Player Discussion Alexis Lafrenière

[EdJovanovski]

So in the context of replying to a poster who is trying to mock people calling Laf a bust, am I really wrong in comparing the production of other 1OAs to Laf's production? Including the on-paper statistics of an actual bust? What's silly about that?

Still, it's absolutely fair to say that every player's circumstances are different, but what seems to be a constant in the NHL is that if you have the talent and still to play at the top, you're going to play at the top. I don't understand why this fanbase lives and dies on top minutes and PP1 time when it comes to our top picks. I can't look at the 1OA list over the last few decades and say to myself, without laughing out loud, that the superstars on that list are only superstars because they played minutes and got shoved onto PP1. In fact, we saw Laf on PP1 and it didn't result in some drastic change of his talent and skill. We've seen Laf on a lot of line combos and we've even seen him get some top line minutes, but he's always looked the same. Chemistry goes a long way and he's absolutely improving, but relies on Chy a lot to finish his plays and KK's cycle. Guy can shoot, but he doesn't do it enough. A lot of you want to count your chickens before they hatch in terms of you want to call him a success. His 4th season AFTER his off-season work will be a great example of actual improvement in his overall game.

Not to mention most of the same Laf defenders absolutely loathe Kravtsov and call him a bust and claim he's getting every opportunity to succeed when he's scratched for weeks on end lol

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Not to mention most of the same Laf defenders absolutely loathe Kravtsov and call him a bust and claim he's getting every opportunity to succeed when he's scratched for weeks on end lol

Laf has almost matched kravtsov’s career nhl point total in his last 10 games.

Let’s not try to make them out to be on equal footing. Vitali had 4 points at even strength over 21 games playing almost primarily with Panarin. He’s getting scratched because he sucks at offense.

 

[ReddestRum]

Not to mention most of the same Laf defenders absolutely loathe Kravtsov and call him a bust and claim he's getting every opportunity to succeed when he's scratched for weeks on end lol

The Cult of Laf will be the Cult of Laf, and that will never change. Laf has been scratched, what, twice in his career and this thread went ape shit. People were legitimately calling for GG's head, blaming the organization for our kid's lack of production and weak development, and cheering when Laf got the broadway hat for doing absolutely nothing (and then saying it was a team-wide f*** you to GG). Yet, in spite of the CoL blaming everyone that they could find other than the actual player, we've seen GG give Laf oppurtunities that Chy or KK never got growing up in the organization. Minutes on the top line, PP minutes, OT minutes, shootout minutes -- but GG is against the kids, amirite? Unfortunately, I think because of Krav's past drama, he'll never see 1/4th of the opportunities that the others get. Krav's got to move on now if he wants a career in the NHL, because he's not going to get it here.

 

[DanielBrassard]

Kinda funny how his P/60 at 5v5 is hovering around the same place it's been since he entered the league. Difference is his SH% isn't sky-high this season and his shot rate is up so there's been improvement overall.

 

[GENESISPuck94]

10 pts in his last 11 games.

 

[romba]

Kinda funny how his P/60 at 5v5 is hovering around the same place it's been since he entered the league. Difference is his SH% isn't sky-high this season and his shot rate is up so there's been improvement overall.

Yup, more sustainable. And his vision, passing and decision making is light years better. He finds the open man, makes plays to keep the rush or cycle going as opposed to being a vaccum of offense aside from cross crease/tap in goals.

 

[Synergy27]

These are all Even Strength rates. I included Zegras because we all sweat him, and the other guys for obvious reasons.

Laf still does not impress me when I watch him play. He doesn’t “look” like a 1OA talent.

Stutzle was the correct choice that year, but Laf is in great shape compared to the other options available an no one is calling those guys busts.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

I'm convinced @EdJovanovski actively roots against him and Kakko because he wants Kravtsov to look good in comparison.

 

[HonestGabe]

He is playing with much more confidence and it’s clear Gallant has began to trust the Kid line with more minutes, especially defensively.

This run is a sign of things to come. He definitely has improved his foot speed and simplified his game with the puck this season and it’s beginning to show

 

[LORDE]

For a first overall? Kinda lol. My personal opinion, of course, but with hindsight being 20/20 not a chance I’d pick him 1st in a do-over. That opinion can change should he really breakout. He looks great on the kid line.
I’m rooting for him. But He did this last season too, so I’m less giddy than some of you. I’m hoping this is the start of great things And doesn’t lead to another 5-10-15 mid-season stat line next year.

Fair take IMO

Very happy for his recent uptick tho

Keep it up kid!

 

[haohmaru]

He's becoming a man before our eyes. (cue teardrop)

 

[UnSandvich]

I'm convinced @EdJovanovski actively roots against him and Kakko because he wants Kravtsov to look good in comparison.

And you know there are certain other morons who are rooting for him to fail because they called him a bust early on and don't want to look even dumber

 

[Psycho for Perreault]

I'm convinced @EdJovanovski actively roots against him and Kakko because he wants Kravtsov to look good in comparison.

It’s kind of obvious.

And you know there are certain other morons who are rooting for him to fail because they called him a bust early on and don't want to look even dumber

Also obvious. The Daniel Jones affect. I said he was bad once. I’d rather be right than root for him.

 

[romba]

I think we often conflate lack of flash, skating & skill with being good defensively. Flashy players are considered bad defensively and players who don't flash much skill are assumed to be responsible players. I don't think Laf is very good defensively.

