Tennis: All Purpose Tennis Thread XVI

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kihei

McEnroe: The older I get, the better I used to be.
Jun 14, 2006
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Why do you think it was the right call?

Regardless, in the era of instant replay a match shouldn't have to be decided by an umpire who probably lost track of the ball.i
I didn't see the double bounce on the replay. To me it looked like Draper shanked an in-tight half volley and lucked out when the ball just barely fluttered over the net. Tons of observers seem to disagree with me, though.

The guy who knows for sure is Draper. Every player has been in situations like that, and ever player knows damn well exactly what happened.

Agree completely with your final paragraph.

That is the second controversy (third controversy, actually--Fritz and Shapo) that chair umpire has been in in roughly the past ten days, the others being a botched line call if I remember correctly.
 
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PanniniClaus

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I didn't see the double bounce on the replay. To me it looked like Draper shanked an in-tight half volley and lucked out when the ball just barely fluttered over the net. Tons of observers seem to disagree with me, though.

The guy who knows for sure is Draper. Every player has been in situations like that, and ever player knows damn well exactly what happened.

Agree completely with your final paragraph.

That is the second controversy (third controversy, actually--Fritz and Shapo) that chair umpire has been in in roughly the past ten days, the other being a botched line call if I remember correctly.
In a "gentleman's sport" I have always felt players should self report on those. As you said... a player always knows and now everyone knows that Draper got away with one.
 
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kihei

McEnroe: The older I get, the better I used to be.
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Cincy blessed with two stellar semifinals. Sinner defeated Zverev 7-6, 5-7, 7-6 in a match in which neither player could establish dominance for long. In the end, Sinner's nerve management was a little better than Zverev's, and that ended up being the slimmest of differences.

Meanwhile, Tiafoe knocked off Rune also 7-6 in the third behind a string of magnificent escapes that included match points saved, break points averted, and three lucky net chords that just barely fell into the right side of the court for Foe at the most crucial times.
 
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kihei

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Sabalenka beats Swiatek 3 and 3, no surprise on this surface really. What was surprising is that it took Aryna 10 match points to do it.
 

ZachaFlockaFlame

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Great showing from Sabalenka this week in Cincy, I think everyone should throw a few bucks her way to winning the US Open since Coco's game has gone to the wayside, Iga can't play on any surface in 2024 besides clay and Rybakina is consistently withdrawing from tournaments with illness.

As for the men, gritty effort from Sinner but I can't see how he survives in a BO5 setting with his hip looking like it is. I think if he gets it in better shape within this next week he has the best chance obviously but who knows what happens in game.

Obvious winners US open: Sinner/Saba

Wild cards winners: Collins (she plays well on hard court and you know she probably wants a grand slam in her retirement year) + Zverev (he's still hunting for the big one, guy has the worst mental in the sport but that serve of his will keep him in any match on hard court imo)

Also obviously Nole/Carlos are the next up on the men's side but not sure both fare on that court come next week. In Novak's case, coming back from the Olympics to a different surface and this being the first in game action he sees since and Carlos's case, not looking the greatest in Cincy and the courts supposedly are slower but still play fast after coming from the surface change from the Olympics and not looking that great against Monfils last week later in the match.
 

kihei

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Tiafoe's has a tendency to fade fast when he feels he's not up to a comeback. Still, nice confidence builder for Sinner going into the US Open. He now has some major breathing room at #1 between himself and his closest competitors, Djokovic and Alcaraz. Given a decent run in New York, Sinner will be odds on favourite to end the year at the top.
 
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17futurecap

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Oct 8, 2008
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It seems crazy they settled the case that quick, and then the story never got out until now.

Players seem rightfully pissed.
 

Vasilevskiy

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Dec 30, 2008
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It seems crazy they settled the case that quick, and then the story never got out until now.

Players seem rightfully pissed.
Waited until Olympics finished likely

As usual in any other sport that's not athletics and cycling, they do like nothing has happened here and moving on.
I'm glad some players are speaking against it. He should be banned for 2 years.
 

Pavel Buchnevich

"Pavel Buchnevich The Fake"
Dec 8, 2013
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How did he get away with this? An absolute travesty.

