All Elite Wrestling #2: The road to October

[JackSlater]

Cody comes across as incredibly bitter when he does that.

Could be, I think that it was more pandering to the company's (and Cody's) most vocal fans.

 

[ColePens]

Cody comes across as incredibly bitter when he does that.

One of the Bucks sort of made it sound like he wasn't for it in his interview and said something like "That was Cody so not my fire" or something like that.

I do agree... if I am tuning into AEW, it's for an alternative and love for wrestling. I do not want constant reminders of WWE. I want AEW. I want to keep my mind so far away from WWE. I get enough WWE shouts when I watch NXT but Mauro kills it so much I don't care.

I would disengage from all WWE stuff.

 

[GKJ]

This is a war. AEW engaging with WWE is exactly what's going to get people talking about them and draw more attention. Triple H had no problem taking shots back when he was at the Hall of Fame. Make no mistake, both of them want this. Cody is going to keep getting great reactions for doing it and Triple H definitely doesn't mind having a foil to play off of, and it should only help both because people will react to it. And WWE is always going to be seen as the heel even if AEW keeps doing it. Cody is fully engaged with the lapsed-WWE fan concept who has been waiting for someone to call out Vince, and Triple H knows that people watching WWE are behind him essentially without exception waiting for him to take control.

 

[WingsMJN2965]

The long term thing that troubles me about AEW is the undercard.

Maybe it's just not my cup of tea, but I don't see guys like Jungle Boy having that much drawing power. Some of their undercard guys just come off as hokey and almost seem to de-legitimize the sport aspect they're going for.

Honestly, I don't really get the infatuation with Joey Janela either. Seems to me the stars of the show are Jericho, Moxley, and Omega, with Cody being a rotating fourth. MJF is the long term project to get over as a star, and Hangman is the immediate priority.

 

[GKJ]

Bryan Alvarez said he was sitting in a section near a lot of teenage girls and they marked hard for Jungle Boy. And the joshi match. An audience WWE hasn’t been able to get.

 

[JackSlater]

This is a war. AEW engaging with WWE is exactly what's going to get people talking about them and draw more attention. Triple H had no problem taking shots back when he was at the Hall of Fame. Make no mistake, both of them want this. Cody is going to keep getting great reactions for doing it and Triple H definitely doesn't mind having a foil to play off of, and it should only help both because people will react to it. And WWE is always going to be seen as the heel even if AEW keeps doing it. Cody is fully engaged with the lapsed-WWE fan concept who has been waiting for someone to call out Vince, and Triple H knows that people watching WWE are behind him essentially without exception waiting for him to take control.

Eh you'll get a reaction, but it's a cheap pop that makes you look pretty petty. It's a Shane Douglas move. It's not big deal to take the odd shot at WWE to spice things up a bit but if it becomes a crutch it makes AEW look small time.

The long term thing that troubles me about AEW is the undercard.

Maybe it's just not my cup of tea, but I don't see guys like Jungle Boy having that much drawing power. Some of their undercard guys just come off as hokey and almost seem to de-legitimize the sport aspect they're going for.

Honestly, I don't really get the infatuation with Joey Janela either. Seems to me the stars of the show are Jericho, Moxley, and Omega, with Cody being a rotating fourth. MJF is the long term project to get over as a star, and Hangman is the immediate priority.

That was a glaring issue on the last PPV. There's time to groom certain wrestlers and scout for more talent though. Unless AEW is very patient there are only so many permutations of credible guys they have right now, but again time and effort may fix it.

 

[WingsMJN2965]

That was a glaring issue on the last PPV. There's time to groom certain wrestlers and scout for more talent though. Unless AEW is very patient there are only so many permutations of credible guys they have right now, but again time and effort may fix it.

The upshot is, they'll only have to fill two hours of TV a week. Give the obvious stars their TV time and then interject undercard guys to build them up.

 

[GKJ]

All In was different when it came to putting guys over, that show was all about the PPV and by extension Starrcast. That was all about doing stuff that they couldn't do, and they certainly did a lot of it.

Eh you'll get a reaction, but it's a cheap pop that makes you look pretty petty. It's a Shane Douglas move. It's not big deal to take the odd shot at WWE to spice things up a bit but if it becomes a crutch it makes AEW look small time.

If you're an AEW devout follower, i.e. an old Bullet Club mark who has watched Being the Elite from Day 1, that's by and large what they did frequently, and they managed to build an entire wrestling promotion on it with an owner who has more money than Vince. You don't have this without that. Of course the time will come when they're weekly when they have to back off because the joke isn't funny if you're always repeating the joke. The bottom line is they have done it the way they have done this because among other things it is part of what has worked as opposed to others who have tried and failed for a large number of reasons.

