Post-Game Talk: All Good Things…

[RegDunlop]

I had an asshole text from my prick of a brother in law.

"Oilers suck. Flames haven't lost this month"

Dink

 

[Drivesaitl]

1) Sorry but you are just fundamentally wrong here. I wouldn't normally pull rank here, but I'm playing three days a week (incl with recent ex-pros) and goalie coaching two other days. First, yes of course he had the short side post... as you describe "actually set" when the puck was behind the net. That's what you do. Then, when the pass comes out, he has to worry about BOTH sides of the net. If he stays hugged to the short side post, he is giving up the entire far side of the net and isn't square to the shooter or the puck. So he correctly pushes off the post toward the top of the blue paint to cut the angle. From where the shooter was, there is no way to take away all of the daylight on BOTH sides of the net. As Fuhr would say: you gotta give them something. And there wasn't much - it was a perfect shot. Maybe the televised angles are deceiving you, but from where the shooter was and where the net was, Skinner was pretty darn square. The only thing he might have done better on that shot was do a quick shoulder check prior to the pass, so that he knew exactly where the shooter was going to be... that might have let him get further out to cut the angle more, but as it were, at the moment he's turning his head to follow the pass, Ceci is coasting past him, obstructing his view (sidebar: why didn't Ceci go straight for the shooter? that would have helped take away part of the net), so he doesn't push quite as aggressively as he might normally. I would never classify that as an "error".

2) One was great and it was obvious due to his workload, he made two big errors and one small one. His defender saved him on one, he saved himself on the other. The other goalie made one small error and was punished on it, he didn't have the same workload, so of course guys like you will be quick to criticize, but scoring chances are (nearly entirely) independent of each other, so each individual event should be judged on its own ... and yes, Skinner had a couple of close calls on playing the puck (more below)

3) I agree Nurse got caught by surprise and therefore did not have (or lost) body position on the puck. So losing a battle (to a person, either outwitted, or outcompeted, or both) is more forgivable than being sniped by a puck even when you are in the right position? That puck can move faster than you can (which is mathematically true for ALL goalies) and from most shooting positions it is impossible to take away everything.Any goalie will tell you, if a guy makes his shot, he makes his shot... the art is about forcing him to be as perfect as you are. If you are both perfect, he wins... that's just the way the physics works - pucks are faster than reflexes.

4) I'm sorry but this just shows you don't understand goaltending. The whole point of angles is to be central, which in 90++% of positions there will be EQUAL room on both sides of you. That's by definition "centered on the puck". So if that is the goal, then there is no inherent difference in value of a short side vs far side goal - completely illogical notion. The only time a goalie coach would ever say "take away one side of the net" is when the puck is at or near the goal line. Skinner did that at the appropriate time on this very play, but then the pass came out to the slot... he correctly moved out and centered.

5) There were 8 high danger chances against. GAME RECAP: Golden Knights 3, Oilers 1 | Edmonton Oilers And they are all independent of each other. You judge them individually.

6) Unless it is a Mike Smith level giveaway (which these weren't) I generally care more about his play between the pipes, but fair point. My mantra here is a bit old school, but basically amounts to "do no harm, or do less". There were a couple of plays where he held the puck longer than I would like before moving it.. but it wasn't like he passed it up the middle, he rang the boards like you are meant to and it didn't connect with a teammate... this happens a few times a night for most goalies (and defenders who have two hands on the stick).

Thanks for the rundown. Interesting point on the TV angles possibly deceiving and I have to pause for thought on that. I do agree that coming out would have been better option. I disagree with your earlier assessment that there was limited time to adjust to the shot, and a situational awareness of what is going to be a shot is improving with Skinner. I note he's been coming out more cutting off angles when a shot is the one play available. But he didn't make that adjustment on this one. He does seem to struggle with passes from behind net. No doubt opponents will scout that.