Laf isn’t great, he’s ok, Kakko though is pretty solid especially in the NZ and reading the play

 

[GAGLine]

3 points from matching his career high in 24 less games.

They added an assist to Chytil on the goal Laf scored against Edmonton. He's up to 35 in 48. Kakko has already set career highs in goals and points, and is 1 point from hitting 30. He's just over .5 points per game with only 3 of his points coming on the PP.

If all 3 players can end up with 40+ points, I'll be very happy. 26 games left. Chytil needs 5 more points, which he should get easily, barring injury. Kakko needs 11 and Laf needs 12. I think they all make it.

How many teams have a 3rd line that puts up 120+ points?

 

[Deleted member 23124]

I'm convinced @EdJovanovski actively roots against him and Kakko because he wants Kravtsov to look good in comparison.

He just wants Kravy to have company in the press box.

 

[excaliber]

How many teams have a 3rd line that puts up 120+ points?

How many Teams have third lines that have the #1/#2 and #19 first round picks on them? Those picks should be playing on the top line.

 

[jerseyjinx94]

I don't understand these takes when a guy like Yakupov, who is considered one of the top busts of all time, had more points at the same time in his career, with the same amount of games, than Laf. I've never, ever, called Laf a bust, just a disappointment, but these kinds of gotchas when looking at raw statistics is funny, lol. Go back 20 years from 2020 and tally up the points of every 1OA after their 3rd season. Including 1OA D-men. Where would Laf stand right now?

The take is based on the activity in this thread when he struggles versus when he contributes. It’s a “bump” to force people to confront their impatience.

I don’t see anyone praising those passes he made last night or the effort on his goal to earn us a point. The kid has been great the last 4-5 games if not more

For a first overall? Kinda lol. My personal opinion, of course, but with hindsight being 20/20 not a chance I’d pick him 1st in a do-over. That opinion can change should he really breakout. He looks great on the kid line.
I’m rooting for him. But He did this last season too, so I’m less giddy than some of you. I’m hoping this is the start of great things And doesn’t lead to another 5-10-15 mid-season stat line next year.

“My opinion can change should he really breakout” lololol, just write “I’m impatient and want immediate results” and delete the rest

 

[jerseyjinx94]

Not to mention most of the same Laf defenders absolutely loathe Kravtsov and call him a bust and claim he's getting every opportunity to succeed when he's scratched for weeks on end lol

I think we should be patient with all young players, including Kravtsov. He has world class skill. Maybe others feel that way, I don’t know

 

[The New Russian Five]

Laf has almost matched kravtsov’s career nhl point total in his last 10 games.

Let’s not try to make them out to be on equal footing. Vitali had 4 points at even strength over 21 games playing almost primarily with Panarin. He’s getting scratched because he sucks at offense.

This is one of the worst cases of recency bias ever. And how did Laf perform statistically in his first 2 seasons? Pretty abysmally if I recall. Kravtsov is playing in technically hist first full season of NHL hockey. Why are the expectations different?

 

[LOFIN]

How many Teams have third lines that have the #1/#2 and #19 first round picks on them? Those picks should be playing on the top line.

How many of those teams that draft such high picks have players like Panarin, Zibanejad, Kreider? Hence the dilemma.

As of right now, we should not be compaining. We are a legit contender for the SC. Did we develop the prospects the right way because we didn't give them enough room, signed vets instead? Maybe, but like I said, is anyone complaining right now? We are a good hockey team, enjoy that. As much as it might piss off Laf and Kakko that they are not getting personal success, I'm sure they like it in a good NY team instead of say Ottawa who disappoints yet again.

 

[UnSandvich]

This is one of the worst cases of recency bias ever. And how did Laf perform statistically in his first 2 seasons? Pretty abysmally if I recall. Kravtsov is playing in technically hist first full season of NHL hockey. Why are the expectations different?

Because Kravtsov has several more years of pro experience?

And this is coming from someone who's a Kravtsov supporter and cannot for the life of me figure out why plugs like Leshitshow, Reaves, and Blais have been played in the lineup over him. BUT, this is also the Laf thread, not the Kravtsov thread

 

[NickyFotiu]

Right now he is on a 41 point pace for 81 games. I had hoped for 45-50 points this season. I still think he has an outside chance of making that if he continues on a hot streak.

 

[bhamill]

This is one of the worst cases of recency bias ever. And how did Laf perform statistically in his first 2 seasons? Pretty abysmally if I recall. Kravtsov is playing in technically hist first full season of NHL hockey. Why are the expectations different?

This is a strange take. Like how Laf played in his D+1 half season makes how he is playing the last 25 games somehow less good. Weirdly, young players very often look 100 times better in the NHL AT 21 than they did at 18. They have ups and downs with the ups trending higher And more extended. That’s development, and remarking on it is not “recency bias.”

BTW its funny to see people get so defensive over someone sarcastically saying “bust amirite” while also saying they never said he was a bust. Okay. You never said that, so why is the comment rubbing y’all the wrong way? There have been folks who DID say he was abust, careeer bottom sixer/fourth liner, “trade him while we still can get ANYTHING for him,” etc. If you aren’t one of them, why take umbrage? Makes no sense. Hahah.

 

[Shadowtron]

“My opinion can change should he really breakout” lololol, just write “I’m impatient and want immediate results” and delete the rest

No because it really has nothing to do with impatience and has everything to do with my concern that he looked really really bad going halfway into year three. It wasn’t like he was playing an extraordinary level of skill out there.