GDT: 6 o'clock news - canes @ buffalo @ 6 o'clock

[TheBigLetowski]

How many games have the Canes lost because of shitty goaltending? Does the team see a softie go in and go into total shit house on the ice? That does bode great for the teams mental state, but expecting a healthy freddie was their first mistake. Also, the "2nd line" of ERob/KK/Necas has been a shell of itself. I'm sure many in here knew Necas was holding that up and his fall down to earth is evident.

 

[WreckingCrew]

How many games have the Canes lost because of shitty goaltending? Does the team see a softie go in and go into total shit house on the ice? That does bode great for the teams mental state, but expecting a healthy freddie was their first mistake. Also, the "2nd line" of ERob/KK/Necas has been a shell of itself. I'm sure many in here knew Necas was holding that up and his fall down to earth is evident.

Shitty goaltending was definitely a key factor in this one, but so is scoring only 2 goals (on 37 f***ing shots against a goalie with a <.900 sv%). Does it matter if he let in 2 softies or 10 softies if we can't score a f***ing goal?

 

[User13452]

Shitty goaltending was definitely a key factor in this one, but so is scoring only 2 goals (on 37 f***ing shots against a goalie with a <.900 sv%). Does it matter if he let in 2 softies or 10 softies if we can't score a f***ing goal?

You can still win games 2-1 and that’s what last night should have been 3 of the 4 goals had no business going in at the nhl level.

 

[the halleJOKEL]

also doesn't help that giving up these early soft goals allows the other team to sit back and clog the middle against us while chipping the puck out and not even really looking for more offense, a thing we have always struggled to overcome

 

[Blueline Bomber]

You can still win games 2-1 and that’s what last night should have been 3 of the 4 goals had no business going in at the nhl level.

Giving up a bad goal early doesn’t mean the team should just roll over and die. And that’s what tends to happen. Sure, blame the goalie for giving up the bad goal, but the attitude should be “Well, let’s get it back”, not “Game’s over, let’s take the rest of this period off.”

Especially when the team has overcome multiple goal deficits a couple times this season. Maybe doing that BEFORE the third period might win them a few more games

 

[Joe McGrath]

also doesn't help that giving up these early soft goals allows the other team to sit back and clog the middle against us while chipping the puck out and not even really looking for more offense, a thing we have always struggled to overcome

This is the crux of it. Giving up a goal on the first shot, unscreened from 25-30 feet out is instantly deflating. Same thing happened in the Minnesota game when they were ass from start to finish.

 

[hblueridgegal]

Jaccob Slavin was very direct post-game. After calling tonight "ugly hockey" and referencing the team's recent inconsistencies, he was asked if their stretch of up-and-down play surprises him: "It definitely surprises us. We're normally a team that competes every night. We're consistent. We have a chance to win every night. But lately, we haven't had chances to win every night. We're not helping ourselves by the way we play when we play like that. It's not good enough as a group. To a man, it's not good enough."

Is he saying that they are in a funk or have they come to the realization that perhaps they're not good enough anymore to rely on past strengths? This type of performance was not a one off. It's recurring and is almost at the two month point.

Comebacks also take up a lot of physical and emotional energy. Great for the 1 game but you often see teams flat the next one.

 

[AhosDatsyukian]

Is he saying that they are in a funk or have they come to the realization that perhaps they're not good enough anymore to rely on past strengths? This type of performance was not a one off. It's recurring and is almost at the two month point.

Comebacks also take up a lot of physical and emotional energy. Great for the 1 game but you often see teams flat the next one.

Tough to get a read on what he's getting at but I think he's saying the guys are getting lazy/complacent -- i.e. "not competing every night."

 

[hblueridgegal]

Tough to get a read on what he's getting at but I think he's saying the guys are getting lazy/complacent -- i.e. "not competing every night."

I wonder what's driving that behavior? The roster woes addressed as addressed upthread or something else?

It feels weird to say but they appear to lack an identity other than performing inconsistently.

 

[The Faulker 27]

It's not breaking news our goalies suck. I think they're just good enough to keep them with enough wins until Fragile Fredrick comes back. In other news are the Canes leading the league in giving up the first goal? Sure seems like it.

 

[chaz4hockey]

Right after being on IR for all of last season with a different issue.