I disagree somewhat with 4 and perhaps because in goal I was left hand glove hand. I had a good glove hand and would challenge shots there. My weakness would be short side blocker side, and jmo, its harder to react to those shots and its a shorter point of going in. In addition extra bias on that because I've also been a Football goalie. In Football the shortside shot even more dangerous. So that you have to cheat shortside somewhat because its easier for ball to be slotted in there. Its easier to score shortside. Not sure why you missed that point.

As far as 6 one possible inconsistency is you're saying that Hill made mistakes that were fouls but your count on Skinner is that the same or similar miscues are no harm no foul. One thing I noted though that Skinner does a fair bit is when he doesn't know where a puck is he freezes so as not to knock it in his own net. This sometimes works but in a recent game an opponent was able to fish behind and just knock the puck in. That Skinner often doesn't know where the puck is and doesn't have it frozen is at times a concern. This is just one example where your mistake count can be not detecting error.

As far as Nurse I don't think you're being fair. Lets say Nurse handles 20 forecheck situations well and manages to win those. But he loses a couple, and in what could even be several 50-50 situations where one or the other is going to gain puck, the whole point of a forecheck being the possibility there of. Nurse was a Star in the game and deservedly. He was excellent on the night deftly dealing with rush after rush, dump after dump. He gets caught on the one and you're nailing him on it. D lose battles, they all do. Nurse happened to lose that one. Ceci did nothing on the play and Foegele, right in position didn't cover the passing lane. Skinner left what i thought was ample shortside room, where the shot went.

 

[Yuke]

Watched the whole damn game. If you people can't figure out that this team currently doesn't have an answer for the VGK then I can't help you either.

It feels like groundhog day in here every year. "We had them, just some posts and Hill coming up big from us winning 5-2." "We dominated, just unlucky, it's just one game."

Here's some quotes, are they from this game or last years playoffs?:

- "Just shoot it Connor, c'mon."
- "They won't call another penalty on LV"
- "There goes the shutout ceci started all of that and Oilers just sitting back now and just flinging the puck up to center ice"
- "Oilers getting ridiculously sloppy and making lazy Plays."
- "Adin Hill is spitting out rebounds yet the Oilers refuse to shoot"
- "Oilers having a tough time clearing the zone, Maybe spend some time in theirs rather than throwing the puck up at the scoreboard"
- "Whyyyy won’t anyone just drive to the net..Just drive the net once in awhile and hope for a bounce. It’s better than circling the whole frickin zone and doing nothing."
- "Self induced issues kill this team. Terrible penalties again"
- "You’re playing with Mcdavid and Drai, in the middle of the ice at the hash marks and you make a garbage pass to a covered mcdavid instead of firing that on net. Kane has to shoot that

Vegas does nothing special that other teams have tried. Only difference is their all around talent is higher. This Vegas game could have gone either way, unfortunately we seem to be on the wrong end to often. The difference was 1 more goal off a defensive error.
As it sits today, we can try to improve on our errors or improve on capitalizing on theirs.
Who is available at what cost will determine Hollands direction

 

[Drivesaitl]

You said: "Until they beat them in the playoffs, I’m not wrong."

This means you've constructed a scenario where you are completely immune to rebuttals until or unless a specific event has come to pass.

I'm just here to tell you it works both ways. If the Oilers would have chased Hill with five goals in the first period on their way to a 10-0 win, you still would have been "right" because it didn't happen in the playoffs.

Hence, why are you even here?

But didn't you and others use the same presumptive logic in the Connor Brown situation. "That if he gets untracked or if he scores in playoffs he could still be a good addition"? I've heard countless times, and even in every GDT if the player gets going, just gets one goal that he'll start to roll. Those assumptions being oddly accepted by many here. In hockey discussion people tend to use those kinds of arguments commonly. Moreso on a hockey board where we're not on here writing a thesis, We're just stating our fan takes.

Theres nothing inherently wrong with what the poster was stating. Certainly not requiring being called out on it. We all have our odd takes and OK to remember that. At worst the poster worded carelessly.