 

[JackSlater]

The upshot is, they'll only have to fill two hours of TV a week. Give the obvious stars their TV time and then interject undercard guys to build them up.

Yeah that's a big advantage for AEW, at least in terms of quality and accessibility for new fans.

All In was different when it came to putting guys over, that show was all about the PPV and by extension Starrcast. That was all about doing stuff that they couldn't do, and they certainly did a lot of it.

If you're an AEW devout follower, i.e. an old Bullet Club mark who has watched Being the Elite from Day 1, that's by and large what they did frequently, and they managed to build an entire wrestling promotion on it with an owner who has more money than Vince. You don't have this without that. Of course the time will come when they're weekly when they have to back off because the joke isn't funny if you're always repeating the joke. The bottom line is they have done it the way they have done this because among other things it is part of what has worked as opposed to others who have tried and failed for a large number of reasons.

This mostly seems like quite an exaggeration. In no way did any promotion get built around taking little shots at WWE. Engaging with fans in a new and innovative way? Sure. Exposing fans to different wrestlers with different styles? Yep. Using NJPW and leeching off another stable to boost your own brand? It worked. Taking little shots at WWE is mainly just pandering to the fans that AEW already has. It isn't going to do anything for new fans and it isn't the kind of thing that's going to attracted the typical lapsed fan, as they likely lost interest but don't feel hostility toward WWE. A blistering Phil Brooks promo is a different matter, as that would be at least the rich man's version of Shane Douglas' gimmick, but tacky shots like Cody's sledgehammer make AEW look petty and small. Hooking Tony Khan isn't some sign of ingenuity. TNA hooked a big money mark, JCP hooked one, and given the current desperation for media content it's even easier today.

There is a stage in any business when it is small and needs some sort of gimmick to garner attention. It could be quality, it could be novelty, or any number of things. AEW should be beyond that point by now. The Young Bucks and company did a good job hooking the small but rapid internet smark audience. They could run PPVs a few times a year and sell out for years with just that group. It's a fine start but the time has come to focus on AEW. Desperate promotions chase those cheap pops at the expense of rivals and that isn't necessary at this time.

 

[GKJ]

Yeah that's a big advantage for AEW, at least in terms of quality and accessibility for new fans.



This mostly seems like quite an exaggeration. In no way did any promotion get built around taking little shots at WWE. Engaging with fans in a new and innovative way? Sure. Exposing fans to different wrestlers with different styles? Yep. Using NJPW and leeching off another stable to boost your own brand? It worked. Taking little shots at WWE is mainly just pandering to the fans that AEW already has. It isn't going to do anything for new fans and it isn't the kind of thing that's going to attracted the typical lapsed fan, as they likely lost interest but don't feel hostility toward WWE. A blistering Phil Brooks promo is a different matter, as that would be at least the rich man's version of Shane Douglas' gimmick, but tacky shots like Cody's sledgehammer make AEW look petty and small. Hooking Tony Khan isn't some sign of ingenuity. TNA hooked a big money mark, JCP hooked one, and given the current desperation for media content it's even easier today.

There is a stage in any business when it is small and needs some sort of gimmick to garner attention. It could be quality, it could be novelty, or any number of things. AEW should be beyond that point by now. The Young Bucks and company did a good job hooking the small but rapid internet smark audience. They could run PPVs a few times a year and sell out for years with just that group. It's a fine start but the time has come to focus on AEW. Desperate promotions chase those cheap pops at the expense of rivals and that isn't necessary at this time.

Well, I did say 'among other things.' AEW has only done one show, they're not beyond any point. They're into figuring out what works and what doesn't, and that spot got one of the biggest rections on the show and we're still talking about it today. It worked - this time. You said it was the best match on the show. The whole point of those two wanting to do this program is to stick it to WWE for screwing it up the first time.

 

[JackSlater]

Well, I did say 'among other things.' AEW has only done one show, they're not beyond any point. They're into figuring out what works and what doesn't, and that spot got one of the biggest rections on the show and we're still talking about it today. It worked - this time. You said it was the best match on the show. The whole point of those two wanting to do this program is to stick it to WWE for screwing it up the first time.

I don't really see it. If Rhodes had taken a dump in the middle of the ring the reaction would have been massive and we'd be talking about it for years, but that doesn't make it good. Now that's of course a bit extreme but I don't think that getting a quick pop and having people talking is inherently a good thing. I don't doubt that the crowd at Double or Nothing loved pretty much everything that happened, but that type of fan is a small group and the company needs a larger base to sustain itself. They need to keep the fans they have, which should be relatively easy, and gain a far greater number. A big part of that will be presenting the company the right way.