It's incomprehensible actually he tests positive twice for steroids and he's allowed to continue because he didn't know (or something) and they didn't find much tangible performance enhancing (when it was probably exiting his system), but there are guys they'll suspend 18 months because they missed tests where there was no actual finding of a positive test for banned substances.

What happened here is that he's too big to ban. Tennis doesn't want to lose one of their top 3 players for two years. If he was ranked 100, easy ban no questions asked.
 
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Ben Grimm

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kihei

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I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall when someone broke the Sinner news to Simona Halep.

And so how does this work, then?: "However, he will lose his 400 ranking points and $325,000 prize money from Indian Wells."--BBC

Yes, the amount of the banned substance may have been minuscule, but this reeks of a really greasy double standard. I can't think of another instance in which the so-called International Tennis Integrity Agency has acted with such nuance and discretion in regard to its own mandate which it has enforced with unbending zeal to this point. Something like a six-month suspension, with the acknowledgement of why lenience was called for in this case, would have also meant that Sinner could continue his career without this unfortunate incident hanging over his head for the rest of his days. Now that's not going to happen--fairly or not, his reputation will be tainted permanently.
 

Ben Grimm

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"However, things took a steep turn afterward. While collecting their respective pay check, a huge disparity in their prize money was witnessed. Notably, Sabalenka received half the amount as Sinner's. The men's champion minted a jaw-dropping $1,049,460 while the Belarusian walked away with merely $523,485".
 

Incubajerks

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Not my work, hope the translation is correct.

The story of accidental positivity to Clostobol involving Jannik SINNER offers some interesting insights. First of all, the non-disclosure of any information before the independent Sports Resolutions tribunal issued its ruling should represent the practice and not the exception to the rule. We must therefore ask ourselves why absolute confidentiality was maintained in this case. Certainly, the lack of a long period of forced inactivity played an important role. So, why was Jannik SINNER not stopped indefinitely despite two tests carried out within eight days giving positive results? In this case, once the ritual suspensions that are triggered in the event of a positive test have arrived, it was decided to appeal to an immediate and urgent appeal to an independent court. The favorable outcome of the appeals led to the revocation of the suspensions. In essence, it was demonstrated that the thesis of contamination without fault or negligence supported by the athlete was scientifically credible due to the small quantity of substance found in the urine. Clearly, the judges in the case made use of the opinion of a trio of medical experts, one of the reasons why appealing to independent tribunals is a rather onerous practice. However, the modus operandi of the counterpart ITIA (International Tennis Integrity Agency), the body responsible for managing the anti-doping protocol in tennis, also deserves applause, which did not give any publicity to the news as it should always happen before the issuing of the guilty or guilty verdict. absolution. At the same time, ITIA decided to take a risk, which, in light of the situation, can also be considered calculated. What, in fact, would have happened if Sport Resolutions had not cleared the tennis player? Net of a discounted appeal, all the results obtained from the day of the first offending test (10 March) to the day of the sentence (15 August) would have been cancelled, resulting in the loss of ATP points and sums of money won. Furthermore, a disqualification would have been triggered to be quantified during the trial. In conclusion, the entire management of the matter represents a demonstration of how common sense can and should be used. On a side note, it is sad to read belly attacks often without knowledge of the facts against the tennis player in question, formulated by journalists, other athletes and ordinary people. Unfortunately, the hardest part for SINNER will come right now as the mud machine is already in high gear. Having said this, the attitude shown in the last five months suggests that he will be able to come out of this in the best possible way.
 

kihei

McEnroe: The older I get, the better I used to be.
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Some interesting tidbits have come to light about this particular banned substance Closebol.

Closebol seems to be the anabolic steroid of choice among some Italian athletes, 38 of whom have tested positive for the substance between 2019 and 2023, roughly twice the total for the rest of the world.

There is a huge red warning sign related to doping on the packaging of Closebol. Hard to miss, especially, one would think, for a professional physical therapist.