The why are you even here goes further in suggesting the poster is a troll. Is that really required or accurate? There are posters here that seem to be that. The poster in question is not and has engaged reasonably in my memory of his interactions here.

I understand your point and rebuttal clearly. But to single out one poster for doing it while overlooking the myriad times the same such argument is made is selective. The bolded is rude as well and is not your place to state.

 

[DavidHasselhoffsFist]

I had an asshole text from my prick of a brother in law.

"Oilers suck. Flames haven't lost this month"

Dink

I made this for you. Send him that!!

 

[Drivesaitl]

The guy is a hart trophy winner. He’s going to be held to a similar standard as Connor. He has not been playing up to his full potential for some reason

ANYBODY in the world that is going to be held up to the standard of Connor McDavid is going to fail to meet that, invariably. That is one of the chief distortions here in regards to Drai that he's playing as a superstar with the greatest player on Earth, but will ultimately not measure up in all facets. Certainly not in pace of play.

The yard stick is ridiculous. Drai was a 4th pick thought to have potential to be a powerforward. He wasn't even a notable goal scorer at draft. Leon Draisaitl has exceeded any and all expectations and has been excellent value every year he's been here. yet we keep wanting more. Do more Drai!

I've always noted as well that Power Forwards with size are often stated to be lazy, slow, etc. This has been going on since Frank Mahovlich as if the players are somehow lacking in will or enthusiasm. Which ignores that power forwards often move differently, have different strides, are moving more bulk etc.

In anycase Leon has knocked full potential out of the ballpark every season going. If anything he's now victim to comments of why he doesn't defy expectation constantly.

Not you specifically at all, but the constant uber expectations about Drai from the fanbase. Just seems like its never satisfied.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Sometimes I can't help but wonder how much love a guy like Draisaitl would get if he was named Len Draper and was born in Sudbury.

Basically 4 of the 6 top six top six guys had relatively quiet games both defensively and offensively, where they pretty much did nothing and barely pissed a drop... Yet a guy that created at both ends is getting a ton of vitriol. It's... Interesting.

Particularly when that guy is also one of the league and world's most premier players.

If only his name was Connor Brown. Whoops, I threw up.

Now I have to wash my mouth out. Yuck!

jk aside your point is not off. The "fine broth of a lad often has the "hockey name" type connotation. Some of this working pretty superficially. In another thread I'm mocking Tyler Bertuzzi who owes some of his past popularity to having the "ideal hockey face" whatever that means. Bias being everywhere.

Not isolated to hockey. Some of the working class appeal of say "Bruce Springsteen" was the name. Names matter, they actually do, and no mystery that parents will carefully decide and even consult books, relative names etc in coming up with names for their children. Throughout history names have often also evolved and changed, even first name and surnames, to purposely limit bias and prejudice.

Of course names do matter. History has shown us that.

 

[Oilhawks]

While somehow having more goals than McD and Drai playing with linemates that are not close to being same quality. A lot of the McD skating this season has been ineffectual. The Knights last night were basically watching McD skate peripheral laps with the puck.

This doesn't get said much but the McD drop off this season has been more severe and striking than the Drai dropoff, and McD is always getting the top linemates. just saying. With Connor its harder to understand fallback because he's the greatest player on Earth.

But meanwhile Nuge goal production has dropped right off the planet and not a peep about it. He's got his popgun out again this season.

Kane has scored one goal all year and its of course now Drais problem to start him up. Drai always seems tasked with this sort of thing.

Ryan McLeod has 3 less goals than Ryan Nugent Hopkins and he plays 80% of his time in bottomsix. Theres quite a bit of focus on other players fallbacks that can be looked at as well.

its actually amazing we had the Win string we did as several of our top forwards are not pissing a drop.

Agreed. All things considered, the offense is 100% an issue this season (with Woody it was both, with Knoblauch the offense has cost them a game here or there including this one). Which is part of why getting a top 6RW should be a bigger priority than a Ceci upgrade (both would be nice).

