while playing on a great team. Basically we'd be out of a playoff spot if Skinner had all the games. Pickard is 8-3 and at least getting the results. Sure slightly weaker opposition but lets remember Skinner shitting the bed against clubs like Columbus.

2 of Pickards losses were due to the Oilers failing to score. Meaning that he's got only 1 loss when the Oilers have scored.

 

[Dieseloil]

He sometimes "loses the net." On that OT winner he was way off to the right?? Or did somebody else see it differently?

Nurse playing goal was partly responsible for sure. Happens a lot. Instead of rushing the man he backs in and takes a knee. Never works.

 

[bellagiobob]

Just shake the helmet off. So simple. It’s a safety issue. Any scramble around the net and your loose helmet could come off outside your control and end up with you being in serious danger. Easy solution. Shake it off and end the play yourself. No ref an argue with it if you do that. Mike Smith never let a loose helmet stay on his head for more than a second after he realized it was loose. Skinner needed to grow a brain in OT.

It's the Oilers, we would have definitely got a delay of game penalty under rule 10.1(a).

 

[bobbythebrain]

Why have a young fast effective player like McLeod when you can have a 35+ player in Henrique.
I mean at least Henrique hits....am I right?

Agreed with your take on Kapanen. He has shown more in his short stint with the team than Skinner has shown all season.

Lastly...I havent read many posts in this PGT that has encapsulted the game as well as you did.
This team just doesnt handle these types of games very well. Thats especially true with this top 6.
Putting Skinner there makes that problem noticably worse.
Kanes presence is sorely missed.

That aside I think that Knoblauch was outcoached in this game, McDavid was virtuallly invisible at 5x5 and the Kings 3rd line led by Foegele dominated. They have a big physical team and the Oilers struggle to match that. Very sloppy defensive effort too.
They also didnt have an answer for Byfield who pretty much did what he wanted. The Oilers parted like the red sea and offered up open lanes to the net for Byfield too often.
Ridiculous to watch.

The Kings also outhit the Oilers 25-13 but being badly outhit in every single game doesnt seem to matter at all to Knoblauch.

Kappy has had waaaaaaaay more opportunity than Skinner. Not even close

 

[Soundwave]

Kappy has had waaaaaaaay more opportunity than Skinner. Not even close

Knob is clearly a way better defensive coach than Woodcroft (either that or Coffey is). No doubts there.

But offensively I think he's probably not a great coach. It's just masked by McDavid and Draisaitl.

Woodcroft is a better offensive coach most likely. Given that we do have McDavid and Draisaitl, we came ahead in the balance of things.

 

[Spawn]

Knob is clearly a way better defensive coach than Woodcroft (either that or Coffey is). No doubts there.

But offensively I think he's probably not a great coach. It's just masked by McDavid and Draisaitl.

Woodcroft is a better offensive coach most likely. Given that we do have McDavid and Draisaitl, we came ahead in the balance of things.

The difference in offense between the two coaches is miniscule, and entirely due to our PP not being as effective under Knoblauch vs under Woodcroft. But Gulutzan has run the PP the entire time under both of them, so not sure that's really Knobs fault. At 5v5 the goal scoring rates are essentially identical and the team actually scores very slightly better in all ES situations now than they did with Woodcroft. Our offense was elite under Woodcroft and it's elite under Knoblauch.

You're right though about Knob being better defensively though. Under Woodcroft we were an average defensive team, 15th in the league in GA over his tenure as head coach. With Knob we're 5th.

 

[TheNumber4]

Foegele is such a tool. Scream more after every point like you’ve never been there. He definitely hasn’t in the playoffs, but he acted tonight was April and not December.

Dude rides Draisaitls coat-tails to a career contract. Gets his stats inflated so for one measly year he looks like he outperformed his contract in Edmonton. But then he does f*** all for the 3rd playoffs in a row.

It’ll be funny when we sweep them in the playoffs. Not that it’ll matter to Foegele, he was planning to do f*** all in the playoffs again anyways.

 

[TheNumber4]

No Own Goal streak by Nurse over. Shows up right when he has a bad game too.

Rico don’t back check or what?

I’ll give him a pass on that missed poke check in OT. But not for the missed coverage earlier.

 

[Trafalgar Sadge Law]

Why would they put Henrique out there. Playing for a tie because he is going to create zero offence

Coming into this game, kind of expected a loss. Figured LA would be more motivated to try and get the win.

1 point better than nothing

But still sucks that the team is up going into the third period. They always play like their happy to get it to OT, even when they are winning.

Team lacks mojo. They rarely impose their will on the other team. They are content to try and run out the clock in a defensive shell.

Henrique dash 4 today. He wasn’t putting up offense but wasn’t getting scored on. Not today.

Henrique not being on the ice for a lot of goals wasn't even because he was good defensively. In fact he was a scoring chance against machine all season. Happens when you get hemmed in your own zone more than Jeff skinner and extend defensive shifts, making everyone on the ice with you more tired and perform worse. The only thing keeping him positive before last night was his team leading PDO of 103 and team leading on ice save percentage of 0.938 (which as we see with skinner today, was clearly just unsustainable luck and not our inconsistent goalie being hasek). The goals against today were just regression towards the mean.