Sinner's case was handled very differently than virtually everybody else's (Cilic, Jarry, Halep, Hadad Maya, Yastremska, Moore, Brooksby, Ymer), amazingly so since he tested positive twice. None of the previous players banned for doping we're able to avoid the provisional suspension that occurs immediately after they test positive. In some cases, the investigation that follows the provisional suspension has lasted longer than the actual official suspension itself, so things moved ridiculously rapidly in Jannik's case. Sinner's team managed to avoid all the usual hullabaloo, and keep the whole thing quiet--because perhaps he had better lawyers than the others or maybe just because he is a big moneymaker for the ATP and world's #1. Mammoth inconsistency in this case, no matter how one slices it. (I read one source--then quoted by pro Liam Broady--that Sinner was actually suspended a day or two for each positive test, but the days that he was suspended were off days before tournaments began. That made me laugh. If true, how can the ITIA possibly claim that they don't play favourites?)

While it is true that Darren Cahill coached both Simona Halep and Jannik Sinner, his tenure with Halep ended about a year before she tested positive for a banned substance.

Ironically, one could well argue that the way that the Sinner case was handled is the way that all such cases should be handled. But that has not been what's going on in any way, shape or form before Sinner's positive tests.

The only person who probably welcomes the news is Jack Draper who has been given a rough ride on social media lately. This will likely distract haters enough that they have a new scent to follow and now will leave him alone.
 
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ZachaFlockaFlame

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Aug 24, 2020
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Scratch the Collins thing I said earlier about a dark horse at the US Open, looked lost last night v older Andreeva sister in Sets 2/3. :laugh:

Some interesting tidbits have come to light about this particular banned substance Closebol.

Closebol seems to be the anabolic steroid of choice among some Italian athletes, 38 of whom have tested positive for the substance between 2019 and 2023, roughly twice the the total for the rest of the world.

There is a huge red warning sign related to doping on the packaging of Closebol. Hard to miss, especially, one would think, for a professional physical therapist.


Sinner's case was handled very differently than virtually everybody else's (Cilic, Jarry, Halep, Hadad Maya, Yastremska, Moore, Brooksby, Ymer), amazingly so since he tested positive twice. None of the previous players banned for doping we're able to avoid the provisional suspension that occurs immediately after they test positive. In some cases, the investigation that follows the provisional suspension has lasted longer than the actual official suspension itself, so things moved ridiculously rapidly in Jannik's case. Sinner's team managed to avoid all the usual hullabaloo, and keep the whole thing quiet--because perhaps he had better lawyers than the others or maybe just because he is a big moneymaker for the ATP and world's #1. Mammoth inconsistency in this case, no matter how one slices it. (I read one source--then quoted by pro Liam Broady--that Sinner was actually suspended a day or two for each positive test, but the days that he was suspended were off days before tournaments began. That made me laugh. If true, how can the ITIA possibly claim that they don't play favourites?)

While it is true that Darren Cahill coached both Simona Halep and Jannik Sinner, his tenure with Halep ended about a year before she tested positive for a banned substance.

Ironically, one could well argue that the way that the Sinner case was handled is the way that all such cases should be handled. But that has not been what's going on in any way, shape or form before Sinner's positive tests.

The only person who probably welcomes the news is Jack Draper who has been given a rough ride on social media lately. This will likely distract haters enough that they have a new scent to follow and now will leave him alone.

Yeah, this is the thing reading the Sinner stuff that is tough for me to understand. The ointment or whatever it has also has DOPING in big red letters on the tube/box. :laugh: I love Jannik but you can't fault people for being angry here. Halep should be the angriest seeing how this has transpired.
 

Ben Grimm

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1724434470942.png


Who's that guy on the left? ;)
 

Tuggy

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Davis Cup Finals underway. Canada, who won in 2022, is in a group with Finland, Argentina and Great Britain. Their group is playing in Manchester.

Denis and Felix won their matches today in the tie against Argentina. So Canada gets the point!
 
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kihei

McEnroe: The older I get, the better I used to be.
Jun 14, 2006
43,495
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Toronto
Davis Cup Finals underway. Canada, who won in 2022, is in a group with Finland, Argentina and Great Britain. Their group is playing in Manchester.

Denis and Felix won their matches today in the tie against Argentina. So Canada gets the point!
Wow. Argentina has a strong team. Great start, especially for Shapo.
.
 
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