 

[Duke74]

The guy is a hart trophy winner. He’s going to be held to a similar standard as Connor. He has not been playing up to his full potential for some reason

I agree that he's definitely regressed this season and there must be something driving that regression. I think someone mentioned a lingering injury? The problem is that we don't know the reason behind the regression, so some people just conveniently label it as "lazy," which, to me, is ironically or unironically, lazy thinking.

 

[Drivesaitl]

I wonder that too. There's something about Draisaitl that attracts WAY too much hate proportional to his contributions and star status. Especially when you consider all the love that a plug like Vinnie D gets. Unfortunately, being as blue collar as Alberta is, ethnicity may have something to do with it.

Does it start with media? I could list the local sports beat scribes who appear to have great issue with Drai and have butted heads with "pissy Drai"

Now imagine if that same term had been applied to say McDavid? The reporter wouldn't be allowed in the scrum. But its Drai so he somehow has to deal with those kinds of disparaging comments.

Somehow it seems acceptable in regards to Draisaitl.

We had another scribe years ago who was saying we have to trade Drai "while we have the chance" That writer was Tychkowski, and he's disliked Drai success ever since because he was wrong. I mean his whole job is to write about hockey and he was so wrong it hurts.

 

[Oilhawks]

I had an asshole text from my prick of a brother in law.

"Oilers suck. Flames haven't lost this month"

Dink

All good, he'll be seeing them on the local links in May, I guess they can't lose any games that month either.

 

[Duke74]

Does it start with media? I could list the local sports beat scribes who appear to have great issue with Drai and have butted heads with "pissy Drai"

Now imagine if that same term had been applied to say McDavid? The reporter wouldn't be allowed in the scrum. But its Drai so he somehow has to deal with those kinds of disparaging comments.

Somehow it seems acceptable in regards to Draisaitl.

We had another scribe years ago who was saying we have to trade Drai "while we have the chance" That writer was Tychkowski, and he's disliked Drai success ever since because he was wrong. I mean his whole job is to write about hockey and he was so wrong it hurts.

I don't think Draisaitl's a huge fan of the press, and hasn't been for years, so yes, this could play into it. It doesn't help when idiots like Spector write columns about the lack of leadership and poor defensive play exemplified by McDavid and Draisaitl. People without a capacity for critical thinking read these articles and parrot the same bullshit without using their single brain cell. For example, how many comments do we read in every single GDT about "he's not moving his feet?" People misunderstand his play style, the fact that he likes to slow the game down, and so it gets interpreted as "lazy."

 

[Drivesaitl]

I don't think Draisaitl's a huge fan of the press, and hasn't been for years, so yes, this could play into it. It doesn't help when idiots like Spector write columns about the lack of leadership and poor defensive play exemplified by McDavid and Draisaitl. People without a capacity for critical thinking read these articles and parrot the same bullshit without using their single brain cell. For example, how many comments do we read in every single GDT about "he's not moving his feet?" People misunderstand his play style and then it gets interpreted as "lazy."

Unfortunately this describes voting too but its as far as I'll get into that. haha

Journalism, not just sports journalism is so twisted that in present day we have to make up own opinions, use our own filters.

In the internet world where anybody becomes a writer, a content creator, a source, Journalists seem angry almost that their prior realm is taken over. Now you get media outlets proclaiming themselves as the only "valid information source" as if they've been that....lol. Good journalism of any type seems dead and buried. At lest here on the continent.

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

While somehow having more goals than McD and Drai playing with linemates that are not close to being same quality. A lot of the McD skating this season has been ineffectual. The Knights last night were basically watching McD skate peripheral laps with the puck.

This doesn't get said much but the McD drop off this season has been more severe and striking than the Drai dropoff, and McD is always getting the top linemates. just saying. With Connor its harder to understand fallback because he's the greatest player on Earth.

But meanwhile Nuge goal production has dropped right off the planet and not a peep about it. He's got his popgun out again this season.