We kind of deserve this, hopefully it wakes up the front office that moneypucking the goalie spot is a very unstable house of cards that we really don't want to get involved with.

Speaking of goalies....some organizations have been adapt at drafting good goalies....and getting one through the draft is the cost effective way to go.

Rangers, Nashville, Calgary are three organizations that come to mind that have been superb at the talent identification. Tulsky should figure out what they are doing to identify goalies that will succeed or ask Dundon to hire the scouts that are identifying the talent.

 

[Joe McGrath]

Speaking of goalies....some organizations have been adapt at drafting good goalies....and getting one through the draft is the cost effective way to go.

Rangers, Nashville, Calgary are three organizations that come to mind that have been superb at the talent identification. Tulsky should figure out what they are doing to identify goalies that will succeed or ask Dundon to hire the scouts that are identifying the talent.

Other than Wolf (who was a 7th round pick) the Flames haven’t drafted a goalie who became an NHL starter for anybody since Craig Anderson in 1999. The other two you mentioned certainly have a knack for it. But even the Rangers its probably dumb luck. The 6 goalies they’ve picked since Shesterkin (who they picked 60 picks after a different goalie) have 1 NHL game played and the 6 before that were nobodies and Al Montoya who was a #6 overall pick who amounted to very little more than a below average backup.

 

[WreckingCrew]

This is the crux of it. Giving up a goal on the first shot, unscreened from 25-30 feet out is instantly deflating. Same thing happened in the Minnesota game when they were ass from start to finish.

While it definitely is deflating, you have like 55 f***ing minutes to pick up your balls and get back in the game...even a goal on the 1st shot in the 1st minute should not be the end of the game. Buffalo is a bottom 5 team with 3.4 GAA (6th worst GA in the league). It's a pitiful excuse...If the team is that mentally fragile there's a major problem.

 

[chaz4hockey]

Other than Wolf (who was a 7th round pick) the Flames haven’t drafted a goalie who became an NHL starter for anybody since Craig Anderson in 1999. The other two you mentioned certainly have a knack for it. But even the Rangers its probably dumb luck. The 6 goalies they’ve picked since Shesterkin (who they picked 60 picks after a different goalie) have 1 NHL game played and the 6 before that were nobodies and Al Montoya who was a #6 overall pick who amounted to very little more than a below average backup.

Once you have a franchise goalie it doesn't matter if your picks stale a bit.

Rangers: Vanbiesbrouck-Richter-Lundquist-Shesterkin....that is unbelievably good draft set of goalies
Calgary: modify to suggest their talent ID for good goalies is superb as Markstrom, Vladar, Wolf are a combo worth noting.
Nashville: Rinne-Saros-Askarov

I'd add, Canadians used to draft/identify great goalies too until their management took the franchise into the abyss.

 

[Joe McGrath]

Once you have a franchise goalie it doesn't matter if your picks stale a bit.

Rangers: Vanbiesbrouck-Richter-Lundquist-Shesterkin....that is unbelievably good draft set of goalies
Calgary: modify to suggest their talent ID for good goalies is superb as Markstrom, Vladar, Wolf are a combo worth noting.
Nashville: Rinne-Saros-Askarov

I'd add, Canadians used to draft/identify great goalies too until their management took the franchise into the abyss.

Not for nothing - Jim Rutherford drafted two Conn Smythe winning goalies with this franchise. And he couldn’t idenitify any other goaltending talent if it punched him in the face.

This isn’t a counter point, i just find it hilarious.

 

[AhosDatsyukian]

I wonder what's driving that behavior? The roster woes addressed as addressed upthread or something else?

It feels weird to say but they appear to lack an identity other than performing inconsistently.

Maybe this is just me being hopeful as a fan but I honestly think at least for the core guys the biggest thing driving that is after years of being an elite regular season team and coming up short in the playoffs the guys just aren't that motivated to try hard in the regular season. Watching us this year reminds me of the Bolts in the regular season the year after the Blue Jackets upset them. There is something to pacing yourself for the playoffs, both an individual level and on the team level. NHL isn't as bad as the MLB or NBA in terms of regular season games not really mattering but it's pretty darn close. This isn't the NFL where every single regular season game holds huge importance (at least until the final week some years where seeds could be clinched already).

