Sparksrus3
NYI - THE TEAM WITH NO ❤️
- Jun 2, 2012
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I never asked for a favor . You make it seem like mat Barzal is the add to take a contract . Your op asked for center improvement and I gave it to you . Enjoy tonight defeat
Value of: A 2nd line center to Montreal.
- Thread starter GrandmaCookie
- Start date
Yeah it’s a pretty weird ask.
No I make it seem like a team who wants to be competitive isn’t going to take on a cap dump. It’s just stupid and unnecessary regardless of who else (a positive asset) is coming in that trade.
The bolded is just petty and immature
Habs Halifax
Loyal Habs Fan
Only two guys I would engage on trading for are Dobson and Horvat. Barzal skating and skill is very nice but the Habs need a different type of center IMO.
Habs Halifax
Loyal Habs Fan
What's the cost for Horvat?
* NHL pieces we can offer to offset cap are: Dach, Matheson, Newhook
* Futures are both our 1sts and prospects like Roy, Kapanen, Beck, Mailloux.
Islanders fans... Can you package something from this where you think you are getting the return you want? I would say 3 pieces. One NHL piece, One 1st, and one Prospect.
* NHL pieces we can offer to offset cap are: Dach, Matheson, Newhook
* Futures are both our 1sts and prospects like Roy, Kapanen, Beck, Mailloux.
Islanders fans... Can you package something from this where you think you are getting the return you want? I would say 3 pieces. One NHL piece, One 1st, and one Prospect.
miscs75
Registered User
- Jul 2, 2014
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There’s 3 pages about this. Islanders ask based on needs is too rich for Montreal and Montreal fans are convinced Horvat is too old. What the Islanders need if Horvat is moved is an overpayment in terms of quality, not quantity. There’s no reason to move him at the moment.
Habs Halifax
Loyal Habs Fan
This Habs fan does not think Horvat is too old but I'm not paying for a 80 pts center either (career numbers are prorated to 57 pts). Horvat is in 30+ years now and will decline a bit but I don't see that as massive drops.
Best offer I can do is Dach, one of our 1sts, and a prospect (one of Kapanen or Beck). If the Islanders insist on pieces like Reinbacher or Hage, I pass. I might consider Dach and both our 1sts. Too low? Sure, Habs can throw money at Duchene as our stop gap for when Hage might be ready. And we can use our picks to draft more C's and RD.
Curious to see what direction the Islanders want to take with their new GM. Do they want a retool or a rebuild. Probably retool?
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I’m not an Islanders fan but you are offering spare parts for a legit 2C in his prime.
miscs75
Registered User
- Jul 2, 2014
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Not interested in moving Horvat for a dump, 1st and mediocre prospect whose ceiling is a 3rd line forward. In terms of cap dumps alone, adding in a piece like Laine/Dach (both damaged goods and useless at this point) or Matheson (who’s not worth adding onto the roster) while having Engvall/Duclair/Mafield/Pelech all under contract with multiple years left just isn’t smart. Ideally if Horvat was to be moved out, the pieces would have to give the Islanders quality depth, not something that someone hopes will hit their ceiling.
miscs75
Registered User
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Habs Halifax
Loyal Habs Fan
I don't agree with your narrative.
Horvat is not in his prime anymore and he's heading in modest decline 30+ years. He is a career 57 pts center. He is great on faceoffs and is a bit gritty so there is value there. It's reasonable to assume some decline but I don't see it as being massive drops.
Dach is a NHL piece with potential still but struggling due to injuries. It's the NHL piece to offset cap and someone the Islanders can use if they do a retool or rebuild. In any trade the Islanders do, there will be a NHL piece coming back. If it's a 1/1
Mid 1st round picks are not spare parts. They are solid darts at acquiring a grade A prospect. If you keep talking like this is a spare part, you're reaching to justify a false narrative.
Beck, Kapanen, Roy, Mailloux are all very close to NHL ready. These are not spare parts we are just throwing out there with the mindset that they are nothing of any value. I'm pretty sure most Islanders fans have not followed them closely. Laval was a very good team this year and some of you fans need to put the "overrating prospects by the Habs" in the past. Things have changed.
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Captain97
Registered User
The fact that you can’t view the trade from both sides makes it impossible to discuss with you. It’s a bad proposal...period.
Horvat was traded fricking Beauvilier, Raty and top 12 protected 1st when he was 3 years younger. He's 30 y old now.
Let's not act like #16+17 are worst than that.
Islanders should take that and run.
Not sure who would give them more than that...
They clearly are heading toward a rebuild, their roster is old and they have no prospects/futures beside Ritchie and Eiserman.
And that’s why they’ll stay in no mans land for the foreseeable future
Habs Halifax
Loyal Habs Fan
No, it's just a simple disagreement where you think your narrative is a fact but it's really an opinion. It's an opinion debate and when a poster goes to this narrative and avoids context, it's disingenuous. Learn how to disagree with respect. It's not that hard. Too many of you are too quick with the "bad proposal...period and spare parts" narratives in your replies. Your spare parts narrative is a reach. Horvat is in 30+ years but still decent. 57 pts career center and I think you are just as guilty of pumping his value as you are with your "spare parts offer" narrative.
I can play your game if you want? I can spend energy to devalue Horvat in belittle narratives but what does that provide for us other than a stupid post war? Are we here to belittle others or talk with respectful context?
If it's a 1/1 swap, Habs are not in a position to engage on Horvat. If it's a 3 piece offer, it's not far off. You don't have to agree and I can accept that but spare me with your devalues on very solid prospects trending well and mid 1st round picks. Calling them spare parts is on you, not me. I stand firm on that but you will probably dwell on Dach
Can you find me a past trade where someone like Horvat was traded? Use this as your context to justify your angle? Someone signed from age 30-36 who is a secondary part (2C) and around the 60 pts for their career.
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Fine. When you find a single Islander fan who agrees to your proposal let me know. I'll be waiting. And, I repeat, I'm not an Islanders fan.
That's crazy talk, Barzal would be incredible in the Habs up tempo system. He scored 80 points last year playing under Patrick Roy / Lane Lambert.
A healthy Barzal would likely be the Habs leading scorer most seasons. He and Demidov would be an extremely dangerous duo.
Grinner
Registered User
- May 31, 2022
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Habs Halifax
Loyal Habs Fan
Again... you are looking at the popular bandwagon as what you believe as facts. That is not a conversation I am interested in.
I want more context than your usually reply of "spare parts or bad proposal". Mid 1st round picks and prospects tending well are not spare parts. Keep reaching
Habs Halifax
Loyal Habs Fan
A 57 pts career center in his prime from ages 30-36? Who are you guys trying to fool?
Horvat does have some value and teams will knock on the door but there is no desperation here where you get bidding wars.
Captain97
Registered User
I agree,
Having top 6 Duos of
Caufield - Suzuki
Barzal - Demidov
Would he excellent. Then plug and play Slafkovsky on one of those lines and one of Laine/Dach/Newhook on the other. Thats a formidable top 6.
And yet no one who isn't a Montreal fan agrees with you...hmmmm.