Kane has scored one goal all year and its of course now Drais problem to start him up. Drai always seems tasked with this sort of thing.

Ryan McLeod has 3 less goals than Ryan Nugent Hopkins and he plays 80% of his time in bottomsix. Theres quite a bit of focus on other players fallbacks that can be looked at as well.

its actually amazing we had the Win string we did as several of our top forwards are not pissing a drop.

The Oilers top line has been among the league's elite all year. NHL teams don't break up high performance lines and most especially not when they have been bending winning results since the coaching change. McDavid's game hasn't dropped off this season. He played through an injury and is clearly playing a more abrasive, committed 200 foot game.

Unfortunately the team's second elite hasn't been as consistent in driving support line 2 production which, as we've seen with this team historically when coaches ran The Stack Line, it's tough to drive secondary results. Of course in past years, it was Nugent Hopkin's 'problem' to start up and be 'tasked' with driving offensive support. That's just the nature of the gig when super elite Connor McDavid is tilting the ice truly driving line 1 results.

Looking at your goal scoring comparison, which isn't really a fulsome measure of the complete contributions really of any player. Break it down to EV goals scored, Draisaitl has 13, Nugent Hopkins 9, and McCloud 9. Put another way 44% of Leon's goals come as a finishing winger on the PP; 25% of Nuge's come on the PP; and 0% of McLeod. All centre winger versatile players and all have really enjoyed much of their success this season at wing. And of course Nugent Hopkins is a primary contributor to a greatly improved PK which is a big part of team success during this epic winning streak.

Playing centre is a damn tough gig with greater responsibilities for two-way, 200 foot games. It's natural that Draisaitl's production will take a hit as a 2C versus a finishing winger with McDavid. However the big picture is about the W's. Oil are most dangerous with having a balanced top six with McDavid tilting ice at 1C and Draisaitl bringing a power centre, hard game at 2C.

Thankfully this team's leaders don't think in terms of line mate envy and excuse making. Their consistent message is about winning and that the individual awards have been won and don't matter.

 

[DavidHasselhoffsFist]

I agree that he's definitely regressed this season and there must be something driving that regression. I think someone mentioned a lingering injury? The problem is that we don't know the reason behind the regression, so some people just conveniently label it as "lazy," which, to me, is ironically or unironically, lazy thinking.

1000%
Dri started the season injured (per Bob Stauffer)
I would bet he’s still injured

 

[Fishy McScales]

But didn't you and others use the same presumptive logic in the Connor Brown situation. "That if he gets untracked or if he scores in playoffs he could still be a good addition"? I've heard countless times, and even in every GDT if the player gets going, just gets one goal that he'll start to roll. Those assumptions being oddly accepted by many here. In hockey discussion people tend to use those kinds of arguments commonly. Moreso on a hockey board where we're not on here writing a thesis, We're just stating our fan takes.

Theres nothing inherently wrong with what the poster was stating. Certainly not requiring being called out on it. We all have our odd takes and OK to remember that. At worst the poster worded carelessly.

The why are you even here goes further in suggesting the poster is a troll. Is that really required or accurate? There are posters here that seem to be that. The poster in question is not and has engaged reasonably in my memory of his interactions here.

I understand your point and rebuttal clearly. But to single out one poster for doing it while overlooking the myriad times the same such argument is made is selective. The bolded is rude as well and is not your place to state.

My point about Connor Brown was about his value at league minimum vs other players around the league since that is his cost in constructing the roster for this year, and I got jumped on by a couple of posters because of the bonus which was explicitly irrelevant to my argument. I don't see how it bears much resemblance to what is being discussed here to be honest?

And if you thought I was rude I apologise, I meant why is he here arguing this point when he himself disqualified any discussion on the subject.

For the record Brown has not been able to build on anything I saw offensively unfortunately, so the value extracted is still a disappointment, but he is still a league-minimum player this year, on this roster and with this cap.