I don't have a big issue with Cody Rhodes ripping on HHH, whom I am not a fan of, a little in that match (nor do I think that it added to his match in any way) but if AEW repeatedly goes to that well they will not only see diminishing returns but also look weak. There's a reason that the Billionaire Ted skits happened in 1996 and not the subsequent years. I liked the match because it was well executed, within each wrestler's limitations, and told a solid story of two brothers that we rarely see. Cody killing the Attitude Era seemed tacked on to me, and also a separate thing from him taking a shot at HHH. I'd be up to see more Cody and Dustin.

 

[M.C.G. 31]

Jon Moxley will be on Talk is Jericho on Wednesday.

 

[M.C.G. 31]

This is like... actually a big deal considering her reach and the demo that really takes a shine to her.

I did not expect this crossover at all.

Politics aside (this isn't really about that -- at least not this post) she has 4m+ followers. Her tweet, and quoting what Cody said, to her followers is going to appeal to them for sure to at least check it out... even though Cody is covered in his brother's blood.

 

[KaseMeOutside]

 

[M.C.G. 31]

WWE let the closest thing they had to an Austin slip through their cracks and now AEW is going to reap the rewards.

I still can't believe it actually happened. I expected it eventually, but god damn.

 

[Disclose]

"change the world"

it wasnt a gimmick....

 

[WingsMJN2965]

This is like... actually a big deal considering her reach and the demo that really takes a shine to her.

I did not expect this crossover at all.

Politics aside (this isn't really about that -- at least not this post) she has 4m+ followers. Her tweet, and quoting what Cody said, to her followers is going to appeal to them for sure to at least check it out... even though Cody is covered in his brother's blood.

Reach aside, this is the same woman who f***ed up 25,000 jobs coming to her area and then celebrated it. Her approval rate is already abysmal. I guess any fan is a good fan, but she's not exactly followed by geniuses.

... And my guess is she's probably not clued into the fact that this bloodbath (Which isn't even bad in this clip) was the product of an intentional blade job.

 

[GKJ]

That Moxley promo, just another example of all the stuff I’ve been talking about.

If you’re coming to AEW simply to forget and detach from WWE, you’re coming to the wrong place. And if you never watched WWE, it won’t matter anyways.

 

[SeidoN]

... And my guess is she's probably not clued into the fact that this bloodbath (Which isn't even bad in this clip) was the product of an intentional blade job.

what does that have to do with anything lol

 

[M.C.G. 31]

That Moxley promo, just another example of all the stuff I’ve been talking about.

If you’re coming to AEW simply to forget and detach from WWE, you’re coming to the wrong place. And if you never watched WWE, it won’t matter anyways.

That Moxley promo is also why I’ve been bumping the “best talker” title for years on him even when he was at his lowest.

WWE pissed it all away with him so bad.

Now he can be their Austin, straight up.

 

[Cor]

Dustin Rhodes said he got over 30 texts from WWE employees after Double or Nothing.

Said he thinks some of them are realizing there can be life outside of the WWE

 

[GKJ]

That Moxley promo is also why I’ve been bumping the “best talker” title for years on him even when he was at his lowest.

WWE pissed it all away with him so bad.

Now he can be their Austin, straight up.

Script writers wouldn't even think to use words like 'paradigm shift'

 

[Cor]

Script writers wouldn't even think to use words like 'paradigm shift'

And even if they did, Vince would change all the scripts 30 minutes before the show starts

 

[BonMorrison]

This is like... actually a big deal considering her reach and the demo that really takes a shine to her.

I did not expect this crossover at all.

Politics aside (this isn't really about that -- at least not this post) she has 4m+ followers. Her tweet, and quoting what Cody said, to her followers is going to appeal to them for sure to at least check it out... even though Cody is covered in his brother's blood.

Top 10 Anime Crossovers.

AOC and Cody are the GOATs.

 

[Andre Palot]

One of the Bucks sort of made it sound like he wasn't for it in his interview and said something like "That was Cody so not my fire" or something like that.

I do agree... if I am tuning into AEW, it's for an alternative and love for wrestling. I do not want constant reminders of WWE. I want AEW. I want to keep my mind so far away from WWE. I get enough WWE shouts when I watch NXT but Mauro kills it so much I don't care.

I would disengage from all WWE stuff.

You clearly weren't around during the Monday Night Wars when WCW and WWE/F would literally pot shot each other weekly and people would tune in weekly to see (among other things of course) how each company would react and what shot they would take that particular week, and it shows.

It's not a direct, offensive shot at you or calling you out in particular, in general I'm seeing more and more fans like this and don't understand wrestling history. Historically speaking, it's been pretty commonplace for these companies to go back and forth on each other

Also, Vince McMahon is the pettiest person on God's green Earth so I wouldn't be shocked if Renee Young won the 24/7 title tonight and then lost it immediately and then her broadcasting position to Coachman in response to Double or Nothing