The Oilers downgraded at 3c this season. People are just coping.

 

[Whoshattenkirkshoes]

The dream is toast. They’re not going to catch Vegas without another lengthy winning streak.

Management for this team can f*** off.

There is over half a season left...

 

[Whoshattenkirkshoes]

Big time. We are older, slower and softer. Jackson blew it up this offseason, and it's a disaster. McDrai has been supporting the D at a level we have never seen before, which is obscuring how big of step backwards we took imo.

How good would a fast defensively responsible 25 yr old on a 2 million contract look right now? How about a fast, gritty, goalscorer for Leon at 2.3 million?


JSkinner costs 3 million to tank the third line so someone might trade for him. I like Arvy, but not at the cost of Holloway, and we are in win-now mode but traded Mcleod for 5'10 magic beans that is looking a hell of a lot like XB right now.

The answer was clearly Arvidsson and Holloway.

Losing Holloway was the big problem here. Foegele would have been the same old crap.

 

[FlameChampion]

Henrique not being on the ice for a lot of goals wasn't even because he was good defensively. In fact he was a scoring chance against machine all season. Happens when you get hemmed in your own zone more than Jeff skinner and extend defensive shifts, making everyone on the ice with you more tired and perform worse. The only thing keeping him positive before last night was his team leading PDO of 103 and team leading on ice save percentage of 0.938 (which as we see with skinner today, was clearly just unsustainable luck and not our inconsistent goalie being hasek). The goals against today were just regression towards the mean.

The Oilers downgraded at 3c this season. People are just coping.

Can’t really disagree with you. Henrique has been dissapointing this year. I think he needs some speed on his wings. JSkinner is a bad combination with him. Henrique at this point might be better on the wing.

I don’t really know how much of a downgrade he is from McLeod though. I don’t think McLeod was much of a 3C either. Seemed better on the wing. Him and Foegele couldn’t produce together on the third line.

 

[McFlash97]

Jeff Skinner does not fit with this team. I'm not sure what this wacko management is waiting on ? Offload the player. Free up cap. He isn't physical and fast enough for the bottom 6 and too perimeter and small for the top 6, meanwhile being too slow to backcheck or forecheck. Just a bad signing.

 

[Heavy Dee]

Jeff Skinner does not fit with this team. I'm not sure what this wacko management is waiting on ? Offload the player. Free up cap. He isn't physical and fast enough for the bottom 6 and too perimeter and small for the top 6, meanwhile being too slow to backcheck or forecheck. Just a bad signing.

He has a full NMC.

Question is, does he want to win or play on a lesser team?

 

[Soundwave]

Jeff Skinner does not fit with this team. I'm not sure what this wacko management is waiting on ? Offload the player. Free up cap. He isn't physical and fast enough for the bottom 6 and too perimeter and small for the top 6, meanwhile being too slow to backcheck or forecheck. Just a bad signing.

Team has played the guy with McDavid for like 5 minutes total during the season.

The Oilers can't really say they've given this an honest look even if he isn't a long term fit.

This team loves to not try things. Guys like Kesselring got no chance, Broberg's development was put on the back burner because the team was in love with an AHL stiff named Desharnais (lol), they signed Skinner to be a top 6 forward and now won't let him play in the top 6.

If Knob was going to behave this way he should have said something on July 1 before they spent money on this player. This isn't how championship teams conduct themselves, Florida took washed out players like Reinhart, OEL, and Montour and played them to their strengths and made them major parts of a Cup winning team.

This team tries something for 5 minutes, decides it will never work, and then cries that they have no cap space. Meanwhile other things like Skinner being a star starter in the Oilers eyes never wavers no matter how much evidence piles up against it.

 

[Soundwave]

The difference in offense between the two coaches is miniscule, and entirely due to our PP not being as effective under Knoblauch vs under Woodcroft. But Gulutzan has run the PP the entire time under both of them, so not sure that's really Knobs fault. At 5v5 the goal scoring rates are essentially identical and the team actually scores very slightly better in all ES situations now than they did with Woodcroft. Our offense was elite under Woodcroft and it's elite under Knoblauch.

You're right though about Knob being better defensively though. Under Woodcroft we were an average defensive team, 15th in the league in GA over his tenure as head coach. With Knob we're 5th.

I think Woodcroft got more out of players like Kostin, Bjugstad, McLeod, etc. That one year in 22-23 when we had like 13 double digit goal scorers (and like 15+ who scored at a 10+ goal rate) or whatever and McDavid hit 60+ goals, Leon with 50+, RNH with 37 goals (!) and 100+ points, Hyman with 36 goals. He also handled Kane a bit better too I thought not taking the bait and just burying him in the bottom 6, I remember when Kane was pouting a bit for being demoted he handled it really smartly with the media by not trashing the player and instead said he liked Kane's response about being pissed off because it shows he wants to play higher up the lineup. And Kane responded well to that.

Stuff like that Woody did well, I think Knob is a bit clueless about nurturing players, forwards especially.

I think Woody would have gotten better production out of Skinner and Arvidsson.