 

[K1984]

1000%
Dri started the season injured (per Bob Stauffer)
I would bet he’s still injured

He's also historically been a second half player. It's usually a tradition around mid-January for a majority of the fanbase to be frustrated with him and a portion of us to be furious with him.

However, we are now getting a little later into the year compared to normal as far as him turning it up is concerned. He had that run of scoring a 5/6 games in a row about a month ago, but that was almost in spite of fairly average play. I'm not sure that other than a flash here or there we could say Draisaitl has played top level hockey (by his standard) with any degree of consistency this season.

 

[Drivesaitl]

My point about Connor Brown was about his value at league minimum vs other players around the league since that is his cost in constructing the roster for this year, and I got jumped on by a couple of posters because of the bonus which was explicitly irrelevant to my argument. I don't see how it bears much resemblance to what is being discussed here to be honest?

And if you thought I was rude I apologise, I meant why is he here arguing this point when he himself disqualified any discussion on the subject.

For the record Brown has not been able to build on anything I saw offensively unfortunately, so the value extracted is still a disappointment, but he is still a league-minimum player this year, on this roster and with this cap.

Several posters, I thought you as well, were using forward projections of made up Connor Brown progress, and assumption that he would eventually find his way to backtrack argue in realtime that the Connor Brown deal was fine and that we're essentially just waiting for the results to show up.

If you were not making those kinds of claims than I retract that for you.

But its exactly for the reason that this current poster is "getting jumped on" that I responded. You see?

I just don't think the poster merits that kind of collective jumping on from several posters and I think for some reason its occurring tons of times on this board, increasingly.

I don't' share the view the poster disqualified their own comments. The posts as the poster mentioned were made in lieu of the latest game against Vegas that appeared to be Carbon Copy of the playoff games. I agree with that assessment.

I can't agree with your last sentence. The Brown salary cap still counts. Even if the bonus is applied next season. The premise that this is league minimum we're paying for Brown is specious view. We're paying 4M, exactly, for one season of Connor Brown. No matter how much cap is deferred or the wording of it being selective. Its 4M in capspace incurred by this club.

 

[Fishy McScales]

Several posters, I thought you as well, were using forward projections of made up Connor Brown progress, and assumption that he would eventually find his way to backtrack argue in realtime that the Connor Brown deal was fine and that we're essentially just waiting for the results to show up.

If you were not making those kinds of claims than I retract that for you.

But its exactly for the reason that this current poster is "getting jumped on" that I responded. You see?

I just don't think the poster merits that kind of collective jumping on from several posters and I think for some reason its occurring tons of times on this board, increasingly.

I don't' share the view the poster disqualified their own comments. The posts as the poster mentioned were made in lieu of the latest game against Vegas that appeared to be Carbon Copy of the playoff games. I agree with that assessment.

I can't agree with your last sentence. The Brown salary cap still counts. Even if the bonus is applied next season. The premise that this is league minimum we're paying for Brown is specious view. We're paying 4M, exactly, for one season of Connor Brown. No matter how much cap is deferred or the wording of it being selective. Its 4M in capspace incurred by this club.

He said "until the Oilers beat Vegas in the playoffs I'm right". Well let's wait until the playoffs then? What's there to talk about if nothing can be said in the meantime to counter it? This game was far from a carbon copy of the playoffs in my opinion.

And regarding Brown I'm stating facts. He is a league-minimum player in 2023-24 and that is the only thing that is relevant in terms of roster decisions for this season.

I am bewildered that an intelligent poster like yourself is so determined not to understand this.

 

[Gordy Elbows]

A system does not need to be overly complex to be effective. Vegas Golden Showers aren't playing some crazy, exotic, reinvent the wheel system (the "swarm", anyone?).
They know their responsibilities and know the appropriate flexes, switches, etc. and they execute it very well. It's not complex but it's extremely effective. That's what Struddy is saying.

Simply - and very well said!