Also, some perspective is important. These last few months have sucked to watch and we've definitely underperformed. But we're still 10th in the league, same exact record as defending champ Panthers. And that is with the context of our goaltending struggling, which could easily fix itself later in the year with Freddie coming back and/or Pyotr getting hot. We've seen Pyotr have average stretches like this in the past and still then go on a run so I'm not counting that out this year yet. Much rather see him struggle now than in April/May/June.

With more focus/motivation and better goaltending I think we'd easily still be a top 3-5 team like we were to start the year before the recent struggles. And that is with this year being a retooling/refresh year for the team. The hot start caused a lot of people to adjust their expectations back to what they have been the last few years but the offseason was very clear to me that this year was about setting up future sustained success, not trying to win it all this year. I still maintain winning a playoff round this season would be a huge success and make this a good season. Anything more is gravy and even just making the playoffs and losing a close first round wouldn't be all that bad with everything considered. Next year expectations go up again with Nikishin along with the cap space and assets we're sitting on to make moves.

 

[Nikolajs Sillers]

win or we riot

Riot it is then.

 

[Svechhammer]

also doesn't help that giving up these early soft goals allows the other team to sit back and clog the middle against us while chipping the puck out and not even really looking for more offense, a thing we have always struggled to overcome

This!

Against both Anaheim and Buffalo the early bad goal against caused the opposing defense to just muck up everything in front of their net, and we don't have players who are really willing to dig in and work the puck into high danger shooting spots and just instead pump low danger shots in from outside the faceoff circles. We end up with 40 or so shots on net and barely anything to show for it.

Which has pretty much been the book on us under Rod. It's not a limitation of his system, we just don't have enough players willing to put their bodies on the line to brute force an ugly goal.

 

[MyLuckyPuck]

Reminds me of the Pre-Eric Staal draft season where we went first to worst. It seemed like every darn first shot went in on Irbe that year. And the Darling season. Obviously not to the same degree as either of those seasons but making a comparison of the deflating-ness. It’s tough to go back to that well over and over.

 

[User13452]

While it definitely is deflating, you have like 55 f***ing minutes to pick up your balls and get back in the game...even a goal on the 1st shot in the 1st minute should not be the end of the game. Buffalo is a bottom 5 team with 3.4 GAA (6th worst GA in the league). It's a pitiful excuse...If the team is that mentally fragile there's a major problem.

They did start to play better towards the end of the first period but the other goalie is allowed to make saves I guess we just aren’t use to seeing that often. But then the second goal goes in from just inside the blue line on a wrist shot it deflates the team even more

 

[AD Skinner]

Maybe this is just me being hopeful as a fan but I honestly think at least for the core guys the biggest thing driving that is after years of being an elite regular season team and coming up short in the playoffs the guys just aren't that motivated to try hard in the regular season. Watching us this year reminds me of the Bolts in the regular season the year after the Blue Jackets upset them. There is something to pacing yourself for the playoffs, both an individual level and on the team level. NHL isn't as bad as the MLB or NBA in terms of regular season games not really mattering but it's pretty darn close. This isn't the NFL where every single regular season game holds huge importance (at least until the final week some years where seeds could be clinched already).

Also, some perspective is important. These last few months have sucked to watch and we've definitely underperformed. But we're still 10th in the league, same exact record as defending champ Panthers. And that is with the context of our goaltending struggling, which could easily fix itself later in the year with Freddie coming back and/or Pyotr getting hot. We've seen Pyotr have average stretches like this in the past and still then go on a run so I'm not counting that out this year yet. Much rather see him struggle now than in April/May/June.

With more focus/motivation and better goaltending I think we'd easily still be a top 3-5 team like we were to start the year before the recent struggles. And that is with this year being a retooling/refresh year for the team. The hot start caused a lot of people to adjust their expectations back to what they have been the last few years but the offseason was very clear to me that this year was about setting up future sustained success, not trying to win it all this year. I still maintain winning a playoff round this season would be a huge success and make this a good season. Anything more is gravy and even just making the playoffs and losing a close first round wouldn't be all that bad with everything considered. Next year expectations go up again with Nikishin along with the cap space and assets we're sitting on to make moves.

This is where I’m at too. It’s obvious the games they care about: Florida, NYR, the devils. It’s also pretty obvious the games they don’t