But defensively he sucked.

 

[Fourier]

Why have a young fast effective player like McLeod when you can have a 35+ player in Henrique.
I mean at least Henrique hits....am I right?

Agreed with your take on Kapanen. He has shown more in his short stint with the team than Skinner has shown all season.

Lastly...I havent read many posts in this PGT that has encapsulted the game as well as you did.
This team just doesnt handle these types of games very well. Thats especially true with this top 6.
Putting Skinner there makes that problem noticably worse.
Kanes presence is sorely missed.

That aside I think that Knoblauch was outcoached in this game, McDavid was virtuallly invisible at 5x5 and the Kings 3rd line led by Foegele dominated. They have a big physical team and the Oilers struggle to match that. Very sloppy defensive effort too.
They also didnt have an answer for Byfield who pretty much did what he wanted. The Oilers parted like the red sea and offered up open lanes to the net for Byfield too often.
Ridiculous to watch.

The Kings also outhit the Oilers 25-13 but being badly outhit in every single game doesnt seem to matter at all to Knoblauch.

I love physical hockey but you really need to be careful with hit stats. The Oilers are a team that dominates possession with their top six. Such teams tend to lose the hit battle substantially even if they have physical guys. There are exceptions. Florida is one. But there are other aspects of physical play that probably matter much more than hit totals. The Oilers for example do very good job on the forecheck and win a lot of board battles particularly in the offensive zone.

Draisaitl is last on the team in hits/60 with 0.72 hist/60. Would anyone say that Draisaitl is not a physical player or that he wilts under physical play. Zach Hyman has fewer hits per game than Elias Pettersson. Which player is better in a physical game. Ty Emberson has way more hits per game than Ekholm. But which one is actually "more physical" in the ways that matter?

Bottom line, so far the Oilers are 10-2-1 vs the teams in the top 10 in hits per game. The only losses were to Florida and New Jersey.

 

[iCanada]

So even if we're not getting an upgrade on Skinner via trade - at what point does he lose his job to the backup whose been playing way better hockey ask year?

The Oilers didn't get a big save all game. Which fair enough I guess, Skinner had to save his energy for the post game yelling match with the refs.

 

[Throttlehead]

The answer was clearly Arvidsson and Holloway.

Losing Holloway was the big problem here. Foegele would have been the same old crap.

Foegele being the same old crap was a big fast guy who had 20 goals and 41 points. I will take that any day to additions we brought in this year. We lost a ton of speed and some size with Holloway, Foegele, and McLeod leaving. All three were younger guys that you know will get better, and we swapped that for older guys in hopes they can repeat some of their best past years. It was a mistake.

We were one goal away, why change that many players when we could have signed them all?

 

[guymez]

I love physical hockey but you really need to be careful with hit stats. The Oilers are a team that dominates possession with their top six. Such teams tend to lose the hit battle substantially even if they have physical guys. There are exceptions. Florida is one. But there are other aspects of physical play that probably matter much more than hit totals. The Oilers for example do very good job on the forecheck and win a lot of board battles particularly in the offensive zone.

Draisaitl is last on the team in hits/60 with 0.72 hist/60. Would anyone say that Draisaitl is not a physical player or that he wilts under physical play. Zach Hyman has fewer hits per game than Elias Pettersson. Which player is better in a physical game. Ty Emberson has way more hits per game than Ekholm. But which one is actually "more physical" in the ways that matter?

Bottom line, so far the Oilers are 10-2-1 vs the teams in the top 10 in hits per game. The only losses were to Florida and New Jersey.

I think that the hit stats in a general sense suggest that this team is pretty soft.

My concern with this team is that they can get pushed out of games by physical teams.

 

[TB12]

I think Woodcroft got more out of players like Kostin, Bjugstad, McLeod, etc. That one year in 22-23 when we had like 13 double digit goal scorers (and like 15+ who scored at a 10+ goal rate) or whatever and McDavid hit 60+ goals, Leon with 50+, RNH with 37 goals (!) and 100+ points, Hyman with 36 goals. He also handled Kane a bit better too I thought not taking the bait and just burying him in the bottom 6, I remember when Kane was pouting a bit for being demoted he handled it really smartly with the media by not trashing the player and instead said he liked Kane's response about being pissed off because it shows he wants to play higher up the lineup. And Kane responded well to that.

Stuff like that Woody did well, I think Knob is a bit clueless about nurturing players, forwards especially.

I think Woody would have gotten better production out of Skinner and Arvidsson.

But defensively he sucked.

Do us a favour and just copy-paste this and put it in today's GDT and PGT. It's just the same posts over and over and over.

 

[Fourier]

I think that the hit stats in a general sense suggest that this team is pretty soft.

My concern with this team is that they can get pushed out of games by physical teams.

I actually disagree. The hit stats are not a reliable indicator of a team's ability to play in a physical environment. If they were you would have proof that Guys like Draisaitl and Hyman, or even McDavid were soft as butter. Do you think they are?

There are 415 forwards who have played 15+ games this year. Loen is 398th on the hit rate list. By the way Koptar is 396th on that list. He is another guy that I doubt many would call soft.