 

[bucks_oil]

1) Thanks for the rundown. Interesting point on the TV angles possibly deceiving and I have to pause for thought on that. I do agree that coming out would have been better option. I disagree with your earlier assessment that there was limited time to adjust to the shot, and a situational awareness of what is going to be a shot is improving with Skinner. I note he's been coming out more cutting off angles when a shot is the one play available. But he didn't make that adjustment on this one. He does seem to struggle with passes from behind net. No doubt opponents will scout that.

2) I disagree somewhat with 4 and perhaps because in goal I was left hand glove hand. I had a good glove hand and would challenge shots there. My weakness would be short side blocker side, and jmo, its harder to react to those shots and its a shorter point of going in. In addition extra bias on that because I've also been a Football goalie. In Football the shortside shot even more dangerous. So that you have to cheat shortside somewhat because its easier for ball to be slotted in there. Its easier to score shortside. Not sure why you missed that point.

3) As far as 6 one possible inconsistency is you're saying that Hill made mistakes that were fouls but your count on Skinner is that the same or similar miscues are no harm no foul. One thing I noted though that Skinner does a fair bit is when he doesn't know where a puck is he freezes so as not to knock it in his own net. This sometimes works but in a recent game an opponent was able to fish behind and just knock the puck in. That Skinner often doesn't know where the puck is and doesn't have it frozen is at times a concern. This is just one example where your mistake count can be not detecting error.

4) As far as Nurse I don't think you're being fair. Lets say Nurse handles 20 forecheck situations well and manages to win those. But he loses a couple, and in what could even be several 50-50 situations where one or the other is going to gain puck, the whole point of a forecheck being the possibility there of. Nurse was a Star in the game and deservedly. He was excellent on the night deftly dealing with rush after rush, dump after dump. He gets caught on the one and you're nailing him on it. D lose battles, they all do. Nurse happened to lose that one. Ceci did nothing on the play and Foegele, right in position didn't cover the passing lane. Skinner left what i thought was ample shortside room, where the shot went.

1) Everyone struggles on passes coming out from behind the net... because in an instant you have to change your focus to the puck receiver and often by the time you do, the puck is off their stick and coming right back at you. These are VERY hard shots to a) pick up sight on, b) react to in time and c) often the puck could be going to more than one guy (say one guy close and one guy high slot). That's why I'm insistent it wasn't a mistake. He recognized who the shooter would be AND he pushed out in position toward that guy... he just got beat, that happens. If Ceci didn't obstruct his view of the pass and shooter with the fly by... maybe he gets even a bit further out, but as it was, he still managed to get close to the top of the blue paint. It was a great, tactically correct, effort on a very difficult bang-bang play.

Two points of contrast:
A) Mike Smith (and to a lesser extent) Koskinen, would have played that shot way more "technically wrong" than Skinner... they would have been deep in their net, still on the goal line and likely still stuck against their post... giving up the entirety of the far side of the net. Those went in all the time on those guys.
B) That play is nearly EXACTLY the same as the two diving "saves" Hill had to make... on BOTH because he was nearly hopelessly out of position. He just got lucky by a) his defender on Kane and b) Draisaitl shooting for the middle of the open net, only to have Hill dive back on a hope and a prayer that was answered. Maybe if Hill had actually played that shot as well as Skinner did, Draisaitl sees him there in position (like Skinner was) and snipes his shoulder, but because the net was empty, Draisaitl plays the averages and shoots for certainty at the center of the target.

2) Of course goalies sometimes "cheat" to their strengths, but this was not one of those times... as above it was a bang-bang play, not a breakaway when you might knowingly give something only to take it away. As for cheating short side... I was a soccer goalie too. You may cheat more shortside then because the striker has a much harder time shooting "against his momentum" to the far side (no matter which foot he uses... crossing his body with the strong side foot or planting hard enough with the strong side to flick/cut with the weak side foot). Hockey isn't soccer... it's still just a flick of the wrist to shoot anywhere on the net.

3) Not sure the point being made here... most goalies have moments where the puck is lying under/behind them. You either stay still until you find it (I was taught that) or you snow angel. In my experience I try both and almost always get it wrong. Of course there are other shaky moments where mistakes go unpunished. I didn't notice any glaring ones on Skinner last game (other than the puck movement which you correctly pointed out). Hill got away with two identical blunders overcommitting to McD.

4) This is rich. Nurse handles 20 forechecks perfectly and makes a mistake on one and yes, I'm pointing it out. Skinner handles 22 shots and makes a mistake on one and you want him tarred and feathered. This is exactly why goalies go crazy. F you <-- that's a joke by the way. For the record I pointed out 4 mistakes on that play (2 from Nurse and 2 from Ceci) that I consider to be worse than Skinner getting sniped by a good shot... why? Because they were all more preventable. They were mental/tactical errors, not physical limitations.

 

[DrDrai]

What about the important game earlier this year against Vegas that the oilers won.

This was a close game that could have gone either way, you’re in here saying the oilers didn’t even show up and got owned.

There’s a reason you’re getting so much backlash about that opinion.

The game earlier in the year was a regular season game. It hold a certain value but no where near the same value as the previous game. McDavid said the same thing in the post game about it feeling like a playoff game.

If the Oilers had won, they would've tied the record for longest winning streak against a huge rival. The opposite happened, Vegas didn't want to be that team and they rose to the occasion, regardless of how "dominate" the Oilers were.

You rarely every have a game of this magnitude in a regular season, just happened that we were going for a record against a rival like Vegas.

Do you wonder if 90% don’t get what you’re saying it’s more of you? They’ve already beaten Vegas this year, you keep missing that point, and it was a close game.

I don't care about that game, it was a regular game against Vegas, nothing was on the line.

 

[Tobias Kahun]

The game earlier in the year was a regular season game. It hold a certain value but no where near the same value as the previous game. McDavid said the same thing in the post game about it feeling like a playoff game.

If the Oilers had won, they would've tied the record for longest winning streak against a huge rival. The opposite happened, Vegas didn't want to be that team and they rose to the occasion, regardless of how "dominate" the Oilers were.

You rarely every have a game of this magnitude in a regular season, just happened that we were going for a record against a rival like Vegas.


I don't care about that game, it was a regular game against Vegas, nothing was on the line.

So why are you so upset about this last game.

It was a regular season game.

 

[DrDrai]

Sounds to me like you're moving the goalposts now, but you seem to also ignore the fact that playing better isn't a guarantee to win.

The Oilers play quite differently to how they played last spring when they were knocked out by the Knights, and last game they were easily the better team.

Like I said, that still doesn't guarantee a win, but if both teams play like that I'm comfortable saying the Oilers win around 75% of the time which in turn makes things look really promising in the context of a playoff series.

How is that moving the goal posts? I specifically commented on the loss, had they won in a convincing manner of course my opinion would be different.

Hopefully they do win, I'm not so optimistic at this point, to each their own.

 

[DrDrai]

So why are you so upset about this last game.

It was a regular season game.

JFC. Do I have to type the same damn explanation to each one of you?

That wasn't a normal regular season game. Vegas didn't want to be the team the Oilers tied a record against, Vegas played way harder then the normally would've, McDavid said it was like a playoff game. The Oilers probably wanted that one as well, hanging a record on Vegas would've been satisfying, but they didn't. It showed me enough to know that Vegas will do more to win a game of that magnitude.

Vegas does nothing special that other teams have tried. Only difference is their all around talent is higher. This Vegas game could have gone either way, unfortunately we seem to be on the wrong end to often. The difference was 1 more goal off a defensive error.
As it sits today, we can try to improve on our errors or improve on capitalizing on theirs.
Who is available at what cost will determine Hollands direction

The bolded is my point, its not just one game, and I agree, we dominate at times and it gives everyone a sense that we are the better team. We just don't get results against Vegas.